Building a Gary Gygax Memorial 136
An anonymous reader writes "It looks like approval to build a memorial to E. Gary Gygax has been granted in Lake Geneva City, Wisconsin. The Gygax Memorial Fund is still taking donations for the memorial that may begin construction as early as later this year. I (like many on Slashdot) spent many years of my youth using Gygax inspired creations as an excuse to socialize, roll dice, and eat chips at impromptu gatherings before computers intruded on the RPG realms."
It's been done before (Score:2, Interesting)
http://laughingsquid.com/mit-hackers-pay-tribute-to-gary-gygax-with-giant-20-sided-die/ [laughingsquid.com]
Detailed map? (Score:5, Funny)
It damn well better... (Score:5, Funny)
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Well, at least I'm not designing it. There'd be at least one grue involved.
Re:It damn well better...Zork does not = D&D (Score:2)
Well, at least I'm not designing it. There'd be at least one grue involved.
Though it definitely paved the way for PC role playing games, Zork has F-All to do with Dungeons & Dragons.
There are probably Priests and a myriad other religious leaders around at the time that would lump any RPG in as tools of the devil, but they were wrong about it all. I'm surprised they are rallying against this proposed monument to Gygax.
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I think it'll just be a giant pile of books. Like every other nerd's personal memorial to him.
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I think it'll just be a giant pile of books. Like every other nerd's personal memorial to him.
I know you're joking, but that's not a bad idea. The ultimate memorial for someone known for producing books is a library.
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Excellent idea. It really should have a dungeon, but I would settle for a library with a big section on games theory.
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Not to worry. Maynard, a level 8 thief, will solve the budgeting problems, and quietly disappear.
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They should get sponsorship money from Doritos and R.C. Cola.
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...recreate your parent's basement
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Gary Gygax is of the original creators of Dungeons and Dragons (the pioneering fantasy role playing game) along with many other games via his company TSR and others.
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TSR? The same one that I wasted many hours having to find my way around, just so that I could play my computer games?
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Roleplaying and computer games are not the same thing. Sure a lot of computer games and MMORPGs bill themsleves as roleplaying games but that's not the reality, since there is practically no roleplaying in them. Many people play these games and think they are getting the next generation of roleplaying - they are not, they are getting computer gaming. The two experiences are as different as chalk and cheese, although many computer games are built on roleplaying game foundations, WoW is basically the Dungeons
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Are you referring to the dos TSRs [wikipedia.org]?
Design? (Score:3)
If the memorial isn't a 10-foot, bronze D20, I'm going to be very upset.
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Heh. Came here for this, leaving happy.
We can only hope (Score:1)
That it is
a maze of twisty little passages, all alike
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That is Adventure (aka Colossal Cave), not D&D, AD&D, etc.
It should be a randomly generated maze with ridiculously fatal traps every so often. Alas, we cannot have wandering monsters (presumably surviving by eating unsuccessful visitors) in the real world.
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They should really (Score:3)
Put a sphere of annihilation in the statue's mouth.
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Why do you think they built CERN? What is a better stand in for a sphere of annihilation than a miniature black hole? So far it hasn't quite worked, but they have some time before this is completed.
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Perhaps a museum or a statue, but not a memorial (Score:1)
Maybe I have to turn in my nerd card now, but I'm no more comfortable with memorializing Gary Gygax tha
Re:Perhaps a museum or a statue, but not a memoria (Score:4, Funny)
I'd endorse and support memorials for all 3.
Gary Gygax: For giving geeks and nerds something to do while all the popular kids were out drinking and having sex.
John Wayne: For not taking shit from anybody (his bronze statue needs to be electrified so he doesn't even take crap from pigeons).
You know, forget the memorial.... We just need to clone the Duke.
Madonna: For the "Like a Virgin" years....when she was still hot....I want to remember the hot Madonna.
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We just need to clone the Duke.
It would take forever to make, and it would not be as cool as the original anyway.
Re:Perhaps a museum or a statue, but not a memoria (Score:4, Funny)
John Fucking Wayne. Our family would build our own memorial to that man.
Every family reunion for as long as I can remember... there would be a fight over John Wayne. The rest of us had bettintg pools over him.
One relative was a real Macho tough SOB. The Duke? You don't insult the Duke and walk away.. you crawl away.
One relative was a flaming gay man. With conspiracy theories.
I won the pot one year by guessing how many glasses of wine and at what time the Duke would be accused of being gay and part of the grand homosexual conspiracy in Hollywood and how many minutes it would take for us to have to hold the first relative back from killing the latter relative.
We had first aid kits handy :)
Ahhh.... the memories. Thank you Duke.
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People can build memorials to whomever they want. Towns can choose to commemorate notable citizens in whatever way they see fit. No offense, but honestly who cares what you feel "comfortable" with?
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Other than that I'm not demanding that anyone care, except that every person has some level of influence over what is acceptable and I'm putting in my small opinion. Not to mention that contrary opinions are usually quite valuable in avoiding serious missteps, even if all they do is help the majority refine their preexisting opinion.
As for why
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There is no excuse whatsoever for modding my last comment a troll. It was patient, clear, and civil to a fault, other than pointing out as an aside the passive-aggressiveness and general pointlessness of the phrase "no offense".
Just because I disagree with you does not mean that everything I say is a deliberate attempt to piss you off.
As for the first one being modded flamebait, please recall that there is no "-1, I disagree with the poster" moderation option.
Get a fucking life
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Maybe I have to turn in my nerd card now, but I'm no more comfortable with memorializing Gary Gygax than I am with a marble statue of John Wayne or Madonna.
Thinking that Gygax doesn't deserve a memorial doesn't disqualify you from geekhood any more than hating BSG and Babylon 5 would, or thinking that VB is the ultimate programming language would. Not knowing who he is (or any of the other things I mentioned) on the other hand, barring relative youth, definitely would disqualify you.
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Maybe I have to turn in my nerd card now, but I'm no more comfortable with memorializing Gary Gygax than I am with a marble statue of John Wayne or Madonna.
Thinking that Gygax doesn't deserve a memorial doesn't disqualify you from geekhood any more than hating BSG and Babylon 5 would, or thinking that VB is the ultimate programming language would. Not knowing who he is (or any of the other things I mentioned) on the other hand, barring relative youth, definitely would disqualify you.
Of course. No one ever lost a geek card for being argumentative.
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Maybe I have to turn in my nerd card now, but I'm no more comfortable with memorializing Gary Gygax than I am with a marble statue of John Wayne or Madonna. Prima facie, I don't see this as anything but another example of going too far in deifying celebrities and glorifying entertainment at the expense of more important things.
You're probably also against the Robocop statue in Detroit, aren't you? Philistine.
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statue of John Wayne
You mean that famous one at the John Wayne Airport in California? Or the one of him on horseback on Wilshire Blvd, Beverly Hills? Or the one in the Cowboy Musuem? Or the one at the future $5.5m John Wayne Birthplace Museum And Learning Centre?
[statue of] Madonna.
Then never visit a catholic country.
and glorifying entertainment at the expense of more important things.
Dude, they're taking public donations. It's not like they're somehow taking statues out of the mouths of starving children in Africa. I promise you people piss their money away on stupider things than a bunch of geeks memorialising s
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Mod parent +1d10, exploding
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I may be splitting linguistic hairs here, but for my money full-fledged memorials are reserved for humanitarians or political, scientific, and military heroes.
You mean like Robocop? [msn.com]
Dungeon master says no (Score:1)
No (Score:2, Insightful)
No. Let Hasbro build a frickin' monument. I 'paid' for it over the years by buying D&D and AD&D stuff. He was a businessman. Now that he is dead, our business is concluded.
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I have to admit though, if I were passing through I would totally visit the memorial and scream 'Black Leaf is dead! Get out of here, you don't exist any more!'
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Since Gary's death a number of former TSR employee's and Gary's family have been organizing GaryCon in his honor. As word spreads each year, the attendance keeps growing. While it will likely never match GenCon, there is now a reason for old school gaming geeks to visit Lake Geneva.
That is pretty cool.
Plus, all the cons & stuff leaving the Lake Geneva area, and Hasbro making money was done *after* Gary was forced out; not his fault.
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Eh its public donations, not forced taxes paying for this.
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Speaking of accusations of trolling... how exactly did your post get modded up +1?
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"Someone is trolling teh interwebs! zOMG!"
The CITY of LAKE GENEVA (in Wisconsin) (Score:1)
Not "Lake Geneva City"
A more profound effect than one might recall (Score:5, Interesting)
Incidentally, it's a 503(c) organization [gygaxmemorialfund.com] -- tax-deductible in the US.
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Re:A more profound effect than one might recall (Score:4, Insightful)
I think a lot of it has to do with impressions. It sounds a lot less like an internet scam to most people if they've bothered to get the 501(c)3 approval.
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If you own a home, your mortgage interest deduction generally exceeds your standard deduction (at least for the first decade or so), so tax-deductible whatever becomes more significant. Even more so if you're also self-employed, and pay the flat 7.5% self-employment social security tax on top of your regular federal tax.
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Heh damnit sir, you made me forego my Powers of Moderation to apply.
What Gary Gygax showed was the Monty Haul effect, spelling variances intended. That terms mean that once you reach the sane limits of stimulation, you have nowhere to go but "boring".
Deadly lesson, worth its weight if you can really get it.
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How so, monty haul is only one sort of gaming, usually the result of a bad GM. Hardly stimulation.
Re:Monty Haul (Score:2)
Hmm, maybe I scrambled my words a little.
I meant that it was RPG's that introduced me to the problem of what happens when the GM *is* unskilled, as in a classic pitfall to be avoided each and every campaign.
Then later, musing on it, I saw some IRL connections at the symbolic level. Monty Haul caught up with the car companies in the form of the SUV craze. SUV's are "leveled up cars". Why own some stinkin' compact when you can have your own civillian tank? Except ... other factors sent gas to $4 a gallon, and
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SUVs were a logical reaction to increasing CAFE standards that didn't include small trucks. They allowed car companies to offer full-size vehicles without having to invest in increasing the milage of their vehicles.
Range Rovers actually were heavy enough to qualify for tax credits as a "work truck" because of their weight, making them very affordable for anyone that was able to claim the car as a business expense...
Should it be a dragon in a dungeon? (Score:2)
Dave Arneson (Score:5, Insightful)
I hope the memorial succeeds. I believe Gary Gygas deserves one. I also believe Dave Arneson should get one. It is often glossed over that Dave Arneson was the co-creator of Dungeons & Dragons. I have read different postings concerning the origins of Dungeons & Dragons, and many of them point to the main idea of it was created by Dave Arneson, and Gary came along and said that it could be made into a product. Then Garry spent a long time categorizing the rules and expanding them. What a great game it was!
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Not quite right.
Dave came up with the fantasy aspect, some of the basics of the magic system, and about half the overall idea; Gary came up with the combat, concept of mapping, and about 40% of the original idea. after the pamphlets, he just wasn't involved that much. Gary never denied he came up with half of the original idea. He did get a little disgruntled when people discounted the fact that he took it from a garage business to a multimillion dollar empire essentially by himself.
But AD&D and everyth
Hall of Fame (Score:4, Interesting)
When I was in junior high I went to a gaming convention where I played D&D with Gary Gygax, Tracy Hickman (author of the Dragonlance series), and Larry Niven. It was the Ravenloft module that Tracy had written, so naturally he was the DM. Watching those guys spin the fable was an amazing experience I've never forgotten, and it set a bar for fantasy gaming that no computer game has ever come close to surpassing. Maybe it's because in a computer game no one ever gets into character and brings pathos to the role. Sure, the mechanics and special effects of computers are great, but nobody really gets emotionally attached to their character (beyond how much time they spend levelling up) and...the storytelling just isn't there.
All these years later I realize that that evening with Gary, Larry, and Tracy and the other players was like our generation's equivalent of hanging out with Jack Kerouac and Allan Ginsberg at the height of the Beat era.
I hope they build Gary a monument that pays proper homage all the young imaginations he fired and lives he influenced. RIP, Gary.
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Bingo, nail on the head. TTRPGS and computer games are a completely different experience.
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Screw those assholes! Playing with those guys must have been awesome, I would treasure such a night as you obviously do. wow
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Maybe it's because in a computer game no one ever gets into character and brings pathos to the role. Sure, the mechanics and special effects of computers are great, but nobody really gets emotionally attached to their character (beyond how much time they spend levelling up) and...the storytelling just isn't there.
Roleplay-enforced MUDs might be right up your alley.
In an inner chamber of the memorial... (Score:4, Funny)
...exhume his skull, embed gems into it, and put it on a table. That would really screw with those in the know.
"Tower of Gygax" Escapist article, April 2010 (Score:3)
Saving throw versus city bureaucrats successful! (Score:2)
You can build your statue now
I've lived it XD (Score:3)
I grew up playing plenty of DnD in the 1980s.
One of the neatest things in my lifetime was when I got my first "computer-related" job in a small industrial park a few doors down from the old TSR Hobbies. They still had a sign out on the end of the road.
I don't expect anyone to be impressed by that, but I sure found it to be cool.
In accordance with his will... (Score:3)
...Gary is to be reanimated into a 12 foot tall iron statue with a poisonous breath attack.
He died as he lived - immune to most magical attacks (except lightning, which acts as a Slow) and to weapons less than +3.
Gygax statue. Dodecahedral plinth plz. (Score:1)
I hope... (Score:1)
Visting memorial grants +5 experience +2 healing (Score:2)
The memorial needs at least 10 folding card tables and a refrigerator of Mountain Dew.
"I wanna cast Magic Missile!!!"
It Should Be A Giant d20. (Score:2)
Old saying (Score:2)
Re:Who is Gary Gygax? (Score:5, Funny)
Would it have been so hard to use the summary to reveal who Gary Gygax is? It's not like he's a famous geek like John Bardeen.
I'm sorry, but I'll have to ask you to turn in your geek card. You... (rolls dice) ...disgust me.
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While I semi-agree...a part of me thinks we should probably start admitting we're just getting old and haven't done our jobs in passing the torch down to the younger generations. Alienating some poor lad isn't going to help them on their epic quest. /diplomacy.
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I agree. That hawguy .... (fails saving throw) ... makes me sick.
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How am I supposed to know who the hell he was?
Futurama. Duh.
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Not in 1978 there wasn't, especially where I was in Northern Michigan. Pretty much the only computer in town ran the local cherry growers' cooperative, good luck even touching that. History of video gaming? Yes, I guess you could have looked up who wrote Space Invaders and Asteroids, and that would have been the end of your hobby. Gary Gygax gave those of us stranded in podunk towns an outlet for our imagination and a way to find other nerds so that we were
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Nerd card revoked, get the fuck out of here.
It wasn't so much a card as a character sheet.
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Would it have been so hard to use the summary to reveal who Gary Gygax is? It's not like he's a famous geek like John Bardeen.
Unless you are under 25, you must turn in your geek card...Gary Gygax was the founder of TSR, which produced the RPG Dungeons and Dragons, now owned by Wizards of the Coast.
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Sure you were, cool guy. Now please go away.
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Sure you were, cool guy. Now please go away.
Hey, what can I say, I wasn't a traditional geek in high school, never touched a computer until I took an intro to programming class, spent more time in the gym than studying and was a Child Development major in college (which meant I was surrounded by eligible (and willing!) women). It wasn't until later that I let my true geek emerge and ended up with a Master's in Computer Science (after a short stint as a physics major). And yes, it took me a long time to graduate, but I had a lot of fun along the way!
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you got pussy they got, well, they know who gary gygax is. I'll take the pussy 7 days a week.
Clearly you've never played DnD.
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Oh, that.
I was out having sex while my geek friends were playing D&D.
Presumably with an image of John Bardeen.
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I was out having sex AND playing D&D - you loser
Re:Who is Gary Gygax? (Score:5, Funny)
I was out having sex AND playing D&D - you loser
Sounds fun! I put on my robe and wizard hat.
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* Rolls d20 *
Ooh, sorry, you're still a virgin.
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>>I was out having sex while my geek friends were playing D&D.
Some of my geek friends in the area are married and have at least one kid each, so the odds are pretty good they've had sex along the way, while maintaining weekly D&D games since they were in middle school.
To each his own. I'd recommend giving it a shot, though, if you've never played it. Forget 4th edition D&D - it's for kindergarteners. Go with either 1st or 2nd edition if you want to get a feel for the game how Gygax designe
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(lots of random tables for everything - want to know what sort of artwork you just looted? There's a table for that),
I think the best example of this is the 1E DMG's random whore encounter table, where you can discover whether you've run into a brazen strumpet or an opportunistic doxy or a sly pimp or what have you.
Yes, you have that right: Not only can you randomly encounter prostitutes, but you then roll on another table to find out what kind.
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Having played AD&D 2nd ed., and loved it at the time... I'd recommened holding onto those fond memories tightly and never letting go... but don't ever go back.
3rd was good, 3.5 obviated some of the need for house rules and was generally a minor improvement (which is as billed, so my only criticism was that it seemed a bit cash-grabby). 4th ed. is a steaming pile of goblin poo.
Personally, I recommend switching to Pathfinder. It's essentially a fork of 3.5, possible because of the open gaming license and
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>>Having played AD&D 2nd ed., and loved it at the time... I'd recommened holding onto those fond memories tightly and never letting go... but don't ever go back.
You make a good point about Pathfinder. I was involved in the beta testing process for it, and it's a really well designed system by Jason Buhlman (who used to be Iuz in the Living Greyhawk days).
But just as a bit of historical interest, it could be fun for someone to play AD&D who has never tried it before. The casual brutality, even