StarCraft Cheating Scandal Rocks Korea 471
dotarray writes with this snippet: "The largest scandal in e-sports history is currently unfolding in Korea, with revelations that a number of current pro gamers are involved with match setups and illegal betting. While the gamers are unnamed at this point, the story is said to touch many A-list StarCraft celebrities, including sAviOr, Ja Mae Yoon, one of the best-known and most successful players of all time."
How is this news? (Score:2, Interesting)
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Re:How is this news? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:How is this news? (Score:4, Insightful)
Why is it any different than the "sport" of running into someone as hard as possible so another guy can throw a ball that is not even round for another guy to catch?
Any game that features a competitive element can be raised to the level of a sport if it attracts enough spectators that become interested in the outcome.
Blizzard worked very hard to tune the original SC (with help from players in Korea) to balance the 3 sides to enable it to be a stable enough base for a competitive sport (ie, there's no argument that the Terrans are better than the Zerg or the Protoss etc - they are evenly balanced). Some might say it's even more evenly balanced than a sport where the team with the most money can buy the championship (or at least make a very good go of it).
I realise your AC post was nothing but a troll, but I thought it was worth saying. I've never followed competitive Starcraft, but I can fully understand how people could.
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Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:How is this news? (Score:4, Interesting)
it would be like finding out the players were rigging our baseball and football games to win bets in Vegas
you mean, like, they don't actually do that?
Oh my goodness (Score:5, Funny)
Yeah, big surprise that where there's betting... (Score:3, Funny)
Reminds me of a Woody Allen quote, "I was watching a ballet at City Center, and I'm not a ballet fan at all, but they were doing the dying swan, and there was a rumour, that some bookmakers had drifted into town from upstate New York, and that they had fixed the ballet. Apparently there was a lot of money bet on the swan to live."
In a way it's nice.. (Score:2, Insightful)
It is nice to be part of a demographic that couldn't give a rat's ass about the whole thing, including MMOs and the surrounding scene.
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Me, too. I really can't be assed about a multi-million-earning sportsman, regardless of the sport. Golf, soccer, football, basketball... none of these guys are any role model (eccept on how to rake in the dough). Fuck 'em. Together with the dumb celebrities of all kind. Fuck 'em all.
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I don't know, after watching The Blindside, Michael Oher kind of seems like a good role model to me. I don't know how true to life the movie was, but if it's even half true, I'd say he's a good person to model your own kids after.
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It blows my mind how many kids are fed the lies that they can make it in pro sports. I your skills aren't better than 1 in 100,000, you're n
Re:In a way it's nice.. (Score:5, Funny)
instead, you're part of the demographic that cares about "Dancing with the stars". Congratulations.
Re:In a way it's nice.. (Score:5, Funny)
Name is wrong - Jae Yoon Ma (Score:5, Informative)
His first name is Jae Yoon, and his surname is Ma. Typically written in Korean with the surname first, as Ma Jae Yoon. Ja Mae Yoon is wrong.
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Stop using the term "first name" to refer to a second name. It isn't helping. "Given name," works pretty much universally, without implying a correct order.
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First Name. There, said it, whatcha gonna do about it
This is why I only play D&D (3rd ed.) (Score:5, Funny)
I played Starcraft for a while, and I was very impressed with how balanced the gameplay was and how thought out the interface was. Blizzard did a great job making that game.
But it really stifles the creativity of the player by restricting actions to a very specific set of pre-programmed actions. You *must* farm for Vespene gas. you *must* collect crystals. There is little room for true creativity and adventuring. Today's FPS games are actually getting better at allowing this kind of freedom.
But to really get the most out of a game, you have to use your imagination. There's nothing more challenging than interacting with your friends and working out puzzles with nothing more than paper, dice, and pewter figurines. Dungeons and Dragons (and other clones of it) is the ultimate game because it removes artificially created limits and depends completely on how much you are invested in it.
If people are cheating and rigging game competitions, it's only because there is something to rig. Try cheating in D&D and you'll find that you only cheat yourself.
BadAnalogyGuy (aka Black Leaf)
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You *must* farm for Vespene gas. you *must* collect crystals. There is little room for true creativity and adventuring. There is little room for true creativity and adventuring.
I can't tell if I'm being trolled or not.
It's an RTS. Comparing Starcraft to RPGs is apples to oranges. That's like criticizing chess because you *must* move your pawn or *must* move your knight.
The real question in all this is whether Starcraft 2 is hackable or not.
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Fixed that for y-WHOOOOOSH!
Also: bah, 3rd edition? I was playing D&D when it wasn't Advanced the first time, and when "elf" was a character class. Hey, you zerglings! Get off my lawn!
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Core Wars [corewars.org]?
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For me personally, I've been a bit disappointed with 4th edition because they're trying so hard to make all characters 'equal'. I don't care what you say, Gandalf will always pwn Aragon - he's the freaking white wizard for blinky's sake! Let him be!
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Try cheating in D&D and you'll find that you only cheat yourself.
Cheating is fine until your DM notices. Then it's "hello 2000 XP penalty" and "your character is struck down by a curse where all actions must be announced in pig latin or you take 3 necrotic damage at beginning of your turn (save ends)". :)
Actually, next time I DM I'm gonna use that.
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Well, you'd need a different set of rules and, presumably, a DM you're comfortable with sexually (depending what you plan to be doing with said chicks).
"k, rolling for gender check."
"You did that already."
"Yeah, well, after last time, I feel like rolling again. Panties of Binding +5, my ass...."
"I didn't make the tuckback rule. You got a problem? Take it up with the book!"
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Try cheating in D&D and you'll find that you only cheat yourself.
Thank you for that public service announcement. Remember kids, stay in school!
And out of strangers' basements
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As popular as SC is, if they'd have put loot in, that'd be even cooler. They could call it Warcraft III. I'm gonna copyright that. Oh wait...
As long as it's not Boxer, I'm ok (Score:5, Interesting)
As part of Korea's human rights laws, it is illegal to release criminals' names - they can only be implied - which means that as the police have now gotten involved, we may never be officially told who was involved in this drama.
You can't know criminals' names in Korea? Kind of weird.
Re:As long as it's not Boxer, I'm ok (Score:5, Insightful)
"You can't know criminals' names in Korea? Kind of weird."
It has it's positives i.e. vigilante justice and not getting ones life ruined if accused of a heinus crime (pedophelia, sexual assault, etc).
In america I find the fact they publish the names of sex offenders grotesque because rehabilitation and re-entering society to lead a normal life is impossible, this vigalante mob justice has never sat well with me.
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In america I find the fact they publish the names of sex offenders grotesque because rehabilitation and re-entering society to lead a normal life is impossible, this vigalante mob justice has never sat well with me.
That's now really what it's about. Personally, if I have small kids and I move into a new neighborhood, the lists are invaluable. It doesn't make rehabilitation impossible either because names expire from the lists, but of course (like any other felon), you have to be truthful to your would-be employers if they ask you. I have no problem with any of this.
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Wrong. Recidivism rates are much higher for people who are driven by a desire for money than they are for sexual offenders. Evidence from http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/ascii/rpr94.txt [usdoj.gov]
"Released prisoners with the highest rearrest rates were --
robbers (70.2%)
burglars (74.0%)
larcenists (74.6%)
motor vehicle thieves (78.8%)
possessors/sellers of
stolen property (77.4%)
possessors/sellers of
illegal weapons (70.2%).
What these high-rate offenders have in common is that they were all in prison for what are gener
Re:As long as it's not Boxer, I'm ok (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:As long as it's not Boxer, I'm ok (Score:4, Informative)
Criminals? I guess you mean criminal suspects, since it's the police rather than the court that "have gotten involved".
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Re:As long as it's not Boxer, I'm ok (Score:4, Insightful)
It's a similar principle as in the West, where you generally can't release the names of suspected offenders (or victims) who are minors (or at least that's how it is here in Australia ... you often hear 'the offender's identity cannot be revealed because s/he was under 18 at the time of the crime). This applies to both those merely accused and awaiting trial, as well as those convicted (or for that matter, exonerated).
The Korean law just goes a step further and extends this protection to all people involved in criminal matters.
I kinda like the idea actually, although there are some obvious caveats. The general public certainly has no right to demonise someone accused of a crime before it's been proved. And even once they are convicted, it is not really the general public's business to know criminals' names, other than obviously those connected with the crime (victims/families etc). They will pay a penalty under the law (a fine, community service, jail time etc) ... but once that debt is paid they have a right to move back into society without being discriminated against for the rest of their lives. And keeping their name out of the media is one way to do that.
The counter-argument is made that people have a right to know if they are living near/employing/otherwise engaging with people who have been found guilty of serious crime (particularly sex offenders or murderers). And it's a good counter-argument. Perhaps we can draw a line and say "people convicted of the most serious crimes or those with no hope of rehabilitation can have their identities revealed, but for minor to moderate crimes, the criminals should remain anonymous". Either that or we toughen up sentencing so that serious criminals don't GET reintroduced into society in the first place ... then the whole argument becomes moot.
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This article is all over the place. They write the guys name a couple ways. The one under the picture is the more correct romanization, and yes it should refer to suspects. The papers often print the names of convicted people here.
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Dude that's like polar opposite of the US. We get daily updates in the newspapers of DUI arrests, Battery and Assault arrests, and if you are a pedophile, you might as well hand out business cards with all of your pertinent info to everyone you ever meet because they'll see it all online anyways.
Re:As long as it's not Boxer, I'm ok (Score:5, Insightful)
I doubt they have an equivalent. Even in other ~Western~ countries there is often no equivalent of such a registry. It's one of those things I always found a bit odd about America actually.
Where I live, you either don't release a serious criminal who is going to have a tendency to re-offend, or tabs are kept on them in other ways (house confinement, surveillance, radio bracelets etc.). I mean sure, the people who live nearby to the to-be-released sex offender will be notified and have a right to object to/block the offender moving into that area. But that doesn't extend to the whole world being able to punch in a random address and see who's around.
I'm not American so I may have misinterpreted what the Registry actually does. If so I apologise. But my impression was that ~anyone~ can search for nearby offenders ~anywhere~, even if that location has nothing to do with them.
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No, you're absolutely correct.
When money is involved (Score:5, Insightful)
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That's a good point. Although, I wonder if the differences between games in a franchise are more or less significant an obstacle to changing game than it would be for a professional sportsperson changing to a related sport.
There's been quite a few high profile Rugby (League) players crossing over to Rugby (Union) in the past few years here in Australia, for example. The games are related and certainly share a similar skill-set, but the rules and strategies are reasonably different. Things like the relative
got caught using cheat codes (Score:3, Funny)
Coming soon, the Hollywood take (Score:2)
Eight Terran Out
I Feel So Betrayed... (Score:5, Funny)
This does deserve a story (Score:2, Informative)
More to the point, there is real talent, years of honing your skill, and real fans involved here. That's what makes this match fixing a real deal. That's too bad, this young sport deserves better.
Love is like Starcraft (Score:4, Interesting)
I really like watching commentaries on SC games. I started watching them a few weeks ago and I'm HOOKED.
Now I'm not a great RTS player. And I've never enjoyed watching sports on TV - basketball, football (English or otherwise) or even the way overhyped olympics - I just never cared.
But Starcraft is something I can somehow relate to. Especially Starcraft 2. myself, not being a good player, I see all sorts of strange tricks I wouldn't have seen otherwise.
Micromanagement tipping the results of battles in ways I wouldn't have even imagined. All kinds of strange tricks involved - it's mind-blowing sometimes, and really... really exciting.
The other thing is the commentators are very useful. They call out the strategy, which really helped a not-so-good player like me. you get some insight into their thought processes.
I knew Koreans were into Starcraft, but I didn't know they were THAT into it. I feel kinda sad now. As I see it, it doesn't matter who wins at Starcraft, I just like watching the game and could never imagine placing bets on it.
Cargo Cults (Score:2, Interesting)
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Further Information (Score:2, Informative)
Sport? (Score:3, Interesting)
Maybe I am just that ancient, but is it a "sport" to sit in a chair pushing buttons? When I grew up, apparently in the stone age, sport was something that involved not just skill, but physical excellence; even body-building wasn't considered to be a sport, and you wouldn't use the word "athlete" about them either. No wonder the world is coming to an end...
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And while we're on the topic, does anyone else have an issue with the use of , "of all time"?
I know it's technically correct to claim something like that, but jeez, at least have the "sport" in question going for 20 years - or a generation, say - before you start making such hyperbolic statements.
For example:
One can argue that Don Bradman was the greatest cricketer "of all time". Cricket, having been played in some form or another since the 16th century, has been around long enough that the use of the phras
is a golf a sport? (Score:3, Funny)
you walk and hit a ball. any old duffer can do that
is car racing a sport?
like you said, you sit down and push a buttons. now you've added a steering wheel
is poker a sport?
you fiddle with chips and cards. but those poker players are athletes of mental endurance, that's for sure
no, the simple fact is: a sport is anything you want to call a sport, a sport. and if enough people agree with you, it simply is the new truth
why? because there is no linguistic authority that allows people to use words in only proscri
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It's a sport when you talk about, it's a game when you play it.
Also you are very old.
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He's on Slashdot. He probably clicks that fast normally.
Actually, in all seriousness, 3 times a second, or 180 actions per minute) is fast for a starcraft player, but it is too slow for a Korean pro - only the slowest of them, such as Savior, average 200 over a game, while most average an APM Of 300-450 over the course of a 5-60 minute game, and peak at maybe 600 or so.
I can maybe hit 300-400 if I m
to put this in perspective... (Score:2)
Thanks to its enduring popularity there, blizzard first announced the upcoming Starcraft 2 at a South Korean gaming event.
Finally, from Wikipedia's page on South Korea:
In recent years online games have become a significant part of Korean culture. StarCraft, the real-time strategy game, is by far the most popular televised game in South Korea. Game tournaments, recorded in places lik
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I've travelled to korea a few times and I love going to a pub (every second shop) and watching the starcraft channel. And the cheap beer. And the cheap, excellent food. And just general good times to be had by all.
Fascinating to watch competitive gaming. Mesmerising.
Cheating at digital games (Score:2)
My world falls apart when hearing operators of apparatus do things with it that are perceived as dishonest. My respect for presentations of ordered bits lies smashed and shattered on the floor.
Now pardon me but I'll carry on working.
Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Informative)
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Speaking as a non-American... who the f**k is Lebron James???
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What he said...
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It was an example for Americans. Perhaps someone more like David Beckham is more up your alley as an example?
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Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Funny)
Speaking as a non-American... who the f**k is Lebron James???
Who knows. I haven't heard of him either. Best guess based on this story: He probably plays Warcraft instead of Starcraft.
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I seriously hope you guys are just being facetious. Not that I like 'bron, but he's pretty much as big now as MJ was back in the day. The dude has as many fans in China as Beckham probably has in the rest of the world (although he probably doesn't have near as many fans as Yao Ming, who is pretty much to the Chinese what MJ was to Americans). Seriously, if you don't know who Lebron is you either don't know what the fuck basketball is, are just making shit up, or are a borderline retard.
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Lebron James is pretty much the current poster boy for basketball in not only the US but the World. The only guy on the same level currently is honestly Kobe Bryant (and Shaq but to a much lesser extent than he used to be). Pretty much he's the Basketball equivalent of Peyton Manning (except without even the one Super Bowl ring or the hilarious commercials).
Re:A-list? What? (Score:4, Funny)
Yeah, see, telling a non-sports-loving, non-American nerd (me) that Lebron James is the basketball equivalent of Peyton Manning doesn't help, because then my next question inevitably is: Who the hell is Peyton Manning?
I suppose neither one of these guys has managed to have dozen mistresses at once, because I sure do know who Tiger Woods is.
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Aaah Jordan! I wondered what Michael Jackson had to do with sport...
Throw that boomerang a little harder next time... (Score:3, Insightful)
Seriously, if you don't know who Lebron is you either don't know what the fuck basketball is, are just making shit up, or are a borderline retard.
Despite your grossly misplaced arrogance, you left out the most popular option: D: none of the above.
You are making some erroneous assumptions with that proclamation:
I/we actually give a rat's ass about basketball, USA sports, or any sports....NOT!!!
(BTW, I know what basketball is-I even used to play a lot of it-but have NEVER watched it, but I did not know who/what a 'Lebron' was. I was also wondering what Michael Jackson [MJ] had to do with basketball!)
Maybe I am 'just making shit up, but if by not know
Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Interesting)
Basketball is much more popular here than it ever was in the U.S.
Also, when I was visiting Japan, baseball was by far the most popular sport, played by just about every boy after school.
The world is a lot bigger than the U.S. and Europe.
Re:A-list? What? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Informative)
A couple posts (e.g. the top one on this page [teamliquid.net]) dispute it's at that degree of popularity:
bjornkavist:
PanzerDragoon:
Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Insightful)
Probably because his name is typically written in Hangul?
Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Insightful)
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If you're an old person, ask your robot to do it.
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Hello, and welcome to the world! Despite what the crappy Disney ride says, the world is a big place, where many people speak any languages and, shockingly, use different characters for writing.
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Ma Jae-Yoon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ma_Jae-Yoon
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Ma+Jae-Yoon
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Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Informative)
mainly because you're a tool. Here is what a search of him in Korea looks like:
http://search.naver.com/search.naver?sm=tab_hty&where=nexearch&query=%B8%B6%C0%E7%C0%B1&x=0&y=0 [naver.com]
news sites, images, magazine covers, videos, etc
Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:A-list? What? (Score:5, Funny)
That's it, you're going on my foe list... :)
Re:A-list? What? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:and this relates to /. how? (Score:5, Insightful)
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In my book, game shattering is even bigger than revolutionary.
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Right, because everyone must be a native English speaker to spell, capitalize, and punctuate correctly.
For example, I'm not.
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>Capitalization and punctuation don't vary that much across languages
WTF ?!?!?! Seriously dude... WTF ?!?!??!
Let's just look at the small sampling of languages I can read (to a lesser or greater extent). And keep in mind three of these are all languages that share a COMMON Origin (Ancient West Germanic) and one is essentially a dialect of the another split of a mere 300 years ago. That makes this a pretty skewed sample. Choose any two languages randomly and the differences will get MUCH bigger.
German: Al
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Do these people have the tabloids after them? Leaked sex tapes by spurned beaus? Drug rehab every other month? No? How are they A-list celebrities then???
In Korea? Yes.
(Except maybe for the drug rehab...)
Professional gaming in Korea is on a whole other plane than it is in the West. I mean, many of these guys ~live~ in dedicated training camps (i.e. they eat, sleep and game in a building with other gamers) in preparation for big competitions, with rigorous daily schedules. It's serious business. (And I say that completely non-sarcastically)
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They were fornicating with a wicked Tape Drive (because what else are you going to do with that tape drive nowadays?)
Re:Who cares? (Score:5, Insightful)
Oh, I get it, you just wanted a first post and had nothing better to post than racism. Guess who looks stupid now?
Re:Who cares? (Score:4, Insightful)
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Is Chess a sport? What about Go?
If you said yes to both of those questions, why not any other game of strategy/tactics?
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Oh wow ... Google around for some documentaries on professional gamers in Korea and prepare to have your mind blown. These people are national celebrities and take home big fat paychecks.