Steam UI Update Beta Drops IE Rendering For WebKit 244
Citing massive growth in their user base ("25 million users, 1000+ games, 12 billion player minutes per month, and 75 billion Steam client minutes per month"), Valve unveiled a revamped UI for Steam on Tuesday, opening the beta test to anyone who wants to try it out. There are many changes, and an increased focus on social features: "Right from within your own game Library, you can now track which of your friends plays each game or invite them to play one with you. Before you've even bought a game, knowing whether your friends play it is one of the most useful pieces of information to have. So on the store homepage, there's a new listing of what your friends have bought or played lately." Tracking games and achievements have both gotten simpler, and Valve has dropped the Internet Explorer rendering engine in favor of WebKit. An enterprising user also found files that may indicate the existence of an OS X Steam client.
Why OSX? (Score:5, Insightful)
Exactly how many steam games have OSX versions? Does anyone actually game with Macs?
Re:Why OSX? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Why OSX? (Score:4, Funny)
Exactly how many steam games have OSX versions? Does anyone actually game with Macs?
Maybe they're trying to create the market?
We're sorry, Steam has been rejected from the iTunes app store for duplicating iTunes functionality. If you would like to alter your app and resubmit, please feel free.
Re:Why OSX? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Why OSX? (Score:4, Insightful)
Quite many games in stores at least have that PC&Mac logo, so I don't see why it wouldn't be the same in Steam.
And even if not currently, Steam gained popularity on PC because it was the first online platform to buy and play games (it wasn't as good as it is now, they had to work a lot on it). Now they're first on Mac's too and will dominate that market too.
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You just reminded me why I don't want to buy a Mac. The software has a short lifespan, such that you don't know if your old copy of Microsoft Office 97 will work or not. (Most likely not.)
It works just fine on 98, XP, Vista, and Win7. Windows backwards-compatibility helps save me money.
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And for hardware backwards compatibility, nothing beats Linux. I have
several scanners that haven't worked on Windows since version 95 since they
were abandoned by their manufacturer (thanks HP). With
Linux, I use them everyday.
But with Linux you have to buy hardware that 6 months old because they haven't release linux drivers for the new model yet.
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I had FF7 and 8 for the PC. They used weird DirectX drivers that have since been retired. There are hacks available to bring them up to current though.
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Yah. Just yesterday I installed Wizardry 8 on my Windows 7 PC-- worked like a champ, first try, all I had to do is set compatibility mode to "Windows 2000". That game originally came out in November, 2001.
I doubt *any* software written for Mac in 2001 still runs on Snow Leopard on a modern Mac, frankly. In fact, I can nearly guarantee it-- since the Classic layer is gone for x86 Macs, and everything released in 2001 would be written for Classic. (I guess if you're lucky enough to have a PPC Mac, you could i
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On the windows 7 rig, I'm confident that I can get oldies to run one way or another, the market for older mac games instead is more limited.
still, I welcome greatly the use of webkit in the client instead of trident.
Dosbox works on macs too
Also Getting rid of IE was genius, why didn't they do that a year ago.
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World of Warcraft is a really old game though. I can't see it attracting a lot of new players to any particular market. Everyone who wants to play WoW is already playing it.
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As a counter-example to your assertion, I started playing WoW about three weeks ago on a Mac.
Despite WoW being an old game, it is constantly being updated with expansions and new content. Even old players are still finding it a rewarding experience.
I understand that this doesn't mean that a lot of users are like me, but to say that "Everyone who wants to play WoW is already playing it." is not correct.
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I think he was going for sarcasm....
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World of Warcraft. Don't know if it is being sold through steam though...
(Activision-)Blizzard has been trying to get their own piece of the legal game download market through the Blizzard Store [blizzard.com].
I think it actually has a chance of taking off. Steam got big through Valve's big titles: Half-Life 2, CS:S and other source engine games.
Blizzard has even bigger games: World of Warcraft and soon Diablo III and Starcraft 2. Those three titles alone can turn the Blizzard Store into a well-known and credible platform.
Once that has happened they can move in the newest Activision titles,
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Re:Why OSX? (Score:4, Informative)
Torchlight is one out of my head. Well, the Mac version isn't out yet, but it has been announced.
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Uh...why was parent modded troll for pointing out that the Mac version of Torchlight isn't out yet? Come on, people...if you are going to mod, at least try to mod appropriately. For example, you should mod down my post because I'm about to make a shameless self-plug.
Here is my review of Torchlight: http://livingwithanerd.com/torchlight/ [livingwithanerd.com]
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I am sure that I am not the only one who has a Mac and a PC, especially here on Slashdot.
I would not mind playing Starcraft 2 on a MacBook when I am abroad.
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I would not mind playing Starcraft 2 on a MacBook when I am abroad.
IIRC, but Steam is more or less a front-end for the publishers and their ego. Highly likely, as it was always before, Mac ports would require a different key thus one has to purchase the Mac version separately. This is long standing tradition, mainly due to the fact that Mac porting is licensed/subcontracted to another company and has different money trail. Since it means -in theory- more profit for publishers, highly likely Mac v. PC on Steam would be the same as it is with boxed version of games.
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Re:Why OSX? (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not sure what portion of Steam's sales they account for, but Steam does distribute a decent number of indie games [steampowered.com], and Mac sales often account for a disproportionate share [wolfire.com] of indie-game sales, possibly due to Mac users being culturally more into "pay $10 for an app" mindset, and less competition from AAA titles.
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I am surprised in 2010 short-sighted assessment of Macs and OSX still exist.
But then I recall the Greater Internet Dickwad Theory.
1. Mac users care more for whats under the hood. I like running a *nix like environment in a package that is stable, fast and supported widely. (You do know that Mac is BSD under the hood, right?)
2. If you payed 3g's for your Mac, you got a pretty hefty system. Are you playing with Photoshop for a living? Good for you.
3. Outperformed is a great unspecific term. it lets you spew o
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So why not just run BSD?
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Yes... (Score:2)
Does anyone actually game with Macs?>
... yes, we do.
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Exactly how many steam games have OSX versions? Does anyone actually game with Macs?
Gaming has never been that huge on the Mac. A large part of this is limited retail shelf space... If a retailer knows the PC version of a game is more likely to sell than the Mac one, they're more likely to stock the PC one. Which means less shelf space for Macs... So less Mac users go into the store to buy stuff... So you put less Mac stuff on the shelves...
These days we're seeing the same trend with PC gaming. Consoles are taking over the market and you're seeing less and less shelf space devoted to
I'm not quite sold. (Score:3, Interesting)
I'm not steam's biggest fan, but I liked how minimal it was. I do like the different game layout views; the icon enlargements are a nice touch. I'm not sure how useful this is to me as I have many non-steam games, so I edit windows 7's crippled game explorer instead of using the steam launcher, so I rarely see the steam interface. The store does seem much faster though.
Re:I'm not quite sold. (Score:5, Informative)
You do know you can add shortcuts to non-steam games in Steam too? That way you also get the in-game browser and community features in it. You're the first person I've actually heard of using the Vista/Win7 game explorer though, if not using Steam it's much faster to write part of the game's name to start menu search box and launch it.
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Yah but then you don't get any icons for non-steam games, which are the majority of my games. Using vista game explorer editor I can have nice huge boxart for every single one of my games, even my old DOS ones I launch via dosbox (Wizard's Crown, Conflict: Middle East Political Simulator, Romance of the 3 Kingdoms III, etc).
See this for an example, though I have my boxart much larger.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_C0PrNGg_f9I/SooziquYCbI/AAAAAAAAEU4/iRLdJma4PkU/s800/VGE%20Complete.jpg [ggpht.com]
Not just games (Score:2, Funny)
So (Score:3, Interesting)
Tracking games and achievements have both gotten simpler, and Valve has dropped the Internet Explorer rendering engine in favor of WebKit.
So does that mean my game will stop locking up every time I join a game because idiotic admins put horrible bloated HTML bastardizations as their MOTD?
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I downloaded the beta a few hours ago.
The first thing I noticed was, while the Supreme Commander 2 Demo was downloading, the UI kept locking up for ~120 seconds. (0% CPU)
The second thing I noticed was level load times dropped about 30% in TF2.
Browsing feels a whole lot quicker now - except during the freezes. :P
Re:So (Score:5, Informative)
Sorry, apparently they only changed Steam itself, as the interface used in the games to access a browser is built in with the engine, so it'd require an update and more testing for each game that still uses IE individually. However, apparently you can turn off HTML MOTDs. (Google it)
I don't want to be tracked (Score:3, Interesting)
Why everyone keeps saying that tracking every single move you make on your pc is such a great feature?
Leave me alone, mind your own business and stop collecting my own usage data for your strinky marketing purposes.
When I want to tell all the world that now I'm playing a game I will do it on my own, I don't need some steamy application to make it for me.
And yes, I want to subscribe to an asocial network. You subscribe and no one cares about you. Relax. Enjoy.
Re:I don't want to be tracked (Score:5, Insightful)
So then just don't use Steam. There's a difference between being tracked involuntarily a la Google Analytics and tracking your game stats and achievements on a gaming platform that contains such community features, which you signed up for.
Your complain is like signing up to a dating site and then complaining how the girls won't leave you alone.
Re:I don't want to be tracked (Score:5, Funny)
Your complain is like signing up to a dating site and then complaining how the girls won't leave you alone.
More like the bots won't leave him alone, and he can't find any real live women.
Re:I don't want to be tracked (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't see a tight connection (nor a loose one) between playing and letting know to all the world that I'm actually playing and what.
If I sign up to a dating site, it's for finding girls. It's not a valid comparison.
Re:I don't want to be tracked (Score:5, Informative)
How does Steam let the whole world know if you're playing or not? Even if you use your usual nickname with Steam, set your profile status to private (it's friends only by default if I remember correctly) and don't add friends on it. No one knows you're playing then.
99% of games you can also buy on other media or download services than Steam (MW2 and a few other games being exceptions, since they use Steam).
Complaining about Steam's community and friends features is stupid because you don't need to use them if you don't want to.
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Even more stupid is that the whole thing is 100% opt-in. If you don't want anyone knowing when you're playing a game then don't add them as a friend. Or if you just have to add friends to the service select the option to always appear offline and never log your stats.
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And mark your profile private so nobody else can see it.
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I guess he has a point. Playing Peggle Deluxe you wouldnt want your friends to see you. However, for the rest of us, knowing what those of us with similar tastes are into is good intel. I have bought a few games partly based on what I saw others liking enough to spend time in. There is your connection. I don't love tracking so much either though, but what are you going to do? Cross the streams and give Google a Steam ip and vice versa? heh
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Your complain is like signing up to a dating site and then complaining how the girls won't leave you alone.
girls? it's the men who won't leave me alone that bother me! *shudder*
Re:I don't want to be tracked (Score:5, Insightful)
girls? it's the men who won't leave me alone that bother me! *shudder*
Stop playing a female night elf then. Sheesh.
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Your complain is like signing up to a dating site and then complaining how the girls won't leave you alone.
I highly doubt most /. users will be complaining about girls not leaving us alone.
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Unfortunately there are a growing number of games that now REQUIRE Steam, despite being available as a retail purchase. Given the size of Steam and the attraction PC gamers and developers have to it, it wouldn't surprise me if 90%+ of all major titles require mandatory Ste
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You can make your profile private which effectively opts you out of any social features. You can also disable in-game overlays but I find those handy whenever I want to pull up a web browser.
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Surely, I can't be the only person who saw the article blurb and thought "WTF?"
I mean, has what your friends play online now become the reason for whether to play or not? I hope and trust that this is only true for the minority of players in their teens and early twenties, while the majority of players in their 30s and 40s have gotten past the need to always have what their "friends" have, always do what their "friends" do, and constant single-syllable social networking.
I mean, it's nice to provide a "frie
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And when I do want to play a game with my friends, I honestly prefer sitting in the living room, sharing a nice 25yo single malt, and playing together on the big screen. The simple joy of being with friends, Steam will never be able to provide or compete with.
What about the other side of the spectrum? It's 10pm and you're in your jammies and you see on Steam that a friend is playing a casual game. With one click you can join his game, play together for 10 minutes, and make plans together for the weekend while chatting. There's a lot of value in that, even if it's not your very favourite means of gaming.
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You can do exactly that. Set Steam to appear offline for your friends list when you don't want to be bothered, and online when it's ok.
On the latter point, playing with friends in the living room with some beers is of course fun. But it doesn't mean it's either that or this, you can have the both. Many of the multiplayer games are more fun with friends even if you're playing on your computers (and the added bonus of being able to play with foreign friends).
I dont just buy some game if I see some friend play
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Then good luck playing any high-tier games in the near future. Everyone will be putting their games out through things like Steam due to the increases in piracy.
And what I don't understand is why people seem to be happy about another (near) monopoly being built?
YES! (Score:2, Interesting)
Just tried it out and it seems that the store page is no longer has any flash elements at all. They seem to have written it all in javascript, which as most people will agree is much faster in WebKit then IE.
The interface reminds me of when I owned my Zune though (disclaimer: doesn't mean thats bad), but the new My Games page layout is much improved and in my opinion, awesome.
Bring back compact mode! (Score:5, Interesting)
The new steam beta window is HUGE. A lot of people used the old compact mode (most of the time), so that steam was just a menu of games, not a "gaming portal" or whatever other buzzwords.
Re:Bring back compact mode! (Score:5, Funny)
Haven't you heard? If your application doesn't have a synergistic community portal for leveraging paradigm-changing reality matricies you're officially a member of the Software 1.0 generation. I can't wait until the new version of TurboTax comes out with 1-click facebook export, twitter feed for liability expenses and a CoverFlow-alike system for making your tax returns totally pimped.
Never thought I'd be such a cynical old fart at 30, but if I want to socialise with people I'll do it down the fucking pub thank you very much :)
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Haven't you heard? If your application doesn't have a synergistic community portal for leveraging paradigm-changing reality matricies you're officially a member of the Software 1.0 generation. I can't wait until the new version of TurboTax comes out with 1-click facebook export, twitter feed for liability expenses and a CoverFlow-alike system for making your tax returns totally pimped.
Crap. That's an awesome idea! I can totally see how we can utilize this agile platform for demonstrating first-order capabil...wait...what? Am I a manager? Why, yes, yes I am. Why do you ask?
TurboTax DOES have 1-click facebook export already (Score:5, Informative)
I just finished my taxes last week, and in one of the last steps after e-filing TurboTax offered to post a "I just finished my taxes with TurboTax and I'm getting a $XXX refund!" message to my Facebook profile.
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For a minute there I thought you were joking. One google later shows that turbo tax is only too happy to use people bragging about their personal finances as a marketing tool.
Un. Fucking. Believable.
http://www.insidefacebook.com/2010/02/03/turbo-tax-uses-facebook-connect-to-allow-friends-to-spread-the-word/ [insidefacebook.com]
Maybe it's because I started drinking before I started using the internet but I really don't get this obsession with broadcasting absolutely everything in your life to anyone within a mile radius. It's li
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Never thought I'd be such a cynical old fart at 30, but if I want to socialise with people I'll do it down the fucking pub thank you very much :)
That's not cynicism, that's humanity.
I'm pretty sure that 30 years from now there will still be pubs with people in them. I'm equally sure there won't be twitter.
But I do have a terrible feeling that half the people in the pub will have borg-implant cameras feeding their "SelfBook" stream, and we will all be stars in someone else's reality TV show.
When that happens I'm opening a bar called the Faraday Cage...
If your friend jumped off a cliff would you do it? (Score:3, Funny)
Steam - now with added peer pressure!
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If your friend jumped off a cliff would you do it?
No, but if my friend said they liked a game and historically liked similar games to me then it might make me buy it.
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Especially if that game was something awesome like Tony Hawk's Skate'n'BASE Jumparama, where you have to do rad skate tricks off of buildings, cliffs and other high structures.
Did you see that demo with the invert 720 low-deploy with the sports chute? I can't wait to try it for real off the radio mast down the road!
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What I can't figure out is why I would need Steam to tell me what my friends play. Isn't that what conversation is for? Before I buy a game, I'll not only find out whether my friends have played it, but what they think of it too. Can Steam tell me that?
xmpp for chat (Score:2, Interesting)
Download bar? About time (Score:3, Informative)
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We would've known that for a long time if they had completed their coding progress bar code before their download bar code!
My friend played WHAT? (Score:3, Funny)
Headshotkill? What the hell, man?
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Er, I mean Hellspawn 2. Yeah. Definitely Hellspawn 2.
OS X = Yay (Score:2)
Privacy options? (Score:3, Interesting)
I sure hope there is a way to turn off reporting what games you own or have played recently? If I want someone to know that, I'll tell them. It's none of anyone else's business what I own and play.
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You just set your profile to private, it's that easy. Infact by default it's set on private mode, and you have to opt in for the community features. Even the JSON/XML pages for fetching various Steam stats aren't accessible by others when your account is set on private mode (Valve cites apparent legal reasons for this).
Fixes an interesting issue. (Score:5, Informative)
With this beta release of Steam, they fix an interesting issue that cropped up with the release of Windows 7.
For users of that particular OS who have either removed Internet Explorer, or did not have it installed at all when the OS was installed (see: Europe, and the rest of the world that couldn't even stand the browser), Steam was half-broken. One could not see any screenshots for a game before purchasing. Anything that needed a popup window in Steam would NOT default to the main browser installed on the system.
People complained about this, asking Steam to start looking for the default browser on the system so they could at least go back to browsing for games and possibly buying them.
It's good to see them actually address that issue.
Maybe I'll buy Space Giraffe to celebrate.
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It's even worse, because it's really easy to open URLs in default web browser - if you do ShellExecute() on an URL, that's precisely what will happen, and it's actually less code than explicitly invoking IE and passing it an URL.
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Surprisingly, because it slowed down impulse [dict.org] shopping, and by the time we've found the game on the site, our urge to "buy the game if the screenshots or video looks good" is gone.
Also, as it was pointed out on the forums (can't link to the post for now -- behind the corp wall of fire) that this being broken under these particular configurations may speed up Impulse [impulsedriven.com] shopping, which could finally make Stardock a threat to Steam, since Impulse already had that "It just f'n works." thing going on. None of th
Re:Neat UI after Battle.Net changes (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not just Battle.Net really, these are features that XBox Live has had for a while and that Microsoft has tried to bring to Windows with Games for Windows Live also, which now has it's own games store too.
I don't think this was so much about bringing new features for the benefit of users in general as much as it was about keeping up with the competition.
If Steam didn't introduce these features it would start to look very dated.
One thing I wish ALL these services would introduce is download scheduling though, over the last few years there's been a shift towards capped peak time downloads in the UK (and many other countries), and I can't afford to have multi-gigabyte game updates and downloads and so forth chewing into my bandwidth allowance. I don't have the option of just loading it up when the off-peak period starts and downloads aren't capped, and turning it off in the morning, because I go to bed a couple of hours before peak time starts, and get up and go to work a couple of hours before it ends.
It may sound trivial but for me, and I imagine others in my position it's actually a big deal- I don't buy games via Steam partly because it's annoying only being able to download said games on weekends when I am up at the right times to be able to get it going and stop it during the off-peak period. For me, it's actually more convenient to just buy games in shops, or order them online. Similarly I don't buy retail games on XBox Live or even bother trying multi-gb demos for this reason- I can't control when they will be downloaded.
Valve, Microsoft, Blizzard et al. seem oblivious to the fact that being too lazy to implement a download scheduler is costing them customers. Sure there are workarounds, and ways to implement these sorts of things themselves, but they're hacks that updates can break and there's nothing less amusing than coming home to find some update has fucked your scheduling hack and you've had 90% your monthly on-peak usage allowance chewed up right at the start of the month because of it.
Of course another option is to go to an ISP that oversells and doesn't have caps like this, but then that's equally useless because those ISPs are the same ones that are utterly hopeless for online gaming.
It's ironic that once again, it's a simple feature that's ignored, but that most popular BitTorrent, or USENET clients provide- yet again, it seems piracy offers the superior distribution mechanism.
Anyway, that's my rant for the day ;)
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Yesm you and that other guy.
Re:Neat UI after Battle.Net changes (Score:5, Informative)
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I think really my best bet is going to be writing a quick .NET app to create schedules and kill Steam and load Steam at certain times I've still got the issue of heading off to work a couple of hours before off-peak ends and possibly forgetting to close it in the morning so I'd much rather see it automated than a months bandwidth on-peak wasted in a day!
It's just a little annoying that I have to do it all myself when it's a simple feature to implement, of course it doesn't help me with XBox Live either, I g
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The problem is that our exchange isn't unbundled, or at least, there's no 3rd parties operating their kit on our exchange, so we're stuck with 8mbps ADSL max over BT's infrastructure.
That means that where I am we're stuck with ISPs who have to put up with getting ripped off by BT. The only upside is in a year or two we should gain decent connections from the Digital Region scheme so that might be something at least, although it's still a year or two off.
Re:I wonder how it works on Wine (Score:4, Informative)
Unfortunatly, steam client is broken in Wine now http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=version&iId=19444 [winehq.org] , but it doesn't seem to be webkits fault!
Hopefully it might eventually wind up being working better than the old Steam client ever was now that the IE dependency is thrown out.
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Yeah but then Wine goes into a shame spiral and it's all downhill from there.
Re:I wonder how it works on Wine (Score:4, Insightful)
Ditto. It's frustrating, since wine is now a pretty solid platform for gaming.
I'd love to give Valve money, but I'm not paying a Microsoft Tax in order to do so. I guess we're far too small a market for them to care about though.
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Well, I imagine a lot of code for the game must already run on Linux, as they have Linux server binaries.
It's the graphics-related code that doesn't. Or so I assume.
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OS X != Linux, and there are many more games that do support OS X.
Re:Webkit (Score:5, Interesting)
At this rate, WebKit could be the new IE6 - it could become so pervasive that people take it for granted, and develop web sites that only render correctly in WebKit. It's already in Safari, Chrome, Konqueror, iTunes, Steam, Midori, Maemo, Moblin, iPhone and WebOS, and will be coming to Blackberry soon. What does this mean for the interoperable web? (Yes, it's better than IE6 in that it's reasonably standards-compliant, cross-platform and licensed under LGPL2.)
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As long as you keep your website standards compliant there should be no issue. It should also be noted that while all these browsers share the same renderer, they don't all use the same Javascript engine. One thing that may help is that webkit is open source.
A good web developer should always make sure that their site renders on multiple browsers with different renders.
Beyond the W3C HTML validator are then any other cross platform tool that will test a website for standards compliance?
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Maemo and Moblin both use mozilla based browsers. Maemo comes with MicroB and Moblin comes with the Moblin Browser. Both can also use Fennec or Firefox Mobile. There may be some WebKit projects floating around for both of them, but I don't believe any of them are far enough to replace the platform browser. My guess is that the merger into Meego will continue to use Mozilla/Firefox.
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Although the 800 pound gorilla, Android, uses webkit.
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Huh. I didn't believe you on that until I looked it up. I wonder why they don't use chromium.
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Chromium uses WebKit as well.
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That would highly depend on the WebKit project. Basically, I think it's much easier to say to Steam that "Sorry, but we don't want broken or non-standard rendering in Safari, Chrome, Konqueror, iTunes, Midori, Maemo, Moblin, iPhone and WebOS, and soon on the Blackberry, you fix your application" than it was for the IE team to do it. Not to mention that for a large part Microsoft didn't want to create a standards-compliant, compatible web competing with the Windows platform and IE. And when it comes to being
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Why don't you use a browser that zooms the whole page instead of only zooming the text? (which makes no sense anyway)
AFAIK both Opera and Safari zoom the whole page. Don't know about IE, Firefox or Chrome.
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Buy some glasses grandpa.
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Of course it looks horrible when zoomed, it's sub-pixel anti-aliasing.