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XBox (Games) Hardware

Water Cooling an Xbox 360 213

Posted by Zonk from the because-we-can dept.
An anonymous reader writes "HardOCP has done it once again. They have an article running down the process of water cooling an Xbox 360, and with surprising effectiveness and remarkable styling." From the article: "We had plans to water cool an Xbox 360 for over a year now. Little did we know that not only will this water cooling project be more fun than the original, but it may even be practical. Imagine that. With reports of heat related issues and a heat sink that can get almost too hot to touch after marathon gaming sessions, the Xbox 360 water cooling project now had a sense of purpose. We bought a retail Xbox 360 specifically for this project. The minute we got it back to the [H] labs we tore into it and, with a little help from the fine folks at Koolance, we have put together a water cooling solution that will handle anything the Xbox 360 can throw at it and literally knock your socks off." Actual implimentation with hand-holding. Hexus.net was discussing a kit to do this a few days ago.
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Water Cooling an Xbox 360 More

Water Cooling an Xbox 360

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  • Some other crazy ideas (Score:5, Insightful)

    by jaygatsby27 ( 894445 ) * on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:48PM (#14387923) Homepage
    How about a small fan or maybe, just maybe, not shoving the whole thing into a tiny space with no ventilation.

  • Cooling (Score:3, Funny)

    by rfinnvik ( 16122 ) * on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:50PM (#14387942)
    The standard 360 cooler uses liquid to transfer heat more efficiently from the CPU/GPU afaik. Maybe in the next revision they should consider taking this idea further and add a radiator and pump... :)

    • Re:Cooling (Score:5, Funny)

      by Admiral Frosty ( 919523 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:55PM (#14387989) Homepage
      I can only imagine what might go wrong with Microsoft putting water-cooling in a major console. They failed a simple power brick...

      • Re:Cooling (Score:4, Insightful)

        by RzUpAnmsCwrds ( 262647 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @08:18PM (#14388888)
        They failed a simple power brick...

        Typical Slashdot piss-on-Microsoft attitude. Microsoft likely had no part in designing the power brick; for one, they don't have the expertise to design an active-PFC swtiched-mode high-wattage power supply.

        Now, we can certainly fault Microsoft for not testing their vendor's product sufficently, but the fact is that 95% of XBOX 360s are chugging along perfectly fine.

        • Re:Cooling (Score:5, Insightful)

          by rseuhs ( 322520 ) on Wednesday January 04, 2006 @05:19AM (#14390898)
          Typical Slashdot piss-on-Microsoft attitude. Microsoft likely had no part in designing the power brick;

          Typical Microsoft-fanboyism.

          The moment Microsoft puts any component into a box that has the label "Microsoft" on it, they are responsible.

          Yeah, I know, for the typical "it's not Microsoft's fault" - apologist, reponsibility is a strange and alien concept.

          But essentially it comes down to this:

          It doesn't matter wether Microsoft had a part in designing the power brick.

          They are responsible to make sure the thing works. Yes, that means if some supplier screwed up it's still Microsoft's repsonsibility to do some minimal quality control so that the broken units don't get shipped.

          • If you had bothered to actually read my post rather than label me a "Microsoft-fanboy" based on a single quote, then you would realize that I acknowledged Microsoft's responsibility to ensure that they ship a quality product. Indeed, everything in the XBOX 360 was manufactured by someone other than Microsoft.

            However, my post stands - while you can fault Microsoft for shipping a poor PSU, the grandparent's point that Microsoft can't be trusted because they cannot design a power supply is simply incorrect. If

    • sad (Score:4, Informative)

      by mj2k ( 726937 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @07:37PM (#14388662)
      it's sad that after all the hype, MS seemingly ignored such a basic component as verifying that internal components remain within thermal limits. I should be able to leave my xbox 360 on overnight without having to worry about it overheating, and I shouldn't have to resort to water-cooling the 360 to ensure it operates properly. Props to those who got this to work, but a user who spends 300+ bucks on a console shouldn't have to make the choice of voiding their warranty (and spending extra to put a cooling sys together) in order to keeep their 360 operating within thermal specs, or risk overheating and failure in the future. MS never seems to quite get it, they made a _huge_ deal pre-release about the chassis being smaller and more attractive (especially those stupid swappable front covers), yet all the hardcore gamers I know would prefer a stable system with great performance to an attractive POS that overheats when you leave it running overnight.

      • Re:sad (Score:4, Insightful)

        by DeadScreenSky ( 666442 ) on Wednesday January 04, 2006 @03:09AM (#14390515)
        I should be able to leave my xbox 360 on overnight without having to worry about it overheating, and I shouldn't have to resort to water-cooling the 360 to ensure it operates properly.

        You can and you don't. Seriously, don't believe everything you read (including this, I guess).
  • The editor beat all of us to the punch by pre-empting our cries of "Dupe!".
  • You know, I have a grim admiration of anyone that would devote so much time to water cooling an x-box. I only hope that the people with such time and talent do not devote their energies to darker activities. Today, those guys are cooling x-box 360s, but tomorrow, they'll be working on nuclear weapons, writing spyware, or working on Windows, depending on which pays the most.

  • sigh.... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Quick Sick Nick ( 822060 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:54PM (#14387977)
    Why do modders always go compete ape shit over stupid stuff like this? I have an Xbox 360 and it works. It just works. No it doesn't have water cooling. I also did case mod it, and it still works! Yes, some people have had problems. Just don't put the power supply in a bad place and you'll be fine. Water cooling for PC's may make sense because there are different types of PC's. Right now an Xbox 360 is just a 360, and if you follow instructions and have a bit of common sense, you'll be fine. It either plays the game or it doesn't. A water cooling system isn't just unecessary, it's stupid.

    • Re:sigh.... (Score:3, Insightful)

      by JonN ( 895435 ) *
      Next time please RTFA and you will see that the guys over at HardOCP agree. Here you go, since you seem too lazy to learn about what you are commenting on:

      "Four years ago next month we built the world's first water cooled Xbox. At the time, a lot of people asked us why we would want to water cool an Xbox, mostly because they didn't understand the motivation behind it. The fact of the matter was that the standard heat sink on the 700MHz Intel processor would barely get hot under normal use and surely didn'

    • Re:sigh.... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by pavera ( 320634 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @06:10PM (#14388106) Homepage Journal
      "it just works"
      then you go on to qualify your it just works statement by saying you have to put the power supply in a "good" place...
      This is a piece of consumer electronics. Do you consider a DVD player to be broken if you have to lay the cables in just the right way?
      What about a TV? Heck even a computer, switch, or router? I can't believe you're defending the xbox 360. Having to pay attention to where cables/exhaust fans are located on a piece of consumer electronics is unacceptable.
      • First, I don't think there is a real overheating problem. My 360 that I got on release day sits in a closed component rack. No heat problems. The power brick is on the carpet under a nice layer of cables like all the others. No heat problems.

        I think some people got some defective units which MS is fixing. They are doing more than I've seen any other consumer electronic company do by overnighting boxes and paying shipping both ways.

        As for other devices... Most modern computers can't be put in a closed
      • i don't know why you'd even bother trying to argue with this clown (the GP)... some people get doing things cuz they're cool to do, and some people don't so much... some folks like to use stuff, and some folks would rather tinker a bit... the GP isn't likely to be a coder either, i'd guess (although i'm really curious if that guess is right or not)... i think this is mostly a personality-type thing
      • Actually...

        Exhaust clearance is something that people who own component audio systems have had in the back of their mind for a couple dozen years now. Just because you haven't heard of it doesn't mean it's a new phenominon.

        If you find yourself worked up into a frothing tizzy over the fact that you can't hide your power supply under your oven while you're baking shit and expect proper operation, you have no right to own a console.

        Word.
      • This is a piece of consumer electronics. Do you consider a DVD player to be broken if you have to lay the cables in just the right way?

        Does a DVD player have 500+ million logic transistors? A high-clocked triple-core PowerPC CPU and a high-clocked ATI GPU?

        High-end computers use lots of power. They have for some time now. You would never put a high-end gaming PC in an enclosed space.

        The XBOX 360 manual makes it abundantly clear that the system needs ventilation. Certainly, some of the problems have been caus
      • Have you ever met a true audiophile? The performance of their systems is not only directly proportional to the cables used, but they also have to lay the cables the "right" way, isolate the room the "right" way, load media the "right" way. Heck, for a lot of them even the power supplied in your perfectly fine wall outlet is just NOT GOOD ENOUGH and causing nausea.

        Now, does this rings a bell to you? ;)
        • That all falls under "esoteric belief", nothing else. The system is not "broken" in any way if you ignore everything you listed and it will actually make no audible difference. (except isolating the room the right way and setting the boxes in correct positions, that does make a difference - but special cables and power supplies is just esoteric nonsense bordering fraud.)
          • You did read the lay the cables the "right" way right?

            What if you lay a audio cables next to a florescent light, run them parallel to AC lines, or run the across the floor on top of the carpet. Each example in this list has varying amounts of static which but include what to avoid in order to run it the "right" way. I can assure you that putting the boxes in the right place will not negate the effect of the static from poor placement of the cables. You would be better to do it "right" instead of looking a
      • I've had problems with many pieces of consumer equipment. Cable boxes and satellite receivers especially get very hot if you don't put them where they can get ventilation. Had the same problem with certain VCRs and DVD players and TiVO-type things. Also many component stereo systems, if you cross certain wires can give you literally shit sound, not just to audiophiles. And you have to let the amp and sometimes receiver in a stereo system have ventilation depending on the power usage.

        Anything can be slightly
    • Unmodded, the temperature after a couple of hours of Quake 4 was ~150F. With watter cooling it got to ~100F. Such a dramatic change in temperature can greatly increase the lifetime of the system.

      XBOX360 is an awesome gaming platform, but it's pretty clear that the first version is doing poorly power- and cooling-wise.

      • That's only 65 degress celcius. Which isn't really that hot. I don't think that a chip running at that temp would have any problems in the long run. PC processors run at that temp all the time. It might feel a little hot to the touch, but nothing metal, silicon and other chip materials shouldn't be able to handle.
        • Take a closer look:

          With stock Xbox 360 cooling, after an hour of Quake 4, the back of the motherboard temperature was 150.8F ( 66C ).

          The temperatures on the electronic components themselves is higher than that (most notably CPU and GPU, but other components also create heat)

          It looks like XBox360 is designed at the limit of all components (even the power brick) and one small "issue" can put it over the edge. (And "issue" can mean anything from user error to dust collecting)

    • Re:sigh.... (Score:4, Funny)

      by balthan ( 130165 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @08:16PM (#14388881)
      isn't just unecessary, it's stupid.

      Welcome to slashdot, you must be new here.
    • I'm sorry, you'll have to turn in your geek card now.

  • 40 lashes with a dictionary (Score:5, Funny)

    by Dun Malg ( 230075 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:55PM (#14387986) Homepage
    we have put together a water cooling solution that will handle anything the Xbox 360 can throw at it and literally knock your socks off.

    I fail to see how a water cooling system would do any sock-knocking. I guess they don't actually know what the word literally means (hint: it isn't a superlative nor does it simply add emphasis).

    • You've obviously never had an Xbox360 fall on you. (Score:5, Funny)

      by TubeSteak ( 669689 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @06:05PM (#14388080) Journal
      I had one fall on my leg.

      It ripped my flesh to the bone, knocked my sock off, broke my big toe and killed my cat.

      damn you Microsoft
      DAMN YOU
      • >>I had one fall on my leg.

        >>It ripped my flesh to the bone, knocked my sock off, broke my big toe and killed my cat.

        This spells doom for Micro$oft, doom Doom DOOM dOOm!!! As soon as the public is aware that the XBox360 is causing severe lascerations, minor fractures and feline fatalities it's the end of the road for Micro$oft.

        Don't buy the marketing hype that it's a large scale release of a complex consumer product, the occaisonal dead cat is expected and unavoidable, and that these are all var
    • I fail to see how a water cooling system would do any sock-knocking. I guess they don't actually know what the word literally means
      Yeah, but maybe it's for the best, I mean, who would buy this thing if the advertising copy said it would "figuratively knock your socks off".
    • Perhaps there is an upcoming adaptor for the 360 that gives it very powerful cybernetic arms that can throw things at the water cooling system hard enough to send shockwaves rippling through space and time, waves that will go back through history to the point where you were about to put on your socks and slap you upside your head, making you say "Huh? What was that?" and thus distracting you from your sock donning, thus not only essentially knocking your socks off, but erasing from all existence any memory
    • (hint: it isn't a superlative nor does it simply add emphasis)

      Sounds like those people who complain about using the word "really." They conveniently forget about the word "very", which comes from the same root as Latin veritas, "truth", and its English derivatives (e.g., verify).

      Very, really, truly, literally (according to the meaning in the words), honestly, indeed (= in deed), etc. all mean rougly the same thing: in actuality. The difference is how acceptable they are when used as an intensifier.

      And at le
    • I am reminded of the great wisdom of David Cross:

      "Dude, it was so funny I literally shit my pants!"

      "Well, what did you do?"

      "What do you mean, dude? I was laughing..."

      "I mean, what did you do with your shitty pants?"

      "No, dude, I didn't REALLY shit my pants, I LITERALLY shit my pants!"

  • Bad Design (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    A game console that benefits from being water cooled, have its power supply dangled from a string, and can't even be slightly moved while there is a disk inside smacks of terrible industrial design. This is not a console, it's an unweildy, ill-conceived, ill-executed beast that seems to actually hate its users.

    People say Apple users blindly ignore any and all flaws with Apple products, but Apple users have nothing on XBox fanboys. The thing could spew out radioactive mist and they'd still be forgiving Mic

  • *Literally* Knock My Socks Off, eh? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by venomkid ( 624425 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:55PM (#14387992)
    With what, water pressure?

    *grumblegrumble*

  • Aww... (Score:4, Funny)

    by Psykus ( 827143 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:56PM (#14388003)
    "With reports of heat related issues and a heat sink that can get almost too hot to touch after marathon gaming sessions.."

    I just love touching the heatsink after a good session of gaming, and now I can't with the Xbox 360; I gotta get this product now!

  • Cooling the wrong components? (Score:4, Informative)

    by Hunter-Killer ( 144296 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:57PM (#14388010)
    It's the PSU that overheats, causing the majority of recent problems.

    But hey, if you'd rather spend ~180 on a water cooling system instead of not stuffing the power block deep inside a cabinet, more power to you. ;)
  • They hook the hs/waterblocks up in series. So the hot fluid from the first processor is attempting to cool the second processor.

    This seems a bit scary to me. The processors really get that hot, then shooting the exhaust fluid from one over the other isn't going to do as much good as they might expect.

    Still, awsome bit of home engineering.
  • What is preventing a console or even a computer manufacturer from including water cooling themselves? Is there not a way to cheaply and safely mass produce it?

  • Koolance Commercial (Score:4, Interesting)

    by eander315 ( 448340 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @05:59PM (#14388029)
    They used all Koolance products throughout, with no discussion at all about why they used those particular parts when several other better ones are available. This really doesn't seem that useful anyway unless you pipe the water through the power supply. Even the most intrepid of the PC water cooling community are wary of doing that.
  • we have put together a water cooling solution that will handle anything the Xbox 360 can throw at it and literally knock your socks off.

    Thanks, but I prefer cooling systems that do not explode or otherwise interact with the users clothing in a violent manner.

    Though, I must admit, a device that can disrobe the user does have potential for porn.....
  • Wow, the authors command of english literally knocks my socks off!!

  • Even the geeks are lawyers now (Score:3, Interesting)

    by geekwithsoul ( 860466 ) <geekwithsoul@yEI ... minus physicist> on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @06:03PM (#14388069)

    From the site:

    " (Warning! Any mod that requires removing the cover of your new $400 game console voids your warranty. Period. The use of tools such as pliers, screwdrivers, and power drills within close proximity of the internal components of your Xbox 360 can result in user error that could ultimately render you console inoperative. It goes without saying that [H]ardOCP assumes no responsibility for any damage that may occur to you or your Xbox 360 if you attempt this mod on your own. Having said that, all the cool kids are doing it.)

    If "it goes without saying," why say it at all?

    • The presumption is that some people are much stupider than they would first appear. No doubt the same reasoning behind the bright red label on my blow dryer's line cord: "WARN CHILDREN OF THE RISK OF DEATH". Of course, it leaves open what the actual cause of death might be ... a particularly thickheaded individual might think that simply drying one's hair could be fatal. Probably it's just a disclaimer that their legal staff makes them include, although the fact that such disclaimers are considered necessar
    • If "it goes without saying," why say it at all?

      because frivolous lawsuits are as American as apple pie, that's why. Five lines will save you years of headache, not all of us can afford to reply to emails the same way Anakata [thepiratebay.org] does...

    • "If "it goes without saying," why say it at all?"

      Likewise, "within close proximity." The word proximity means "The state, quality, sense, or fact of being near or next; closeness."

  • SWEET (Score:2, Funny)

    by Mad Ogre ( 564694 )
    I'm now inspired to water cool my GAME BOY ADVANCED! Next will be my Texas Instuments Calculator and Timex Expedition digital watch! Water Cooling makes everything better.
  • I mean this is a game console, yes? Does it smell like ozone? Is the case getting hot? Does it need a case fan that moves a 1000cfm? What exactly is it 'throwing' at the design? I understand "just because it's there to do" projects, but what's the point here? Does it run that much hotter than the underlying PC hardware it is?

  • Armchair engineering (Score:4, Insightful)

    by SuperBanana ( 662181 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @06:33PM (#14388273)
    With reports of heat related issues and a heat sink that can get almost too hot to touch after marathon gaming sessions

    If 'almost too hot to touch' is below the specs for the processor's operating temperature range...it doesn't matter how hot it feels to the user.

    It never ceases to amaze me how people with no training will second-guess the basic competency of others with degrees in their field. Yes, the power supply gets too hot if placed on a rug...but that doesn't mean the xbox itself isn't designed properly. Probably just means that they didn't do a lot of testing in people's homes with the bricks on rugs and such; from what I understand, the problem is pretty rare even if you don't "cool" the brick.

    I also love the egotistical "we drive 'em hard" implied in the "marathon gaming" bits- as if they're HARDCORE users who STRESS the xbox beyond its limits. I guarantee Microsoft had units running benchmarks/game demos for WEEKS at a time doing burn-in...

    • Whilst they may be below their maximum operating temp, some electical components age badly with heat.

      Processors will undergo electromigration much more rapidly, and electrolytic capacitors will dry out. Both will significantly shorten the life of a console.
    • If 'almost too hot to touch' is below the specs for the processor's operating temperature range...it doesn't matter how hot it feels to the user.

      First, I have to mention the obvious. The heatsink is going to be COOLER than the processor itself. (That's the whole reason it works as a heat sink.) If the heatsink is below the maximum temp for the processor it doesn't actually mean you're safe. Without knowing the thermal resistances for everything, you simply cannot say whether you're safe or not. Especi [intel.com]
  • watercooling the power supply? :P

  • They way I see it silicon chip technology is hitting a wall. The wall is heat.

    Back in the day, chips like these processors today would be dreams. It's amazing how certain dreams never succeed and amazing things never dreamt become reality. The Internet was not dreamt, but it has come. The flying car does not exist in the practically and computer chips are doing nightmarish speeds. The same happens with large cities.

    Most cities are not designed to become large. the result is extremely tight roads and impra

  • We used:
    Two GPU-180-L06 video/GPU water blocks (link)
    One HX-360 radiator (link)
    One Control Board (link)
    One 120mm fan (link)
    One LED display panel (link)
    12ft of 3/8" hose
    Standard 110v to 12v wall adapter

    Now one has to consider if the time spent building and the cost of these materials could be more cheaply and easily reproduced by buying a compact refrigerator and drilling holes in it for the wiring?

    You would just need a drill and one of these: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009WNP [amazon.com]
    • This is not an uncommon comment. However, consider that most fridges have to work very hard to keep even lukewarm contents cool. The fridge that you linked to would burn out with a "warm" object inside of it because the thermostat would be running the refridgeration cycle continuously due to the heat given off by the xbox.

  • Liquid cooling should provide less noise (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Cardcaddy ( 854733 ) on Tuesday January 03, 2006 @08:46PM (#14389044)
    If you own a Xbox 360 you will quickly realize how loud the two case fans are. The liquid cooling modification if done properly will make a huge difference in the noise level provided you can remove, replace, or slow down the stock fans.
  • Gawd, I literally hate it when people misuse the word "literally"...

    (socks not withstanding)
  • .. and become a "review" site, so I can get free crap and attempt to destro-- I mean, improve it.
  • Lazy bastards, grab some ammonia and a compression pump and do this right. (It's funny. Laugh.)
  • Nothing but a publicity stunt.

    The only part of the Xbox360 that overheats is the power brick. The console itself does not overheat.
  • *Tosses XBox360 in harbour*

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