Gaming Skills Directly Linked to Surgical Skills

Orinthe writes "According to Reuters, a new study involving 33 surgeons at a New York hospital shows 'a strong correlation between video game skills and a surgeon's capabilities'. A statement by the senior author of the study even suggests the use of video games as a training tool for surgeons. Another of the study's authors cautions parents to curb excessive gaming, however: 'spending that much time playing video games is not going to help their child's chances of getting into medical school'."

Sweet

[gQuigs]

New job opportunities for me.. and I haven't even taken bio.

Re:Sweet

[flyingsquid]

Here's a tip. The cheat code for open heart surgery is" up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B, A, Start. Also, there's a power-up hidden behind the left aorta.

Re:

[gEvil (beta)]

Power up? What they really need to know is where the extra life is hidden.

Re:

[revlayle]

It gives you 30 lives already... an extra one is just being greedy!

I knew it

[Masami Eiri]

Trauma Center really is a training sim. When GUILT appears, there will be legions of gamers, ready to fight it.

Re:I knew it

[UbuntuDupe]

I can see it now:

"Sir, we've been looking for someone like you for ages! Trauma Center was really just a way of finding who was best equipped to operate against G.U.I.L.T. Your Nintendo Wii reported your results. You are the top player. We need you to join the fight with us."
"Um, the 80s called. They want their sci-fi plots back."

Re:

[CaseyB]

"Um, the 80s called. They want their sci-fi plots back."

Ok, how about a different one, then:

You've actually been remotely operating on real people the whole time!

Re:

[zeropointburn]

"Um, Ender called, and he doesn't think that's funny..."

Anyway, what's the big surprise that activities requiring hand-eye coordination improve actual hand-eye coordination? Granted, some games would be better than others... It's also good to see some actual research in this regard...

Re:

[gEvil (beta)]

Just what we need--doctors who wonder why time doesn't slow down when they make a star shape with their scalpel...

Re:

[SYSS Mouse]

...Because surgeons are not known for drawing good, so the prayer of Caduceus was not answered and Healing Touch was not activated.

Problems with the methodology

[scheme]

The criticism that was also given after the article raises from valid points. Mainly whether the "mistakes" that were being counted have any effect on the clinical outcome and whether the the speed of the fastest surgeons indicate better skills or whether it indicated that they were not thinking of the test as a video game and not as a simulation of a procedure on a person.

Not the only problem with this study...

[ssummer]

One important point that I think the article and the critique fails to mention is the claim that laparoscopic skill trainers (and by extension video games) decrease intra-op complications/deaths. The author sites two previous articles that define the objective measures of laparoscopic skill which are tested by these trainers but it has yet to be proven whether improving these objective measures has any outcome at all on operative outcomes/complication rates.

So essentially they proved that video games improv

So no great surprise then

[RogueyWon]

Children who participate in an activity that encourages fine motor controls, a steady hand, spatial awareness, the ability to assimilate new information rapidly and a requirement to perform under pressure in an actual win/lose environment (increasingly rare both in schools and in more traditional orgnised childhood pursuits) tend to increase their aptitutde for a profession that requires the same skills. At the same time, children who focus on said activity to the exclusion of all else put themselves at a big disadvantage.

Not exactly surprising, is it?

With games, as with everything else, the key message is always moderation. A 16-hours-a-day World of Warcraft addict is no more suited to be a surgeon than a steroidally enhanced jock, but just as a measure of sporting prowess can be helpful for some career paths, so the skills you learn from gaming can be of use elsewhere.

really doesn't say anything useful

[kpharmer]

ok, so the test examined *correlation* between gaming skills and:
"Laparoscopy and related surgeries involve manipulating instruments through a small incision or body opening where the surgeon's movements are guided by watching a television screen."

What's not clear:
1. if there is causation (games improved some skills) - do each activity just attract slightly obsessive individuals that happen to do best at each profession?
2. if just as much benefit could be gained from a few hours a week of using a mouse - so

A quick question

[Anonymous Coward]

From the article:

Out of 33 surgeons from Beth Israel Medical Center in New York that participated in the study, the nine doctors who had at some point played video games at least three hours per week made 37 percent fewer errors, performed 27 percent faster, and scored 42 percent better in the test of surgical skills than the 15 surgeons who had never played video games before.

Time for some basic math: 9 + 15 = 24. The study had 33 participants. Where are the other 9 doctors? Why aren't they mentionned?

Re:

[Xaositecte]

least three hours per week

who had never played video games before.

---

There is still some room for variation between those qualifiers. Perhaps the ones who had played, but not for at least three hours a week, were not statistically significant.

Re:

[drsquare]

Surgery requires a steady hand and precise movements, computer games let you clumsily hold the controller and just mash the buttons.

And you can't do surgery via trial and error.

Oh come now

[ObiWanStevobi]

Rueters is a Wii astroturfing organization and this is just a thinly veiled Trauma ER marketing atttmept. (yes, I'm kidding)

AP is the more likely Nintendo astroturfer

[tepples]

Rueters is a Wii astroturfing organization

I would think Associated Press, which is probably Reuters' biggest competitor, would be more likely to spread Nintendo astroturf, given that News Channel on Wii is just an AP feed.

Re:

[ObiWanStevobi]

Yeah, I was just kidding. Both gaming and surgery require hand-eye cooridnation and the ability to continue to act thoughtfully under pressure, so the study isn't that unbelievable. But when you see an article trying to create a positive link between gaming and surgery, one can't help but think of Trauma Center, since it is one of the most popular Wii eclusives.

Re:

[SYSS Mouse]

You forgot Trauma Center: Under the Knife for DS. Trauma Center: Second Opinion is a remake for Wii.

Trauma Center

[wilgibson]

Maybe all that time I spend in front of Trauma Center is a good thing!

Could be good...

[i_should_be_working]

..could be bad. [xkcd.com]

Re:

[MeanderingMind]

I was waiting for someone to do the obvious and post the VGCats comic, but you have broken the mold.

As has someone else a few posts below you.

I salute you.

Arrgh

[koreaman]

Have the media still not figured out that correlation does not necessarily imply causation?

Re:

[niconorsk]

Maybe they have. Maybe they haven't. They also realize that if they were to use that distinction to decide whether to print a science story or not, most science stories wouldn't be printed.

Re:

[IntergalacticWalrus]

Have the media still not figured out that correlation does not necessarily imply causation?

No, they follow the teachings of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

xkcd

[dyefade]

Finally, an excuse to post this xkcd strip:
http://xkcd.com/c218.html [xkcd.com]

Re:

[Chapter80]

Bummer for you, someone beat ya to it!

Re:

[dyefade]

Gah! yeah, look at the times. I even searched to make sure!

Moo

[Chacham]

Can someone say ISTP (or ISFP)?

Sheesh, this is news? Meyers Briggs could have told you this in the 40s-60s, Keirsey from 70-90s. It's a personality type, that's all.

Groovy.

[Rob T Firefly]

I'm in favor of surgeons gaming in their spare time, so long as my surgeon is fully aware that I don't have a reset button or a save state.

Re:

[antdude]

And a cheat option.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

Or a re-spawn point

Re:

[Walt Dismal]

Nothing is scarier than hearing your surgeon mutter "Head shot!" under his mask as you sink into anesthesia.

Reinforcing what we already know

[oldwindways]

It seems that this is just reinforcing what has already been shown in the past. Video games or computer simulations have been used for decades to train pilots and soldiers. It only stands to reason that a profession which requires one to carry out a complex series of precise actions, as well as make decisions in a rapidly evolving environment (since just about anything can go wrong in surgery) could be aided through the use of video games.

I for one...

[ProppaT]

I for one welcome our new, Mountain Dew and Cool Ranch Dorito consuming, surgical overlords!

robots wil turn surgery into real life video games

[teh_chrizzle]

i work for a surgical research center and minimally invasive robotic surgery will change everything. we use da vincis [brown.edu] to do proofs of concept on cadavers and live animals, and the technology is no where near ready for prime time, but the possibilities are really cool.

the control console and the robot don't have to be in the same place, so it will be possible to perform surgery with the patient in a completely sterile field without all the people that are usually necessary in a traditional OR. the graspers are currently the size of a finger and are articulated like a wrist, so doctors have greater range of motion in smaller spaces (smaller incisions mean less risk of infections, less pain, and faster recovery times). it will also be possible to perform surgery remotely (telemedicine) which is ideal for military and disaster relief scenarios. nasa is interested in telesurgery for space missions where it's not always possible to turn around and go back. it will also be possible to have a surgery mentored remotely by an expert (telementoring) so developing countries can get better access to advanced medicine.

Re:robots wil turn surgery into real life video ga

[AndresCP]

I believe that the Da Vinci machines are being used in some limited settings on regular human patients. Specifically, my father is a private practice urologist and I'm pretty sure he's been performing Da Vinci prostatectomies (removing the prostate) for a year or so.

surgery skillz

[Anonymous Coward]

Does being a skilled surgeon make you better at video games?

Nice. I wonder...

[erroneus]

...if the writers of Scrubs is paying attention to this. It could be added to the next season. :)

Like a surgeon...

[the dark hero]

...fraggin' for the very first time! */wierd al*

How long till Jack Thompson puts his spin on it?

[AbsoluteXyro]

I can see it now... Gaming Skills Directly Linked to Cutting People Open!

Well then...

[Phs2501]

This guy [speeddemosarchive.com] is set.

Gears of War

[ghislain_leblanc]

Gears of war players would make great surgeons! With the chainsaws and everything, yes sir!

Anecdote...

[MagicDude]

As part of my surgical clerkship in medical school, I in on an endotracheal surgery, where a camera was basically pushed into the bronchi and then tools manipulated in view of the camera. The fellow was doing the procedure under the guidence of the attending. During the procedure, the attending hat to keep reminding the fellow about keeping the camera centered and how the tip only moved on 1 axis and how you had to rotate the entire appratus to get 2d motion and so on. After the procedure, the attening l

Oblig Ref

[Hoi Polloi]

"All your internal organ are belong to us!"

haha I play to much WoW....

[ThreeDeadTrolls]

Healer LFG brain trauma!

Sounds kosher

[My name is Bucket]

Now if we could just stop them from amputating people's limbs and reattaching them to their backs without anaesthesia when all they needed was a blood transfusion, we'd be all set in the world of medicine.