Roleplayers Seek Removal of Nerf Gun Ban 547
An anonymous reader writes "LARP fans at Bowling Green State University may have to contend with a crippled game of Humans vs. Zombies after the University banned Nerf guns on campus. In the live-action game, players are either humans or zombies. The goal of the game is to change all the humans into zombies, or for the humans to evade capture by zombies for a certain amount of time. To defend themselves against zombies, humans may use Nerf guns. Players (most likely the human ones) are petitioning the University to lift the ban. The game had troubles back in 2006, when participating students were arrested. That issue has since been cleared up."
Why? (Score:5, Interesting)
What are we now, "Land of the fee, home of the scared?"
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:4, Insightful)
What's a weapon? You can splatter someone's brains everywhere in seconds with almost anything.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
Preventing a child from doing harm by blocking his access to something dangerous surely works. But it's just addressing the symptoms, not the actual problem. What is it? Simply put, the lack of "responsibility development" in the child. Some 150 years ago a 13 years old managed to be more mature than the typical 20 years old of today. The reason for that is that modern day parents have the strongly misplaced desire of shielding their children from maturity, i.e., of shielding them from the "nasty things" in the world, rather than allowing and providing for their growth at their actual potential.
Stop holding them back, start pushing them towards what they can achieve, and these accidents simply won't happen. Or, rather, if they do, they'll be actual accidents, and not the necessary outcome of keeping children clueless just for the sake of it.
What??? You talking about??? (Score:5, Funny)
Raising a child to be responsible?
You stupid or something...??? Don't you know you're supposed to let your TV raise your child. So you can blame everything bad that your child does on some TV show, video game, or anything else you can think of - enabling you to be sue happy and blame someone else for the fact the failure to teach responsibility to your child.
What you're advocating will make your child safer, smarter, and more responsible. Leaving you with no one to sue but yourself.
Responsibility = bad...puts lawyers out of business!
Re:What??? You talking about??? (Score:5, Informative)
As for myself, I walk around armed with the deadliest small army knife I managed to find. Thanks God knives still aren't forbidden, and thus I have some small prospect of getting away alive if (when) attacked by a criminal intent on killing me no matter what. But, alas, our Congress is already looking into ways to forbid knife-carrying too. Once that law is approved I guess I'll have to start walking around with a telescopic baton. Or, once those are forbidden, a wood stick...
So, do you want to know what USA will become one guns are outlawed? Come see for yourself. And take care with your luggage.
Try the UK for how things should work. (Score:3, Insightful)
The ban is a good thing, the ban is not creating a violent situation, the general state of Latinamerican societies makes impossible to enforce anything effectively.
In places like the UK (or Australia) where the rule of law applies, the ban is effective and the places are immensely safer than either the US, Brazil or parts of Mex
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Sure. So criminals bring guns in from elsewhere, but the LAW-ABIDING citizens of Wash.D.C. are defenseless, thus easy targets.
Right, but that's not really an argument against gun control in general. It just means you can't expect to have a gun-free zone right next door to a gun shop.
Dallas has as much density and poverty, yet a lower gun crimes rate. Dallas allows concealed carry. Hmm....
The UK also has a lower gun crimes rate, and guns are banned there. Hmm indeed!
My gun is why I am here typing this today, and not pushing up daisies.
I'm sure that'll come as a great comfort to the families of all the people who are pushing up daisies because of guns.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
- We believe in Equality. A gun gives a 4'5" petite woman an even chance against a 6'4" 285lb male armed with a knife.
- Because calling 911 often does not receive a timely enough response to keep you safe.
- Because America was born out of revolution. Without our guns we'd have continued being oppressed by the British, as would much of the world.
***
"A gun should be considered always as loaded even when it's not."
Yes it should...
***
"Have you ever thoug
You can't compare the US to Switzerland. (Score:3, Interesting)
In Switzerland owning a gun is a duty, a duty for which you bear entire responsibility.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
I remember vividly when I was 5 years old and my parents took me out and taught me to shoot a pistol. It scared the crap out of me! But, I learned to do it and for my whole life (and of my siblings) there have been loaded guns in nightstand drawers and other places. We all knew where they were. We also knew WHAT they were.
Ok, so what. Well, when I was about 8 years old, playing (unsupervised) at a friend's house, he snuck into his parent's room and brought out a handgun for us to play with. I could tell he didn't even know how to hold it. I forget the exact details of what happened next, but I convinced him to put it away and we left the house until a grown-up came home. I'm pretty sure I averted a probable catastrophe that day - all because my parents had taught me how to shoot.
Put away your gut reactions and look at the statistics. Boats are more likely to kill your kids than handguns are. Swimming pools are MUCH more likely to kill a neighborhood kid than a loaded, unlocked handgun in the same house. You wouldn't have a pool in the backyard and not teach your kids how to swim, would you?
I forget the quote- something about freedom and limiting the freedoms of all of us based on the failings of the least of us. It's a good quote if someone can find it.
And, just in case you're wondering, I do not own any handguns or other guns. My kids DO play with toy guns (as do I, with the kids).
Why don't I own a (real) gun? Because I don't like cleaning them mostly. I'd have one if I had a friend who enjoyed target shooting, but I don't (at least not in this state).
But I do LIKE it that some of my neighbors have handguns in their houses, for the same reason that lo-jack works to reduce all the car thefts in a city. If thieves don't know which house has it, they have to assume there's a risk that any house could have it, and that's a significant deterrent. Again with the statistics, look at the violent crime rates in states with tight gun controls, vs. those with liberal gun ownership. No significant difference.
Buy a toy gun for your kids at http://www.backyardartillery.com/ [backyardartillery.com]
Or get a catapult at http://www.catapultkits.com/ [catapultkits.com]
And teach them the science of ballistic motion while you're at it.
We need more people with an understanding of basic physics.
Re:Why? (Score:4, Informative)
Unmount it, clean it, teach the child to do both things, teach him to shot cans, show him what happens to a chicken when it's shot
a good opportunity to teach the children what is that "death" thing she had heard about
I can't imagine anything worse.
Three to Six Years
Child's Perception: Child thinks death is reversible; temporary, like going to sleep or when a parent goes to work; believes that people who die will come back
1. "Magical thinking"; believes their thoughts, actions, word caused the death; or can bring deceased back; death is punishment for bad behavior
2. Still greatly impacted by parent's emotional state
3. Has difficulty handling abstract concepts such as heaven
4. Regressive behaviors; bed wetting, security blanket, thumb sucking, etc.
5. Difficulty verbalizing therefore acts out feelings
6. Increased aggression - more irritable, aggressive play
7. Will ask the same questions repeatedly in efforts to begin making sense of loss
8. Only capable of showing sadness for short periods of time
9. Escapes into play
10. Somatic symptoms
11. Hungers for affection and physical contact, even from strangers
12. Connects events that don't belong connected
13. May exhibit little anxiety due to belief that deceased is coming back
Children's Understanding of Death [hospicenet.org]
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
No the safest thing is to not carry a gun. Gun owners are far more likely to die from a gun shot than none gun owners. That is a statistical fact. Of course that may or may not apply to the individual.
If you must own a gun then yes I think teaching your child gun safety is a positive thing. But even if you do teach your child gun safety locking the guns in a gun safe is
Re:Why? (Score:5, Interesting)
Amen. As kids we got sat down and explained exactly what the two 9mm pistols in the house were, what it did, how to handle ammo, how to load it, how to check that the chamber IS empty, and how not to. They were hardly ever locked up, and I could easily get to one were my parents not home. Much like any child. (Kids know how locks work and where the keys are anyway). But it didn't intrigue me, because now I knew exactly what it was, I'd held it, unlocked it, etc. So, no more mystery, it was just a pistol, big deal.
Much like how I was taught to deal with alcohol. It was never "kept" from me and my brother, and we were allowed to drink small amounts of alcohol early on and more as we got older. When university hit, we weren't out binging, because it had been discovered, been done, nothing new to see here, move along..... From that perspective, students who had finally "slipped the bonds" and were out partying hard, looked pretty silly.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent hides gun in the house and tells 6 year old child nothing about it. 6 year old shoots somebody. Parent is not charged.
There is something very wrong here. Maybe we shouldn't teach our children anything, just put them in a padded room for 18 years. Then nothing can be blamed on us.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
How about people with swords? This is a geek site, there's probably a bunch of us. Those are dangerous weapons too. Luckily, your kid is probably only going to kill himself mishandling those.
A gun does not have to be a danger to people around it, it just needs to be respected as much as we teach kids to respect cars by looking both ways. If you have guns, teach your kids about them, show them how to use them safely, and store them securely (trigger locks, gun safes, ammo and gun kept in separate locations). Just remember that education is an important part of that, because it's entirely possible for the kid to run into guns somewhere else, and you don't want that to be the first time.
Re:Why? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:5, Interesting)
To say that it's obscene to teach a child about guns, or let them fire them, is a real stretch though. Guns serve a purpose. Perhaps that purpose has eroded into something less than it once was, but it's still there at least in part. Many people still use guns to get their food. Some people legitimately use them for safety, not from other people, but from large animals. (If you've ever been to Alaska, you'll know most of the population there carry weapons for scaring off bears etc.)
I'm not a big gun proponent, I gave all of mine to my brother a few years after my first child was born because I simply wasn't shooting them enough to bother keeping them and her mom didn't want them around her. Not a big issue to me, but I still have access to every one of my weapons should I ever feel the need.
I grew up shooting guns. The first time I remember shooting, I was 5 years old and the gun was longer than I was tall. It was a 22 caliber rifle used for hunting rabbits and small game to have food. We're not all lucky enough to have enough money to buy all our food.
What would be obscene would be allowing your children to go hungry because you never taught them how to take care of themselves. What would be obscene is pretending that guns don't exist and being irresponsible enough not to teach your children about how to treat guns with respect and safety.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not all about "you have enough money for food if you have enough money for bullets", it's about making choices on how to spend your money. He reloads his bullets (actually usually shotgun shells) so the cost is almost zero compared to what he gains from being able to hunt for his food. Look at your grocery bill sometime and figure out how much you spend on meat every month. My brother can feed his family meat every day for 6 months for about 15 cents in bullets and another $50 in his gas and time spent hunting with his sons. I'm guessing you can't do that. Spending his money on things other than meat also allows his family to get a more balanced diet of meat and vegetables and not eat "popcorn for dinner" like he had to do for several years so his children could eat real food.
Yes, guns are always dangerous; that was the point of my post. Pretending they're not dangerous or "nonexistent" is far more dangerous to children than teaching them about the real dangers. Just because we don't all need them, however doesn't mean they're not needed, no matter how much you yell about it.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
I do have to agree with you that many people have no clue how to clean up after themselves or cook and clean. I saw the same thing when I was in college, but I learned how to do all of that stuff while sti
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Why? (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Note: I am not advocating for gun control. But trying to say that knives or bats can cause the same level of mayhem is silly.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
However:
1) He didn't shoot from a water tower. It was from the observation deck of the University of Texas at Austin administration building.
2) Many students and professors did fight back by firing up at him with hunting rifles.
Happily, your previous point about concealed carry laws is perhaps correct. According to Wikipedia:
"Ramiro Martinez, an officer credited with neutralizing Whitman, later stated in his book that the civilian shooters should b
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Gun control only keeps guns out of the "right hands". "Wrong hands" will find access to guns, regardless of the law.
Gun control helps keep guns out of the hands of people who are incompitent when it somes to handling guns. I'm not for banning all guns; I have great respect for people who go hunting, whether they use rifles or bow & arrow. I've never understood the idea of hunting with a pistol, but if somebody can intelligently explain the purpose of hunting with a pistol vs a rifle or a shotgun, then I'm sure I'll respect that too.
What I don't respect are people who live in cities their whole lives and buy a gun
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Why? (Score:5, Interesting)
Seriously, Stephen King's Carrie was allowed more opportunities for fun. If fanatically obsessive parents could be called "helicopter parents", she's the AH-64 gunship parent. Someone similar to her was undoubtedly responsible for this anti-nerf hullabaloo. If the quantity of pirates in the world is inversely related to global warming, I contend that this is possible: the number of school shootings could be proportional to the quantity of obsessive and dominating parents.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Funny)
A convenient store clerk was killed late yesterday during an armed robbery. The assailants were using nerf bats. The slaying took approximately 9 hours....
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
There will always be stupid people. We need to put a stop to letting them run everything.
Re:Why? (Score:5, Insightful)
Stupid ban (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Stupid ban (Score:5, Funny)
OK, your turn.
Re:Stupid ban (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Stupid ban (Score:5, Funny)
Well, what do _you_ think that hordes of undead flesh-eating zombies do? Save you 15% on your insurance?
Re:Stupid ban (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Stupid ban (Score:5, Funny)
The undead were nerfed by the GM's,
Innocent bystanders submitted a report of greifing to the game server (University),
The humans in turn are nerfed by the game server,
Thus causing the humans to be ganked by the undead.
Yep, sounds like typical PVP role-playing MMIRL.
Undead Discrimination (Score:3, Funny)
Many undead were just done with the rat race we call "life" and them BAM! (Apologies to Emeril) they are the walking dead. Some abuse this status and give the others a bad name. Most are just glad to have this second chance and just want to be left alone.
So enters the arrogant nerf toting lifers (griefers) who won't leave these poor undead alone. They just want to nerf them left and
Re: (Score:2, Redundant)
OK, your turn.
Re:Stupid ban (Score:4, Funny)
1)When nerf guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have nerf guns.
2)I've seen a picture of a rack of shotguns with the caption "The damn zombies aren't going to kill themselves."
Good night!
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Re: (Score:3)
You NRA people bother me. Guns are bad! Nerf guns imaginarily kill people! Think of the children!...
Why would anyone ban nerf guns? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Why would anyone ban nerf guns? (Score:5, Interesting)
A few years ago (can't remember when exactly) some dumb kid in Boston shot at another dumb kid with Silly String. The kid with Silly String all over him then took out a real gun, and shot the first kid dead. Mayor Menino's response to this was a proposal to ban Silly String within city limits.
This isn't exactly the same situation, but the political logic seems strangely reminiscent.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Silly String aka Mine Detection Apparatus (Score:3, Interesting)
The army does. I read several years ago that silly string was being used in Iraq. The lightweight strings, and the propulsion device, are ideal for detecting tripwires.
Re:Why would anyone ban nerf guns? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Why would anyone ban nerf guns? (Score:5, Insightful)
Ok.... now give me an example of any government in the history of the world that wasn't corrupt.
Re:Why would anyone ban nerf guns? (Score:4, Insightful)
I'll admit my knowledge of US history is sparse, but I suspect the idea wasn't that all government's are corrupt, rather all governments are corruptible.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Patently false. All humans are corruptible, if you don't believe that then you are a naive fool. All governments are run by humans. If you don't design your government around the fundamental idea that governments are corrupt then it will become corrupt and you'll have nothing you can do about it. Want some non-US examples? Just look at any modern European government (or
Re:Why would anyone ban nerf guns? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
It works only when Gandhian non-violence works - which is to say it works only when your opponent gives a damn about the body count.
There are "Killing Fields" throughout history.
When the Romans decided they wanted to be done with Carthage they made quite a through job of it.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
It is NOT intended so that We the People can defend ourselves against an invader (tho that could be a useful side consequence).
It is intended so that if necessary, we can defend ourselves against OUR OWN GOVERNMENT, if necessary by staging an armed revolt.
Remember that these people had just come out of a war for independence from an abusive gov't, and the whole concept was still fresh in their minds.
Apparently Americans today have entirely forgotte
The wussification of a people is complete.... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:The wussification of a people is complete.... (Score:5, Funny)
*brain asplodes*
Re:The wussification of a people is complete.... (Score:5, Interesting)
My cousin can make ANYTHING a hazard. It's a gift (from the devil).
But this isn't about that, this is about appearances: Can't have people playing guns on a university campus! Think of the children!
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Re:The wussification of a people is complete.... (Score:5, Informative)
Nerf Guns (Score:5, Funny)
There're too many double negatives in that headline.
parents complaining? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:parents complaining? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Better than Uzi Water Guns (Score:5, Interesting)
Nerf should be fine as long as it's obvious that it IS a Nerf weapon. If not, or if it's taking place at night. be sure you play in a place where everyone knows you're in a game, or be prepared for some Very Bad Consequences if you're not careful.
Re:Better than Uzi Water Guns (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Better than Uzi Water Guns (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.lewrockwell.com/grigg/grigg-w10.html [lewrockwell.com]
It kind of highlights what you say nicely.
Re:Better than Uzi Water Guns (Score:5, Insightful)
That's just a sign that cops are trigger happy. He should have been about two seconds away from a cop yelling "This is the Police! Drop Your Weapon!". Seriously, when the biggest danger of using a toy isn't the toy itself but the possibility of being shot by the cops, is it the toy that is a danger or the cops?
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
http://www.adorablekidsdressup.com/Cloud%20Nine%20Images/Shooting_Gallery/Nerf_Maverick.jpg [adorablekidsdressup.com]
I have a funny story about a similar Nerf game... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:I have a funny story about a similar Nerf game. (Score:3, Funny)
Do you feel lucky? (Score:5, Funny)
Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?
http://www.hasbro.com/nerf/default.cfm?page=viewproduct&product_id=17890 [hasbro.com]
I'm playing right now, and HvZ is awesome (Score:5, Interesting)
It's the best game ever. Hope they get the issues cleared up, as nerf guns and the associated modifications (yeah, I'm an engineering student) are a really fun aspect of it. If your college doesn't play, go get it started. I recommend talking it over w/ the campus cops first though, just to make sure you won't have problems like this.
Take a page from fantasy LARP (Score:2)
Bonus: It makes it more realistic (what are the chances you'll have your guns with you on Z day?).
What do we want? BRRRAAAIIIIIINNNSSSS!!!! (Score:3, Informative)
Here at UMass Amherst we're currently in the opening days of our second game of Humans vs. Zombies. The first was played beginning last Halloween. I'm currently a zombie.
To all those telling us to get lives: we have them. Humans often get tagged because they tried to continue normal campus life during the game. It's not a LARPing thing: nobody dresses up; we just wear a band around our arm or head to indicate team status. Games usually last a couple of weeks, and consist of normal play coupled with "missions" that reward either human or zombie for accomplishing objectives as a team. One of those missions is always a food drive for the poor. Sure, we have to hide our Nerf guns during room inspections, but even the RAs really don't give a damn (like they apparently do at Bowling Green. To top it off, HvZ players are usually some of the coolest, most interesting people on campus (including numerous attractive women).
It's good clean fun for college kids that doesn't necessarily involve getting wasted (though you can, and we do, play wasted here at UMass). What's not to like?
also LEDs are weapons of mass destruction... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
For the meantime, lets just be happy you can still have a camera tripod [thestar.com] on campus.
WTF? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
I know why they're banned (Score:5, Funny)
So... (Score:3, Interesting)
Sigh..... (Score:5, Informative)
Nerf guns are just like firearms and just as dangerous:
Nerf Guns:
Brightly colorful.
Use compressed air.
Don't resemble, even remotely, real guns.
Shoot big yellow sponges.
Sponge "bullets" bounce off of their target and usually make the target laugh.
Make funny noises when fired.
The target either never falls down, or gets right back up immediately, provided he or she didn't fall of a cliff.
Can be bought at any Toy's 'R' Us by a 10 year old.
Cost as cheap as $10.
Real guns:
Black or chrome plated.
Use smokeless powder.
Resemble reals guns because they are real guns.
Shoot lead or copper-jacketed bullets.
Lead bullets penetrate the target and usually make the target scream in pain.
Makes a loud bang when fired.
The person who was shot doesn't usually get up.
Can only be bought by someone who is 21 or older at licensed dealerships, plus State and Federal background checks.
Usually cost between $500-$2999 (hardly milk money)
So, yeah, I can understand how the police became easily confused between the two. Someone should give Barney Fife and his fellow deputies a public commendation for protecting safe fun-loving people from themselves.
I was looking through my college's regulations to see if they had rules prohibiting Nerf Guns and came across the following:
"Weapons and Explosives
1. Possession, use, or sale of any incendiary, explosive, firearm, or destructive device is not permitted. At no time will live ammunition of any type be permitted in or on university premises.
2. Any weapon including, but not limited to guns (i.e., air soft guns, BB/pellet guns, paintball guns, potato guns, pistols, revolvers, firearms, etc.), knives, and any items that are a reasonable facsimile of such weapons are prohibited.
3. Ammunition or explosives (including fireworks) of any kind are prohibited.
4. Failure to report to campus security and/or residence hall personnel the presence of an unlawful weapon, explosive or incendiary device, when the presence of such weapon or device is known or reasonably suspected is a violation of the rules and regulations of the University.
5. Reporting the false presence of an unlawful weapon, explosive or incendiary device with the intent to mislead or deceive is prohibited."
It doesn't list Nerf guns, but states that guns "that are a "resonable facsimile of such weapons are prohibited". This allows anybody with half a brain to successfully argue that Nerf guns are not a "resonable facsimile".
Interestingly enough, the preceeding section is of the following:
"Projectiles
1. Throwing, dropping, or projecting objects from any residence structure, including but not limited to self, keys, bodily fluids, and trash is strictly prohibited. In addition, throwing objects or playing sports in community courtyards is not permitted without permission from the Community Director of that area. Individuals and/or residential communities may be held financially responsible for repairing damages, painting costs, and general maintenance related to projectiles."
So, technically, that means it is against the rules to play flag football, catch, pickle, or Frisbee without getting permission. Man, we didn't even have to ask the Yard Duty for permission to do these things in Elementary school. I guess I should pack up my lawn darts.
Help me out here (Score:5, Insightful)
So is my thinking wrong?? Either way it sounds like a damn fun game and I sometimes feel cheated by not going to Uni (Traineeship, experience and courses make up my resume, uni would have been a waste as far as employability goes, but it sounds like a shit load of fun!)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
So, yes, as screwed up as it is, parents call teachers and administrators (even deans) to voice their c
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
When I was 18, and visiting a university campus getting ready to start, my father came along with me. Along with the group were several other 18-year-olds and their parents. During the tour, the guide mentioned that report cards were sent to the students' addresses (not the parents), and also that the students' cafeteria account was not accessible by the parents. Several of the parents expressed concern and
Facsimile of a weapon? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Urban Dead cosplaying? (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Glad to know there are bigger nerds than me who have little chance of diluting the gene pool.
Re:Urban Dead cosplaying? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Title revision suggestion: (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Title revision suggestion: (Score:5, Funny)
Uh, try the physics [xkcd.com] lab next door.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Title revision suggestion: (Score:5, Funny)