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Jericho Won't Be Edited For Germany 57

Posted by Zonk from the stand-up-to-the-man dept.
Despite the loss they'll be taking in German game sales, Codemasters has made the decision not to make substantial changes to their title Jericho after the PS3 and Xbox 360 versions were banned from commercial release in Germany. "'Following a review by the USK ratings board, which declined to give an official rating, Codemasters has decided not to change the artistic vision of the renowned author and film-maker Clive Barker though cuts and extensive changes,' said the company in a statement sent to GamesIndustry.biz." For a sense of what the fuss is about Rock, Paper, Shotgun has an analysis of the demo.
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Jericho Won't Be Edited For Germany More

Jericho Won't Be Edited For Germany

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  • What am I not seeing? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by radarjd ( 931774 ) on Tuesday October 02, 2007 @10:45AM (#20823987)
    From either of the linked articles, I have no idea what the objectionable content is. It sounds violent, but what FPS isn't? Can anyone provide more info?
    • From the escapist [escapistmagazine.com]:

      According to a report on the German website Heise Online (translated by Google), the decision came as a result of the game's "brutal scenes," and paves the way for the Federal Verification Office for Youth-Endangering Media to place the game on an index of banned games. Placement on the index would result in a complete ban of the game, making it illegal to advertise, sell or import into Germany; currently, the refusal of the USK to issue a rating means the game is available for purchase only to people 18 years of age or older.

      A refusal to give a rating bans it from the 360 and the PS3 since microsoft and sony don't allow unrated games, but they'll still be able to sell the PC version. I guess this is like their ban of manhunt 2and other violent games.

      Also, the escapist had this on 9/25 and gamasutra [gamasutra.com] on 9/26. (oh, nm, the article is from 9/26)

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by KDR_11k ( 778916 )
        As opposed to what The Escapist reports, the index does NOT prevent sales. All restrictions placed on indexed games only apply to minors. The game cannot be displayed where minors can see it, cannot be sold to minors, etc but there are no restrictions on what can be done in adult-only venues or below the counter (of course noone will stock an indexed game outside of speciality stores). Only a court can order a complete ban on the grounds that it endangers the order of society.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by VJ42 ( 860241 ) *

        making it illegal to advertise, sell or import into Germany
        I think that that's probably in breech of EU rules on the free movement of goods. They can't stop someone buying it from the UK or France etc., then taking it home to Germany. Infact they probably can't stop someone ordering it from an (non-German) EU based based on-line shop and getting it mailed to them either.

        Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice.

        • Re: (Score:1)

          by mdwh2 ( 535323 )
          I think that that's probably in breech of EU rules on the free movement of goods. They can't stop someone buying it from the UK or France etc., then taking it home to Germany.

          Interesting - but I suspect that will be trumped if the thing in question is prohibited in the country. Here in the UK we have strict censorship laws (Manhunt 2 was banned, for example), and I believe people can be charged for importing adult material that is legal in other countries, but the censors disapprove of. I hope you are right

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by VJ42 ( 860241 ) *
            I'm in the UK as well, Had Manhunt 2 was refused a rating by the BBFC, not banned; that made it illegal to sell it in the UK, but not illegal to own.
            Porn is treated differently and, intrestingly, had Manhunt 2 been porographic instead of violent it would probably recieved an R 18 [bbfc.co.uk] Cert. AFAIK only snuff films are banned entirely (illegal to own; public decency laws mean quite a lot isn't for sale), although I think that there's a bill banning violent porn on it's way through parliment due to the fami

            • Re: (Score:1)

              by mdwh2 ( 535323 )
              AFAIK only snuff films are banned entirely (illegal to own; public decency laws mean quite a lot isn't for sale),

              Well snuff films probably don't exist ;) I'm not aware of any laws against owning one, but since there's never been a case AFAIK, it's never been tested in court.

              although I think that there's a bill banning violent porn on it's way through parliment due to the family of a dead woman blaiming her death on it. I'm at work, so I'm not going to google for links...

              Indeed there is, it's a great concern
        • Actually I think you're wrong (but don't shoot me if I am). I believe free movement of goods only applies to those measures that puts unfair (protectionist) levies on importing legal goods. You can't make all french coffee spoons illegal because coffee spoons in general are not illegal of course, but you can ban coffee spoons altogether as a national health issue or something. (people choking on coffee spoons?)

          Anyway, strange analogies aside, think of marijuana. It's legal in the netherlands (that is to say
    • It's fairly gory; It seems that the German ratings board take particular exception to gory and/or fantasty violence. Which is odd, since the moral majority tend to get all het-up over the regular kind, and tend to ignore demon and zombie slaying as inexcusably geeky.

      Personally, I think the game should be banned because you can't *jump*. And FPS with no jumping makes mee feel inexcusably crippled, like they've cut off one of my legs and my primary weapon is a supersoaker. Gah.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Pojut ( 1027544 )
        You know where I wish you couldn't jump? WoW. Yes, I know there are some places where it is useful, but seriously...watching people jump constantly in that game pisses me off.
        • Yeah, and then what about the poor cybering Night Elf ladies of Goldshire?

          The saucy little NelfJump is one if the primary ways the long-eared trollops sell their Elvish asses.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Sciros ( 986030 )
        You shouldn't be jumping around under fire with a gun, anyway. You're just too used to low-grav physics in games, where you get 2 full seconds of air time a la Master Chief; I'm happy with no jumping in a game that's supposed to be more realistic (at least in some ways).

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

          You shouldn't be jumping around under fire with a gun, anyway. You're just too used to low-grav physics in games, where you get 2 full seconds of air time a la Master Chief; I'm happy with no jumping in a game that's supposed to be more realistic (at least in some ways).

          And getting rid of jumping as a means to locomotion gets rid of one of the most annoying things about a FPS - jumping puzzles! Seriously... who likes jumping puzzles? Or who designs buildings and worlds where the primary way to get around is

      • Gears of War, you don't jump in that and it is an excellent shooter. not every FPS needs jump.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Toonol ( 1057698 )
        I hate jumping in shooters. If the game allows you to jump, it needs to limit the height to about 18 inches, and make it impossible to shoot while jumping.

        Why do people complain about the realism of details of foliage or water refraction, when they have characters that move like Saturday morning cartoons?

        I would also like to see strafing and moving backwards made slow, inaccurate, and prone to tripping.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Khuffie ( 818093 )
          Why do people complain about the realism of details of foliage or water refraction, when they have characters that move like Saturday morning cartoons? Because if I wanted to play a character that moves regularly, I'd go out and take a walk. There's a difference between realism and simulation. When games start to sacrifice all the things you mentioned, it would no longer be fun, and just be an exercise in frustration.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by samkass ( 174571 )
          I think you're pretty much describing "America's Army". Although I haven't played it since they stopped making a Mac version, it treated the accuracy aspect more like a simulation than a game. Any activity dropped your accuracy significantly. As did bullets landing nearby (so "strafing" fire actually WORKS), being far from your unit/leader, jumping, moving, falling, being hurt, etc.

          Between that and the "dead means dead" in a given round, I liked that game a lot more than the "spawn and kamikaze" style pl

        • I hate jumping in shooters. If the game allows you to jump, it needs to limit the height to about 18 inches, and make it impossible to shoot while jumping.

          You know, I spend most of my free time on the computer and eating snacks, and am exactly as overweight and out of shape as you'd expect from that, and I don't have any trouble jumping 18 inches straight up; so why the heck couldn't a presumably physically fit super macho main character top that ?

          If you can't jump over 18 inches straight up, then go

          • now, take your pasty ass out side and strap on the body armor, put on the helmet, and pick up that machine gun.
            feeling good? great. Now, jump as high in the air as you can.
            Get very far? I didn't think so.
            Now, try shooting something while you do it....

            Half a meter, half a meter, Kobe Bryant you are not.
            shut yer pie hole.
      • That's one of the things i liked about Black. They stripped out all the puzzle solving, ladder climbing, jumping, button pushing, crap and left it as a true and pure FPS just as god intended. You wanna go through a door, break out the shotgun and shoot that sucker down. I loved that. Tho as a general rule I'm not a big FPS fan.

      • If I recall, Germany has (or used to have) specific rules about the depiction of blood. You can release a game which kills thousands without remorse, but you can't release a game that has one guy who loses a finger in a bloody mess.

        I had heard rumors that there were some arcade games which had a "blood" switch for this reason, as well as general public appetites. I haven't seen any concrete examples of this, though.

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by ClamIAm ( 926466 )
        the moral majority tend to get all het-up over the regular kind, and tend to ignore demon and zombie slaying as inexcusably geeky

        I don't mean to sound like a jackass, but are you from/do you live in Germany? If not, remember that various countries have different ideas of "acceptable" media.

      • And FPS with no jumping makes mee feel inexcusably crippled
        Just be glad you aren't playing as this guy [pineight.com]. Would that be "excusably crippled"?

    • Re:What am I not seeing? (Score:5, Funny)

      by XxtraLarGe ( 551297 ) on Tuesday October 02, 2007 @12:21PM (#20825483) Journal

      From either of the linked articles, I have no idea what the objectionable content is. It sounds violent, but what FPS isn't? Can anyone provide more info?
      It's a first person shooter, featuring Nazis against Scientologists. I'm not sure who the protagonists are.

      • It's a first person shooter, featuring Nazis against Scientologists. I'm not sure who the protagonists are.
        It's kind of like the anti-Alien-versus-Predator. Whoever loses, we win.

    • German Rating Boards typically have a very strong sense that sex is as inappropriate for entertainment, as Americans Rating Boards typically have a very strong sense that sex is inappropriate for entertainment.

      A good example is that while the US and Germany both agree that the movie "Payback" staring Mel Gibson should receive the highest restriction of a rating, (R here in the USA, and "ab 16" (age 16 and up) in Germany) they disagree about what the movie Hitch should be.

      While the MPAA rated Hitch in the US

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by KDR_11k ( 778916 )
        16 is not the highest rating, 18 is (barring indexing or banning). Also some things are released in a censored version rated 16 and an uncut one rated 18.
      • I think that you meant "German Rating Boards typically have a very strong sense that violence is as inappropriate for entertainment..." At least, that is the thesis that the rest of the post supports. :-)

        Leaving the value judgments about each approach aside, I would say that any time that, say, a six-year-old sees a movie that is targeted at an adult audience, the parents ought to follow up with some discussion of what they saw in the movie.

        One question: Are the Germans also sensitive about violence in wh
    • In a nutshell, the display of Nazi imagery is a crime in Germany. (This is a gross oversimplification.)

      Welcome to the free world.

      I believe Wolfenstein was banned as well..the Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfenstein_3D [wikipedia.org] article provides some details about the law.

      Take it with the usual Wikipedia grain of salt.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Raenex ( 947668 )

        In a nutshell, the display of Nazi imagery is a crime in Germany.
        Obligatory Family Guy:

        http://www.metacafe.com/watch/200032/family_guy_in_germany/ [metacafe.com]
      • This has nothing to do with living in a free world. It's just that we germans are (unterstandably) a little bit touchy about certain symbols of our past.

        Which means that there are a small number of symbols that you are not allowed to display without the occasion being in a critical or scientific way but in a setting that might be used to glorify the symbols and the system they stood for. Among these are the swastika, the SS-Runes and the old german war-flag.

        Americans have these kinds of forbidden symbols to

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by orcrist ( 16312 )
          Americans have these kinds of forbidden symbols too. They are taboo and displaying them will result in social and/or penal sanctions. I am thinking of the N*-word to describe people of color, a burning American flag, the confederate flag and others. Using these Symbols in the wrong context will get you in any number of troubles in America, free speech or not.

          Weeeell.... no. There is a huge difference. None of those things you mention is forbidden. The burning of the American flag is an interesting one becau

  • Loss could be neglgible (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Bieeanda ( 961632 ) on Tuesday October 02, 2007 @10:48AM (#20824035)
    So you've get to avoid the effort (and cost) of making up new textures, possibly changing the geometry in places, localizing in German, and just as possibly avoid having to alter whatever there is in the way of storyline. The casual German gamer gets shafted, but the rest probably do a bit of illicit footwork, heading out into other EU countries to get copies there. The publisher still makes some sales, avoids shelling out for otherwise unnecessary work, and German retailers get pissed off at the government for making them lose out on sales. Sounds like a financially responsible plan to me, on the part of the publisher and developer.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by KDR_11k ( 778916 )
      It's not illicit footwork and there's no law preventing a store from getting copies from another region. Until the game gets an actual ban (that takes a lot more than just a refused rating) it can be sold normally in stores. This sounds more like Sony and Microsoft don't want an unrated game on their system, just as they don't let AO-rated games be released in the US. The console manufacturer CANNOT prevent imports from other EU countries, EU law is very clear about it.
      • Thank you for correcting me on that. EU trade laws are one of the many unfortunate holes in my knowledge.

  • Keep in mind this isn't regular banning (Score:3, Insightful)

    by KDR_11k ( 778916 ) on Tuesday October 02, 2007 @10:57AM (#20824195)
    Refusing a rating is the USK-equivalent of an AO rating, it's probably the console manufacturer deciding they don't want that "rating" on their system which is why the PC version is unaffected.
    • However, I don't think that Germany has their own version of the 360 or PS3. So if the game is going to be released in Spain, France, UK, or any other country, then people from Germany could pick it up from a country that is selling it, and play that version.

  • Flawed Logic (Score:4, Insightful)

    by paleo2002 ( 1079697 ) on Tuesday October 02, 2007 @11:26AM (#20824627)

    Game Publisher: This is a sophisticated game with mature content intended for an older audience. We're not marketing this game to children.

    Ratings Boards: Games are only played by children. This game has sophisticated, mature content that is inappropriate for children. We ban this game and swear vendetta against your families.

    Game Publisher: What if we make the "blood" green . . .?

    • Ratings Board: You're right, this game isn't for children. Consequently you aren't allowed to sell it to them.

      Console Manufacturer: Releasing an adults-only game on our platform is against our family-friendly policies!

      Yes, Sony actually refused to sell God of War at first because it got the same rating, citing their "family friendly" policies.
    • I have sulfhemoglobin [www.cbc.ca] you insensitive clod!
  • Changing games is vandalism. Don't treat adults like children. Greetings from Germany!
  • It just means: the game must not be sold and advertised to minors. You can buy it, you can play it if you're an adult. At least the PC version. Some console manufactures have their own policies that forbid selling non rated titles, but this is not law it's just their policy.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by tepples ( 727027 )

      Some console manufactures have their own policies that forbid selling non rated titles, but this is not law it's just their policy.
      "Some"? Try "All". How does one escape the console cartel [wikipedia.org] while still allowing four USB gamepads to work on a single PC plugged into a single TV?

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