UK's Largest Specialist Video Games Retailer Enters Administration 172
RogueyWon writes "The GAME Group, owners of high street chains GAME and Gamestation, which between them account for a large majority of the UK's specialist games retail market, have entered into administration. In the hours following the Group's entry into administration, hundreds of stores were closed and thousands of staff made redundant. While some of the factors behind the Group's downfall, such as stores located too close to each other and overly-ambitious international expansion, were likely unique to the UK-based company, other factors, such as price competition from supermarkets and online retailers, as well as a reliance on a fickle pre-owned games market, may have wider application."
Not a surprise (Score:5, Interesting)
Doesn't surprise me, for a variety of reasons.
As mentioned in TFS, they were crazy when it came to sotre placement. In my town, there were two GAME stores and one Gamestation all on the same shopping high street. There used to be a third GAME in a department store two minutes walk away, and there was briefly a fourth GAME directly opposite one of the current two. They all stocked exactly the same thing, with no great specialisation. What on earth did they think they were trying to acheve?
Another reason- failure to move into the online space themselves. They do do online retailing these days, but they compare poorly to the likes of Amazon. When you're sat at your keyboard, and you open two websites, and one has a betteer range and is cheaper than the other, why would you use the latter? Instead of capitalising on their huge brand presence, they just let themselves slip. their digital download service isn't even run by them- it's just a rebadge of a whole different company's website.
A bigger reason, though, was just that they weren't pleasant places to be. They're competing against souless supermarkets and anonymous online mail-order companies. So what was their solution? Become as souless and supermarket-like as possible. Cram in as many shelves as possible, with no aisle space, no demo machines, no nice displays. Gaming is obviously a hobby which a lot of people take quite seriously, but instead of trying to tap into that sense of a hobbyist community, and trying to become a hub for that (lucrative) community, they just focussed on selling as many things as possible as efficiently as possible- something they couldn't hope to win on, against their competition. Compare and contrast with Games Workshop (seller of tabletop games and models); gangs of enthusiastic hobbyists hang around in there for hours at a time, playing games against each other, organising competitions, soaking up the atmosphere. You can buy Games Workshop models cheaper online or through some of the resellers- but the flagship shop is the place to be, and so is where most people buy their stuff from.
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A local store recently dropped their whole computer-game area and replaced it with more books and board games as well as expanding their 'props' space.
With the way games in general are shifting to online systems it was a better way to go about it for them. That was the gist of things when I spoke to the owner a while back. There was little profit in it, but it took a significant amount of space. They had not lost any sales by removing the merchandise at all.. Hell, they improved their sales of books as they
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The article alluded to the one benefit bricks and mortar games stores can offer, unfortunately it's one thing Game never got right. It specifically says game stores are needed so that customers can try before they buy, yet Game and Gamestation where always awful for this. If you were lucky there'd be one or two consoles switched on, more often than not the controllers wouldn't be hooked up so there was no "trying" component, and god forbid you ask them to reconnect them or, even worse, throw in a different
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Doesn't surprise me, for a variety of reasons.
As mentioned in TFS, they were crazy when it came to sotre placement. In my town, there were two GAME stores and one Gamestation all on the same shopping high street. There used to be a third GAME in a department store two minutes walk away, and there was briefly a fourth GAME directly opposite one of the current two. They all stocked exactly the same thing, with no great specialisation. What on earth did they think they were trying to acheve?
This one always confuses me. It isn't unique to games shops - go into any city centre and you will find like shops clustered together (here we have a bunch of banks all on the same street, the next street over there are a bunch of jewellers, etc.) I can only assume that it must work, otherwise they wouldn't do it, but I'm at a loss to understand why.
On the other hand, after hearing GAME's previous announcements about their financial problems, none of this surprises me: they appeared to have run the busine
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This is also one of the reasons Woolworths went under a few years ago.
GAME/Gamestation had an outright monopoly on highstreet gaming up until a few years ago when Supermarkets started stocking AAA titles (rather than the usual bargain basement rubbish they used to), and even then Supermarkets are hardly High Street.
In my City, Glasgow, we had about 5 in the City Center alone (including a kiosk in Hamleys Toy shop, which is in the SAME shopping center as a fully-fledge GAME store), and about 8 in total when
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It works with some competitors (Score:2)
Car sales are an area you often see it. Car dealers will cluster together. Reason is when people are shopping for a car, they are often willing to shop at multiple places and they are more likely to go to you if you are in an area where one goes to buy cars. If you are the one guy out where there's nothing else, you probably get visited less.
However what it doesn't work for is the same store. You also never see that. Competing with yourself is stupid. So while a Walmart might move in next to a Target to try
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However what it doesn't work for is the same store. You also never see that. Competing with yourself is stupid.
Except you do see it, all the time, it's really really common. In pretty much any city centre in the UK it is common to see Blacks and Millets next door to each other - they are both "outdoor gear" stores owned by the same company selling pretty much the same stuff (ok, so they started off as separate companies, but they've been the same company for years and years and have ample opportunity to thin the shops out and yet they haven't).
In the city I live in, H. Samuel (Jewellers) have 2 shops about 200 metr
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This is a deliberate marketing move. When Tesco started opening up Express stores all over the place Sainsburys had to fight back. The reason being that if you get used to nipping to a Tesco Express to buy convenience items you are more likely to shift your main weekly shop to Tesco due to the familiar product range, loyalty card etc. By opening Sainsburys Local stores right next to them they can pretty much guarantee that
Re:It works with some competitors (Score:5, Insightful)
While they are both Outdoor equipment/clothing retailers Blacks and Millets were aimed at very different markets. Millets was aimed squarely at family campers and casual hikers, whereas Blacks was more specialised and aimed at serious hikers, campers, climbers etc. The seperate stores allowed them to target their stock and marketing at their particular markets more successfully.
This kind of differentiation is important when you have very disparate groups of customers. Serious hikers/campers/climbers are pretty snobby about their gear so the product ranges they demand are higher end and higher price, the kind of stuff that puts off casual shoppers.
Of course in the end both stores have suffered from the prevalence of big warehouse style outdoor equipment stores that have cheaper prices and enough space to effectively service both markets. Millets is now effectively dead and Blacks is seriously struggling.
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Millets was aimed squarely at family campers and casual hikers, whereas Blacks was more specialised and aimed at serious hikers, campers, climbers etc.
Not really. They both sold extremely similar stock, and I wouldn't call any of it "serious" in either case. No, Blacks didn't sell any climbing or mountaineering equipment.
Of course in the end both stores have suffered from the prevalence of big warehouse style outdoor equipment stores that have cheaper prices and enough space to effectively service both markets. Millets is now effectively dead and Blacks is seriously struggling.
I think this is because they were both pitched at the casual outdoors people, which is something that the big stores deal with just as well (e.g. Go Outdoors, Cotswold, etc). The more specialist stores that really do cator to more serious people are still going strong - people like Joe Brown, V12, Needlesports, Up & Under - these a
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About 2-3 years after both have been rebadged Santander, one will close.
Pretty sure they've both been Santander for over 3 years already.. I keep expecting the smaller one to close, but it hasn't happened yet.
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Clustered stores make sense as long as they're different companies, after all they're competing with each other and when they cluster that's usually a sign that the area has a lot of people looking for that kind of store. Having redundant stores or banks of the same company is where it gets weird.
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Clustered stores make sense as long as they're different companies, after all they're competing with each other and when they cluster that's usually a sign that the area has a lot of people looking for that kind of store.
It makes sense where the stores have different stock, so people want to shop around to figure out which thing to buy: if you're buying a big ticket item like a car, a house, etc then you're going to want to do some serious browsing before putting down some money, so clustering estate agents, car dealerships, etc makes sense.
On the other hand, a cluster of computer game shops, all selling exactly the same selection of games, aren't going to attract a lot of pre-purchase browsing: you know that the product yo
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Easy. When people go shopping for one item, they usually want to buy a complete outfit. Like buying a new suit with matching shoes, tie, shirt and cufflinks. Same with necklace, earrings and rings. Usually each store will specialize in one particular combination of material like gemstones or metals, and recommend the other shops for other items.
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This one always confuses me. It isn't unique to games shops - go into any city centre and you will find like shops clustered together (here we have a bunch of banks all on the same street, the next street over there are a bunch of jewellers, etc.) I can only assume that it must work, otherwise they wouldn't do it, but I'm at a loss to understand why.
It's not a new phenomenon. Roman cities were actually designed like this, with all of a particular type of shop being on the same street. You can still see some street names that are relics of this, being corruptions of the latin for 'street of butchers' or 'street of bakers'. It made life easy for shoppers, because if you wanted to buy meat, you went to the street of butchers. If one butcher didn't have what you wanted, you'd go to the next one.
The same logic still applies today. If you have shops
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The hammock district!
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A friend of mine works in the industry (for Rebellion) and he said that publishers were annoyed about them selling second hand games. Obviously a second hand game produces no revenue for the publisher, and yet Game wanted special deals on new games too. Publishers declined and they ended up not being able to compete with the discounts offered in other shops and online.
I always found Gamestation a nice enough chain of shops, a bit crowded perhaps but with a good selection of gear and reasonable prices. I thi
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I wonder if publishers requiring purchasers of second hand games to re-register and pay some more money in order to use the second-hand game contributed to the downfall of Game.
Maybe second hand game sales didn't help the publisher directly, but maybe it helped their channel, and maybe it helped fund the purchase of new games for those who sold the second hand games or traded them in when buying new games.
How bad were these unintended consequences for Game?
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Rebellion is probably more impacted by that as their games lately were pretty weak and people are more likely to trade them in for the meagre amount of money that stores like GameStop offer. On the other hand you got companies like Nintendo whose flagship games (not all games but their biggest sellers like Mario Kart or New Super Mario Bros) still cost full price even 5 years after release and few used copies are in circulation because demand far exceeds the trade-in supply (also the trade-in values remain
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Second hand games offer no revenue to the publisher, true. But stopping them will also affect sales of new games.
People, especially kids, only have so much to spend on games. If they can't sell old games then they won't put that money towards a new purchase. People who were buying second hand will now also be buying new, which will offset that to some extent, but they'll be buying less as well.
The turd in the punchbowl were the likes of Game that gave sellers 5 bucks a game, then turned around and resold fo
Re:Not a surprise (Score:5, Interesting)
GAME and EB Games will join the other retail dinosaurs like Harvey Norman in retail extinction.
And staff it with people who know nothing about games.
EB games Australia have gone one step further and play annoying techno way too loud. If I do buy a game locally (I.E. I want it today and am willing to pay the premium) I'll generally walk down the street to the nearest JB, no music, easy to find stuff and slightly cheaper.
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The EB games at Broadway in Sydney actually had some real gamers on staff - at least for a while. I had a good chat with a guy there about where to buy retro games (PS1 and earlier stuff) and he seemed knowledgeable and interested.
The retial price of games here is crazy though. It's a relic from the days of poor exchange rates. The dollar went up 50% in value, but the price of games stayed the same. It doesn't surprise me that physical game stores that don't work hard to add value are in trouble though. Mos
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The EB games at Broadway in Sydney actually had some real gamers on staff - at least for a while. I had a good chat with a guy there about where to buy retro games (PS1 and earlier stuff) and he seemed knowledgeable and interested.
Most stores just hire bog standard retail teens. They are more interested in getting the soccer mum through the door with her 6 whining kids.
BTW, when did the PS1 become retro? (blows into cartridge and shakes walking stick at youths)
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About ten years ago, IIRC!
(/loads head alignment tape into commodore 64 tape drive...)
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I just ordered Ninja Gaiden 3 (yeah, I know, it's supposed to be bad, but I liked the last two) from amazon US for 56 US bucks. EB wanted 98 AUD.
Steam and some other online game distributors also play this trick, ripping off the Australian market, and it can be harder to work aroud them if you don't have a foreign credit card.
I was just about to post similar (Score:2)
Last time I went in, was to have a look at a Vita. I knew it was cheaper online, but hadn't (and still haven't) actually got my hands on one to play with it. I'd assumed due to the window sized poster, there'd be a demo pod inside, bundle deals etc. When I went in... well there was a big poster listing the not-very-good-deals
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Common anti-shoplifting measure.
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It's now seen to have been important for Game to have noted that anti-theft alone is not the same as pro-sales, as goldcd points out nicely.
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Once we've removed Game and the high street is no longer saturated with mediocrity, smaller chains and indies may return and offer something better.
IMO you'd have to be pretty crazy to open a game store at this point, afaict most games stores make their real money on preowned games but many PC games already have anti-resale measures and console vendors are looking in that direction too.
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I think the key thing for me is how little consideration GAME's management gave to what their key strengths ought to be set against supermarkets on the one hand and online retailers on the other.
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Excellent journal entries, I'd advise anyone with a little time to go read them. On the credit front, my GF was one of the lucky ones. She'd pre-ordered Mass Effect 3 for me and when we received notification that they couldn't meet the order as they'd been refused stock (and gave us a £5 voucher to make up for it) I instantly realised we were talking days or weeks rather than months or years left on the clock for Game and told her to cash the voucher and her ~£25 of loyalty points in.
I can under
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Gaming is obviously a hobby which a lot of people take quite seriously, but instead of trying to tap into that sense of a hobbyist community, and trying to become a hub for that (lucrative) community, they just focussed on selling as many things as possible as efficiently as possible- something they couldn't hope to win on, against their competition. Compare and contrast with Games Workshop (seller of tabletop games and models); gangs of enthusiastic hobbyists hang around in there for hours at a time, playing games against each other, organising competitions, soaking up the atmosphere. You can buy Games Workshop models cheaper online or through some of the resellers- but the flagship shop is the place to be, and so is where most people buy their stuff from.
I wonder if the video and board / miniatures gamers represent two vary different markets, because of their two very different social aspects.
Miniatures and board games almost always require an opponent and face to face play to be enjoyable; much of the fun is in the interaction and, with miniatures, seeing how others have painted them and showing off your creations. Rules are to be argued over, historical authenticity debated, and playing fields to be created. In short, it is a very social activity, much l
Black employee humour (Score:5, Funny)
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This makes me glad to be Irish. And even gladder not to work in GAME.
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Our local one had a sign in the window yesterday saying "We're closed, your nearest store is now Slough" and then Slough had been crossed out and Reading written in... I presume they learned they were closing, put up temporary signs, then found out that their neighbour was closing too.
Today they had specially printed signs in place. Can't imagine it was much fun arranging that.
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Yeah, I suspect you got hit reflexively for that. Maybe a kind mod will correct the issue. Your post is quite relevant. Interesting and/or funny.
Good things too (Score:2)
While it's sad when people have to lose their jobs I do feel that it's mostly a good thing that online marketplaces are taking over the traditional store model for games (and other software too). By far the most interesting games I've played lately have been made by small independent teams. Lower barriers for entry into the business makes it easier for independents to get a shot.
Unfortunately, the online marketplaces, especially on consoles, are also in effect a monopoly on the platform. But that will likel
Digital distribution and death of second hand (Score:5, Interesting)
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This WAS part of GAME's own failings.
When I bought Dawn of War II from them a few years back I complained to them about the fact I had to activate via Steam, and specifically that Steam wasn't letting me activate at first. I pointed out that the whole reason I bought a physical copy was so that I didn't have to deal with stupid online systems restricting what I could do with a product I'd paid for. I complained because whilst there was mention of activation, there was no mention that I'd have to create acco
DD isn't near to killing retail (Score:2)
It'll probably happen, but it is a long way off. People who use it tend to think it has since we tend to switch over. I rarely buy retail games these days, DD is too convenient. However that leads to a skewed perception. The majority of sales are still physical. Even for titles that are available DD, it is still mostly physical. Stardock says about 4:1 physical to DD for them.
Then you take the fact that many titles aren't available digital on consoles, and consoles are big markets. PC gamers sometimes forge
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Steam, sure but the others aren't replacements for retail stores as they offer completely different products.
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There was one more aspect to this, the banks. RBS (yewp, thwe bank that had to be bailed out and is now owned by the UK taxpayer) didn't want to allow full use of the credit facilities it already had in place (games retail is a very cyclic business, and we;re just about at the bottom, waiting for new consoles), which made suppliers very nervous about supplying games to Game. This meant Game failed to get any revenue from big titles such as Mass Effect 3, and this pushed it over the edge.
RBS than received a
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I used to work for GAME many many years ago in their digital division. We had the developers, network infrastructure, industry clout (at the time) and the strategy to create Steam before Steam even existed. We were incredibly motivated to do this, basically it was why we'd all been hired. We all knew digital distribution was the future.
In the end the then board decided "forget the internet, we ship boxes". The entire digital team was disbanded and moved to other departments. Just one of many, many mistakes
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600 jobs lost already (Score:2)
It's going to have a massive effect on unemployment in Basingstoke. The only good thing is that my daughter didn't get a job at GAME when she went for an interview there about 18mths ago.
Actually many didn't (Score:2)
A lot of game retailers really didn't (and some still haven't) noticed DD as a growing thing. An example would be Gamestop. You'd think they'd have been in on this from the fairly early days. Their whole business is games so it would be highly relevant. Well, no they had no DD presence and ignored it until it was already huge. They are in it now, but because they bought Impulse from Stardock. It was an already established DD service, quite an old on in fact (Impulse grew out of Stardock Central which came o
In Australia... (Score:4, Insightful)
Not sure what GAME uk's demise means for the australian game line, but i keep wondering how they *STAY* in business. They are consistently higher then everyone else simply for price.
Consider their biggest competitor in the retail market is probably a place called JB hifi, and in shopping centers they're often so close (physically) together that you can see the big tags advertising their price for games (Specially up coming and new release ones). Yet, GAME au's prices are always more expensive.
When they go out of business in AU, I will not be supprised. I've bought games from them (but only second hand ones, and at most 3 - typically jbhifi is cheaper for those as well). But AU's model can be summed up in 3 links:
http://www.game.com.au/diablo-iii/pc-games/DIABLO3PC [game.com.au]
http://www.jbhifionline.com.au/game/pc-games/diablo-3/654000 [jbhifionline.com.au]
http://www.game-lane.com.au/pc-mac-games/2782-diablo-iii-3-pc.html [game-lane.com.au]
To me, in AU, its not "how did they go out of business" its "how do they stay alive?".
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GAME was crap (Score:3)
So you have an (over) saturation of stores in prime rent locations selling a commodity, poor customer loyalty thanks to GAME's own business practices, a recession, and increasing competition from supermarkets, online stores and digital downloads. GAME didn't bother responding in any meaningful way to any of these threats and so it lost a lot of money and went bust. It sucks for the employees but it really isn't a surprise that it happened.
Going into administration is probably the best chance it has of surviving. The creditors can cut the store down to size which might ultimately whip it into a survivable shape.
In short: (Score:5, Funny)
Video Game Retailer Modded "Redundant -1"
Trade-in prices (Score:4, Interesting)
Trade-in prices is what put me off going to Game. I'd take in something recent, like, say, Street Fighter X Tekken and they'd give me maybe 13GBP for it, or 16 if it wasn't "scratched". They'd then sell it second hand for 30GBP (or 28 if it doesn't come with instructions or a box).
Meanwhile, the independent shop near it, CEX, would give me 28GBP cash, or 30GBP exchange.
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they'd give me maybe 13GBP for it, or 16 if it wasn't "scratched". They'd then sell it second hand for 30GBP (or 28 if it doesn't come with instructions or a box).
Funny that you mention that game. The GAME nearest to me is selling it second-hand for £39.99. A quick search on Zavvi tells me that they're selling the Xbox360 version, brand new, for £36.95 [zavvi.com]
The other big game that they're not selling new, Mass Effect 3, is also £39.99 second-hand in my local GAME branch. I'd check prices for that, but I'm lazy, and can confirm seeing new copies being sold for somewhere in the £30 range.
As for price reductions for copies of games without boxes or ma
Can be expressed in two words: (Score:2, Funny)
Game over.
"to enter administration" = ??? (Score:2)
It would be great if someone used terms more familiar to those international folks who don't know British law :-)
Does it mean they went bankrupt (as summary seems to say), under investigation (which forced closing the stores), became a public administration entity (who then decided to close some of the shops), or what?
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Roughly similar to Chapter 11 in the US, which even if you're not from the US is fairly widely know.
I'll miss my local GAME (Score:2)
The GAME store in Dundrum, Ireland has/had (I'm not certain if it is closed) some great staff. They always seemed really into the games they sold, and never offered any kind of judgement.
I once pre-ordered WotLK expansion in Gamestop in Bray (Wicklow, Ireland) and I was excited to play it, so had taken 3 days off work and arrived the morning it launched at the shop door, just as they were opening. There were 3-4 other people there waiting for the store to open. When the clerk arrived and opened the door, yo
Not joking about shops close together (Score:2)
My home town has 2 GAME shops that are less than 100 yards apart, and a further GameStation shop less than 5 minutes walk away. This never made any sense to me. Besides, you can buy games in at least 3 other shops nearby. If this is normal, there's no wonder they are going into administration.
The demise of GAME may be sad for the staff in the shops, but for anyone else, this is hardly that upsetting. Someone else will take over, and hopefully do a better job at running their business.
Not suprising. (Score:2)
You think you can be a game retailer for long and get away with things like that?
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They didn't refuse - they couldn't get the finance to pay the distributor for the copies, so the distributor would not supply them.
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3 stores in one shopping centre (Score:2)
In one shopping centre in Essex, they had 3 stores. None of these stores sold anything that you couldn't get at the others, and the floor space in two of them was quite large.
As well as competing with themselves, there are 4 other stores in the centre that _also_ sell console games.
When my wife and I saw all of these stores open we took a bet that it would be 6 months before Game went bust. It turns out it took 18, but we were close enough.
Re:Translate (Score:4, Informative)
I think administration means the same thing. The company is no longer running its business. Someone else has been brought in to run things either to fix the problems or bring it into bankruptcy.
In most modern countries its illegal to trade while insolvent.
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In most modern countries its illegal to trade while insolvent.
Not so. In most countries I know of, a court appointed administrator is then responsible for the company, and it's up to him to reach an agreement with the creditors how to proceed. The main reason behind the whole insolvency procedure is to avoid conflicts with and between the creditors. They should be able to recoup as much as possible of the outstanding debt, and their demands against the debitor are ranked in a law defined order. If the counsil of creditors finds that reorganizing and getting on with th
Re:Translate (Score:5, Informative)
Translates roughly into 'chapter 11' for the US.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_11,_Title_11,_United_States_Code [wikipedia.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administration_(law)#United_Kingdom [wikipedia.org]
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Apparently it translates to "Flamebait" and "Offtopic" on Slashdot.
Re:Not competitive (Score:4, Informative)
I've been to a Gamestop here in the US, a used copy of a game was $14 and the new one was $12 in the same store and the clerks still tried to pursued me to buy used. They were unable to give a satisfactory reason beyond their profit margins are better (oh, and it's worth more customer loyalty points).
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This was my biggest problem with Game - used games were waaayyyy overpriced - they dropped their prices last week(?) and funnily enough the shelves seem to empty pretty quickly.
I still think there is a market for a specialist games store. Maybe have a few consoles and allow gamers to try before buy, if possible legally download content onto media (if future consoles will still use it) and a decent online store will help too.
The business failed due to bad management.
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I've seen the exact same thing in GAME stores in the UK. What generally happens is that there's a promotion running that reduces the price of new copies of the game - but the head office computer that makes pre-owned pricing decisions (any leeway was taken away from store managers some time ago) failed to realise that it needed to reduce the price of pre-owned titles as well.
I've seen staff confused by and apologetic over it - but there's nothing they can do about it.
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A lot of these problems could be resolved by having competent store managers, with flexibility to adjust pricing in response to local demand. I gather that GAME used to operate that - and Gamestation more recently still - but that it had been discarded in favour of (inept) central control in recent years.
Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:5, Informative)
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This isn't the first time that this has happened to a British game store. Back in the 1990's, a local store was set up by a local kid who had left school at 16. The local papers were hyping his store as going up may the major chains like Virgin, Dixons and HMV.
Within six months, the store had gone into liquidation with *everything* in the store being given a price tag for auction. Everything from the company sports cars in the rear car park to the front sign above the high street doors. Even the office des
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This isn't the first time that this has happened to a British game store. Back in the 1990's, a local store was set up by a local kid who had left school at 16. The local papers were hyping his store as going up may the major chains like Virgin, Dixons and HMV.
That does ring a faint bell. Was that the chain that was called "Star UK" or something like that?
That would have been circa 1990-91. I vaguely remember they had a branch *very* briefly open in my home town (think I must have been in there once as that was where I first saw a Mega Drive) and went bankrupt within a very short period of time.
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Yes, that was the one. It was like walking through a ghost ship, or a place that had been visited by "Neutron Jack". Everything was there as it was exactly until the moment they declared bankruptcy.
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Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:5, Informative)
Chapter 11 is significantly less harsh on th business than British Administration - in CH11, a companies board can survive the ordeal, while under Administration they instantly lose everything and leave the business.
In the US, CH11 is used strategically, for example see American Airlines - they waited until they had secured a $8Billion war chest before entering chapter 11, even buying $200Billion of aircraft in the run up to the declaration. Entering chapter 11 allows them to do things like break lease agreements (they had 50 or so aircraft sitting mothballed in the desert because they had reached the end of their useful life, but continuing to pay the leases was cheaper than paying the costs associated with returning the aircraft - but in chapter 11 one of the first things they did was just hand the aircraft back in an unflyable state...).
Chapter 11 is a business tool, while administration in the UK is a severe punishment. Huge difference in aspect.
Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:4, Interesting)
In the US, CH11 is used strategically
Administration is used strategically in the UK too. 7Global, a DC/hosting provider did it while we were using their services but didn't tell us. I'm not sure how it was arranged (I think it was a management buyout while in administration) but they were in administration for 24 hours meaning they could walk away from certain contracts and debts. This also nulled our contracts with them, which our clients could have been very unhappy about because that meant we were in breach of our contracts with them by not being able to guarantee things (that were previously guaranteed by proxy via our contract with 7Global). They also moved their entire operation (which went very badly leaving us with no service for days) without letting anyone know the plan (there was a planned maintenance period that night which was down as "working on the server racks") but that is another bitter story.
lt;dr: "strategic administration" happens in the UK too, and quite often in fact but it is usually not widely reported.
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Administration is used strategically in the UK too.
There's the now-common "pre-pack" insolvency [wikipedia.org] here- which I would say *is* reasonably well-known about- that often results in the same people that owned the company before buying it again without having to take on its debts or obligations- sometimes more than once(!)
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It looks like 7Globals administration isn't strategic at all - they are still listed as "In Administration" on Companies House right now (entered on the 03/03/2012 for 7 Global Group Ltd and 15/03/2012 for 7 Global Ltd), with administrator appointment pending. A company cannot take itself out of administration without the administrator or court approval.
I'd move away from that company asap if I were you :)
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Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:5, Insightful)
Not only that, look at the terms themselves.
If you (or your job) has been "made redundant", it means - quite literally - that they no longer have a use for you. It doesn't matter what version of English you speak, that's the meaning of the word. It may not specifically state that would mean losing your job, but the context is there and useful - and differs from "being sacked/fired" quite significantly. It wasn't that they sacked you, they didn't need you any more. It was NOTHING you did wrong. You were simply redundant to the business. We even use terms like "redundancy money" where the business compensates you when it stops your contract because it *COULDN'T* find a use for you any more.
And to "enter administration". That means that some process has taken over to administer the business. Not bankruptcy, because we have that word too and that wouldn't be administration of the business but a final "winding up", but someone is there to administer things - presumably because they can't do it themselves.
Though the terms are not clear-as-day, they are no worse than any other English phrasing and at least hint at what they mean (I'd expect most people to understand them by the context they are used and the inference of the meaning of the words). I don't see why you can't pick up those words from context, to be honest, or just from their meaning - especially when I spend a LOT of my time looking up what the hell certain Americanisms mean because they're not at all obvious (John Doe? Really? You can't just say you don't know their names?).
Company enters Chapter Whatever? What the hell does that mean. The fifth amendment? Eh? Which one's that? What does it say? Amendment to what? Do the other 4 take precedence?
Although the answers are easy to find, they aren't anywhere near easy to infer just from the context given. English is one of the most poetic, cross-culture, verbose and diverse languages. Use it and the facilities available within it, and people can infer what you mean. Numbering everything is only logical if everyone has a reference list of what those numbers refer to and memorises it. But the word "redundant" is present and means the same in both languages - it's just a particular instance of it that doesn't fully explain the implications of your "redundancy" but that the context does.
Don't even get me started on navigation in America. Xing-Ped (Someone had to TELL me what it meant, and that it was "backwards" and I only speak English!) and 49th/50th/51st/52nd street drive me mad. It's abuse of language where it's not necessary, no imagination, nothing to make anything or anyone stand out and not using meanings have been attached to words for centuries.
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A British one I had to look up the other day - I guessed at what the meaning was and was mostly right without the historical context: Council House.
I guessed right at government housing, but it could have had other meanings as well. If you equated it to say "Governors Mansion" it could imply that a Council House is where a member of the council lives.
Re:Gak, the Britishisms in that article were too m (Score:4, Insightful)
Not only that, look at the terms themselves.
If you (or your job) has been "made redundant", it means - quite literally - that they no longer have a use for you.
We call that "laid off" on this side of the pond. Quite different than just "laid", I assure you, and they're both different from "laid out", which might also involve lying down, but I always say, make love, not war. Lay offs are when a business needs to reduce its workforce. There are a lot of rules and regulations about how its done. The natural tendency is to get rid of the deadwood as cheaply as possible, but there are significant rules designed to keep things "fair". I've been on both sides of the lay off process, at least half a dozen times. One time we laid off my whole division, so I've even laid myself off.
. . . especially when I spend a LOT of my time looking up what the hell certain Americanisms mean because they're not at all obvious (John Doe? Really? You can't just say you don't know their names?)
Not to be confused with John Deer, John Handcock, Johnny-come-lately or Dear-John or just a plain John, which has several meanings, none of them particularly flattering, or even doughboy, although even you Brits ought to recognize that last one. And over here Johnny is just a friendly name for a guy named John, or sometimes any bloke.
The fifth amendment?
Not to be confused with the Fifth Amendments, although truthfully I've never quite understood the difference between Parliament and Funkadelic. And lots of people smoke Parliaments, although that's probably NOT what P-Funk was smoking.
49th/50th/51st/52nd street
Do you *really* want to go down that road? At least NYC was laid out (mostly) by people who actually SPOKE English, whereas London, for instance, was laid out by blokes who spoke SPOKE A DIFFERENT LANGUAGE ENTIRELY. And they burnt the town to the ground every few centuries and changed everything, but kept all the same road names. I mean, have to actually LOOKED at a map of London? I bet there are tourists who've been lost in there for YEARS.
And by the way, you've got your own share of odd terms. Over here a sleeping policeman is actually a sleeping policeman!
Don't get your knickers in a twist or throw a wobbly. I'm not trying to be cheeky or even twee. We could argue about 'maths', 'plasters', amongst' , 'paracetamol', 'petrol' or a bunch of other words in inverted commas, last of all, zed, for heaven sakes.
Let's forget all that and just stay mates. And by that I mean pals and not any sort of hanky-panky. Sure, we had our disagreements every now and then, and actually burning the White House was a bit beyond the pale, but we've got your backs and you've got ours. US and UK, BFF.
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I've read up on "made redundant"
I thought that was international. What do Americans say instead?
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Divorced.
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Laid off.
It's the no shame "we're letting you go because we don't need you any more" version of losing your job. Happened to me more than once, but I am proud of myself. I started on a team of eight on a contract with over 500 people. Got down to a team of one on a contract of 240. When my team (of just me) was no longer needed they put me to work elsewhere and still didn't send me home until 11 months after my job disappeared and the contract had about 160 people left. I actually work with one of the
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The US version of the Laid Off has changed over the years. Used to laid off meant you had a pretty good chance of getting recalled, be it a week later, a month later whatever. The definition has slowly changed to more or less permanent. I think the words "down sizing" were meant to fix the confusion but were a little late to the party.
I've been given a week furlough - essentially a lay off - for corporate purposes. Vacation time was seen as debt to the stock holders so they would force everyone in the e
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The American English equivalent of "made redundant" is "laid off." As in,"The company closed one of its plants and laid off 1,000 workers" or "I got laid off from work." This is different, of course, from being fired.
And now I can say I finally got to use some of the knowledge I gained from watching the BBC version of "The Office." It also taught me what "wind up" meant, and that you can apparently be denied an office promotion if you fail a physical exam in the UK (wtf is with THAT?).
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Amazon has already filled the void. It's sad to see this company go bust but the simple truth is that Amazon has compelling cost advantages over any high street store.
Re:I worked in game for several years.. (Score:4, Interesting)
The American customer service model does not work well in Britain. A lot of American chains forget that when they come over here. If an Englishman wants help, he'll come and find you and ask. Otherwise, leave him the hell alone.
If you come up to me all smiles and "Hello Sir, can I help you", I don't think "Oh, that's nice", I think "What are you trying to sell?" and "How can I get rid of you?". If you try to learn my name, or start trying to steer me towards products, I actually feel more like a number, not like you're helping. And English sales assistants can't do smalltalk well at all, and you find them approaching you with an offhand comment about the weather before launching into sales patter as an example of their "engaging" with the customer.
If you approach me in a shop as a member of staff, you will be politely turned away. If you're persistent, I will just walk unless I really *NEED* the thing I'm trying to buy - I've done it several times. I *KNOW* whether I need your help or not, so listen to me when I tell you. If I look incredibly baffled, of course you can try to ask, but chances are that most geeks and kids will say they're fine and want to carry on on their own. And, kid, I was writing computer games before you were even born - don't try to tell me "What you really want is...". If you haven't got what I want, tell me. Hell, point me to your competitor. Because you won't make any money out of me, I'm costing you valuable sales time AND I will return if you're honest and help me buy what I want rather than what YOU want me to buy.
To be honest, it baffles me even in Europe, and is a small part of the reason why the English are considered rude abroad. You can spend 30 minutes talking to a pharmacist in Europe (even as a native) when all you wanted is some sunscreen, and they will deliberately put things out of reach or on counters that deter browsing just so they *can* talk to you.
In England, walk up to the shelf, pick it up, buy it. There's usually a nice assistant available if necessary but if she says more than "Hello", she's getting in your way. The English sometimes see such "personal" service as fake because - well, we don't have it and don't understand it, and a lot of the time it is completely fake. Do I really believe that spotty oik #8 cares about me leaving his shop with what I wanted to buy, even if it's only a £5 game?
GAME were incredibly annoying for this. "Do you need help?" four or five times per visit. Not buggering off when I don't. When I do (or the person I'm with stupidly launches into a ten minute explanation of why we're there), they steer you to things that you just said you DON'T want (whether because of sheer stupidity, high sales pressure, or just bad knowledge of their industry area) and hassle you to buy a DS when you only went in for a £5 PC game. And NO imagination over what to stock. Top-end £50 Wii-titles and nothing else, tiny PC section at the back with top-end £50 AAA titles that need Steam accounts of GfW to activate anyway. Where's the budget section? Where are the indie games? Where's the stuff that people WOULD want to buy on impulse?
They also had high prices compared to online sales and, I'm sorry, nothing that I'd actually buy. I used to be in there all the time as a teenager, but haven't bought anything in one for literally YEARS. The pre-owned section gets the most attention from other customers, and the only time they're busy and not just a small shop of geeks and kids is when Christmas is coming and they've secured a few units of whatever the next big thing is. They remind me a lot of the Games Workshop stores - from outside it's all kids and geeks, which is enough to put off e.g. girlfriends, mothers, grandparents, etc. but at least Games Workshop have half-decent service and sell them what they wanted.
In comparison, the other geek/kid hangout of the local exchange shop (Cash Convertors, CEX or some local equivalent) had lots of customers
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If you come up to me all smiles and "Hello Sir, can I help you", I don't think "Oh, that's nice", I think "What are you trying to sell?" and "How can I get rid of you?". If you try to learn my name, or start trying to steer me towards products, I actually feel more like a number, not like you're helping. And English sales assistants can't do smalltalk well at all, and you find them approaching you with an offhand comment about the weather before launching into sales patter as an example of their "engaging" with the customer.
Dude, nobody on Earth likes that style of customer-service outside the American South. I've always lived in the American Northeast, and I'm still not sure why companies insist on trying to export the South to the entire rest of the English-speaking world.