Should Parents Support Teens Who Want To Become Professional Gamers? (business-standard.com) 161
A family physician warned about a new problem this week in the New York Times:
As a family doctor, I often hear from parents about how their kids push back at any attempt to limit how much time they spend playing video games. The parents will say, it's after midnight, maybe it's time to turn off the video game and get some sleep. But the kid -- usually a teenage boy -- responds that he wants to be a professional gamer. "This is my job," the boy might say... Millions of young Americans are paying real money to watch other young people play video games. Tyler Blevins, known as "Ninja," earns $500,000 a month playing Fortnite -- and that was before he dumped his previous host, Twitch, where he had over 14 million followers, to join Microsoft's streaming platform, Mixer.
Does it make sense to support a teenager's dreams of being the next Tyler Blevins? Plenty of parents do everything they can to support their children's athletic dreams. They invest in soccer camp for the next Mia Hamm, do endless tennis drills with the next Serena Williams or wake up before sunrise to drive the next Michael Phelps to swim practice. Is it any different if your child is staying up all night playing video games? The University of California, Irvine, offers scholarships to play e-sports in games such as Overwatch and League of Legends, just as many colleges have long offered scholarships to play traditional sports such as soccer and football...
The key to emotional well-being is balance. Children, especially teens, can easily careen off balance. As parents, we have to teach our kids the skills they need to keep from crashing through the guardrails. That is not to say you should be dismissive of your child's passion. If your child is dreaming of being a professional gamer, I advise parents to answer just as they would a teenager who wants to be a professional athlete. Play your game. Improve your skills. But homework and other responsibilities come first. And don't sacrifice sleep. .. Parents can support their kids' interests while also providing a reality check... You say: I commend you for your dream. I applaud your dream. I support you in your pursuit of your dream. But dreams don't always come true. And even if yours does, it may not last. Nobody plays professional soccer or professional football forever, and the same is true for e-sports, which take a greater physical and mental toll than many would imagine -- with long bouts of live streaming in particular being tied to real risks.
Does it make sense to support a teenager's dreams of being the next Tyler Blevins? Plenty of parents do everything they can to support their children's athletic dreams. They invest in soccer camp for the next Mia Hamm, do endless tennis drills with the next Serena Williams or wake up before sunrise to drive the next Michael Phelps to swim practice. Is it any different if your child is staying up all night playing video games? The University of California, Irvine, offers scholarships to play e-sports in games such as Overwatch and League of Legends, just as many colleges have long offered scholarships to play traditional sports such as soccer and football...
The key to emotional well-being is balance. Children, especially teens, can easily careen off balance. As parents, we have to teach our kids the skills they need to keep from crashing through the guardrails. That is not to say you should be dismissive of your child's passion. If your child is dreaming of being a professional gamer, I advise parents to answer just as they would a teenager who wants to be a professional athlete. Play your game. Improve your skills. But homework and other responsibilities come first. And don't sacrifice sleep. .. Parents can support their kids' interests while also providing a reality check... You say: I commend you for your dream. I applaud your dream. I support you in your pursuit of your dream. But dreams don't always come true. And even if yours does, it may not last. Nobody plays professional soccer or professional football forever, and the same is true for e-sports, which take a greater physical and mental toll than many would imagine -- with long bouts of live streaming in particular being tied to real risks.
They need an UNION! like other pro sports! (Score:2)
They need an UNION! like other pro sports!
Re:They need an UNION! like other pro sports! (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: They need an UNION! like other pro sports! (Score:3)
The parents will say, it's after midnight, maybe...
"Maybe??" The patents maybe ought to not be indecisive, ineffectual cunts.
Are you fsking kidding?! (Score:4)
Sure, go for it. What else are you going to do with your life...
Get off my lawn.
Re:Are you fsking kidding?! (Score:5, Insightful)
Exactly. My only regret in life was not becoming a professional gamer. I could have been Zaxxon World Champion.
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I could have been Zaxxon World Champion.
Well *I* WAS Zaxxon World Champion back in the day. It was just a very, very small world.
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A friend of mine has the dubious honor of repeatedly hitting #1 on the world ladder for "Crossy Road". Also, he lost his job the other day for spending too much time staring at his phone instead of being a lawyer. I feel like these things are connected!
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And both of the other Zaxxon players cared! :)
Re: Are you fsking kidding?! (Score:2)
Pro Athletes (Score:5, Insightful)
It's an age old question really.
Kind of a gamble. People have long debated whether it was responsible to support "the dream" of becoming a pro athlete.
Parents still do it, and one in ever couple million or so it pays off. The other 99.9992% have to find something else to do, and often times they are ill prepared.
IMHO
The answer is a question : Does your child have exceptional talent at gaming?
Support them , but make for certain that schoolwork and social interaction are not sacrificed.
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:2)
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:5, Insightful)
develops self discipline, focus, routine
Is there any objective evidence for this? My subjective experience is that the kids who focused on sports in high school had significantly worse life outcomes than those that put equivalent focus into academics.
and leaves you physically fit.
Except for the injuries and brain damage.
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You're confusing sports with fitness, a common misconception since both are "physical" activities. Competitive sports often leads to injuries, while there are many fitness regime(n)s where injuries are rare or self-healing, e.g. callisthenics or non-competitive running (a.k.a jogging). But to get to the level needed to be a pro, the old saying applies, no pain, no gain.
Becoming a pro requires you to be fit both physically and mentally. I'd compare the training for a pro gamer to that needed for lazy "sport
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Pro gamers work 16 hour days and have similar focus, discipline, routine, etc as athletes. It's the difference between "pro gamer" and "likes games". Interestingly, there's a similar deal for top-notch chess players, they go through a couple years where they need that same focus and diligence if they want to become pro players. A chess career lasts a lot longer, though.
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:2)
I am a big Gamer, but I maintain no illusions about it having ANY benefits other than being a fun pastime.
You're in luck: while the imminent "VR Revolution" will likely drive us all blind eventually, we'll be in good fucking shape - Augmented Reality (with foam swords, dummy guns, you name it) will make lasertag look as passive as a game of checkers.
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Computer gaming is an advertisement of nothing but itself. They hype it up to truck other children into wasting lots of money and time trying to be the best at it and the majority have fun just gaming, rather than spectating. It is a manipulative and destructive scam, exploiting minors to feed the insatiable greed of adults (how many of those people support their own children being junk food and gaming addicts but oh yeah they love the idea of other people's children being exploited).
The whole pseudo celeb
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You must be kidding. Celebrity worship is at an all time high. These streamers have millions of followers.
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I am completely dumbfounded by people who watch other people play computer games, I just do not get it, like what the fuck are you thinking, obviously nothing
Most everything you said could be said about sports, like who spends time watching other people play football or basket or baseball or hockey? I think the people you don't understand is called "most people" and no, they're not changing very much...
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I think the people you don't understand is called "most people"
About 40% of Americans have no interest in sports.
60% watch sports at least once a year.
Less than half are fans of a team or follow a particular sport.
About 35% of Americans watched the Superbowl.
Sports [gallup.com]
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:3)
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The Halftime show can be fun, too.
I was in Marching Band for several years of High School. I never paid any attention at all to the football game, but attended every home game. It was a hassle any time either team scored, because we had to quit messing around in the stand and play a School Song.
We kinda considered the football game to be just something to attract people to watch our Halftime Show.
Performance rights differ between ball and esports (Score:5, Insightful)
If the NFL goes bust, there are no legal obstacles against a new gridiron football league forming. You might even see the return of USFL or XFL. If Blizzard decides to end StarCraft II, by contrast, the company can assert its copyright against any leagues that stream their matches publicly. Blizzard has, for example, asserted copyright against KeSPA in the past. This would leave professional StarCraft II players with little chance of transferring competitive skill to another lucrative endeavor.
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The secret behind watching other people play video games is that those other people are friend substitutes. The video games are just a shared interest. The real meat is "hanging out" with your internet celebrity "friend". There are livestreams, live chats, donating money to the internet celebrity to gain a momentary burst of attention, a whole "ecosystem" that revolves around the relationship that you imagine you have with the internet celebrity.
You can even meet your idol! Wow! At a convention, or s
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College athletes often make great sales professionals. EMC was built on a sales team heavy with former athletes.
Dunno what being a competitive gamer would prep you for, but there's probably something. Given that, even if you make it, you'll be washed up by your late 20s, there's plenty of time left for a career.
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College athletes often make great sales professionals. EMC was built on a sales team heavy with former athletes.
Dunno what being a competitive gamer would prep you for, but there's probably something. Given that, even if you make it, you'll be washed up by your late 20s, there's plenty of time left for a career.
I think a couple of years of making ~$500,000/month and you don't have to worry about what your going to do after you peak. If you're smart with your money, you can retire at 25 and live a very comfortable life doing whatever you want. Hell, keep playing games if that makes you happy. No need to profit off it any longer.
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How many pro gamers make that kind of money? Most don't make 6 figures, from what I've seen. I guess the amounts will grow over time, though.
Also, no one is smart with their money in their 20s. If you don't have a coach or something to insist you hire a money manager who gives you an allowance, you'll be broke by 30 (or that's the norm for athletes, anyhow).
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How many pro gamers make that kind of money? Most don't make 6 figures, from what I've seen
I suspect it's a bit like golf. Most don't earn enough to pay for travel and hotels, but hold the dream of being one of the few that can actually earn a living.
The percentage of gamers making even four figures a year is exceedingly low, and drop another order of magnitude for five. Earning more than six figures a year? There could be dozens!
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:3)
College athletes often make great sales professionals.
If that's not a great reason to prevent their existence, I don't know what is.
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Dunno what being a competitive gamer would prep you for
Gee, I don't know. I don't suppose there's some component to electronic gaming that might be universally useful to knowledge work. Perhaps if you can get around a few computer programs better than any average 10 million people you meet you might find that you have some level of literacy and expertise with such devices...
Not to mention that if you can attract online interaction with more different people than anyone else that this "social aspect" of computing could be at all useful. After all, hackers nev
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The other 99.9992% have to find something else to do, and often times they are ill prepared.
What’s the problem? It’s not like used cars are ever gonna sell themselves...
Re:Pro Athletes (Score:5, Insightful)
The side-effect of supporting a failed pro athlete is a teenager who is fit, has a social circle outside of school and has learned to balance their training schedule with other responsibilities. The side effect of supporting a failed pro-gamer is a teenager who is addicted to gaming, probably skips doing homework, doesn't get enough sleep, never leaves their bedroom, ties their self worth to likes or followers on an online social network.
Maybe if you can get them to treat it like sports, with scheduled training sessions, and attention paid to diet, sleep and other activities, it is OK, but for the majority, left to their own devices, they will just end up with gaming consuming their life.
Re:Pro Athletes (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Pro Athletes (Score:5, Informative)
Pro gamers have a regimented life with training sessions, regulated diets and everything. It's not just sitting in front of the computer 20 hours a day because surprise surprise, it actually requires work.
In fact, becoming a big fat slob makes you even worse - healthy body, healthy mind, after all. So no, you can't sit in front of the computer gaming all day eating burgers and fries and junk food.
While you won't need the conditioning of an athlete playing soccer, football or other active sport, you still need to maintain the body (and there are plenty of sports where you have to be fit and healthy but not athletic - think all the various vehicle races (car, plane, boat, etc), animal races (jockeys), etc.
Pro gaming is like that. You'll wake up at an ungodly hour of the day, do a bunch of physical exercise, eat a regulated breakfast, work at the game for 8-10 hours a day, breaking for regulated healthy meals, more physical training, etc.
And yes, you regulate, because getting fat makes you not only sloppy, but slow.
The good thing though is when you're out, you're only in your 20s so you have plenty of time to pick up your next occupation. Of course, that's provided you haven't given up because you realize how "not fun" it actually is. (It's a job, one that requires lots of training to keep up, and one you'll age out of quickly). It's not all leisure time and play time, but serious time. Just like those "content creators" who realize that producing content is hard work and if you want to make money at it, you have to work it like a real job. No more playtime.
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You can confirm this is all true by looking at some pro gaming tournaments. The participants are mostly healthy looking and often quite well spoken, suggesting they are not neglecting their education either.
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:3)
The side-effect of supporting a failed pro athlete is a teenager who is fit, has a social circle outside of school and has learned to balance their training schedule with other responsibilities. The side effect of supporting a failed pro-gamer is a teenager who is addicted to gaming, probably skips doing homework, doesn't get enough sleep, never leaves their bedroom, ties their self worth to likes or followers on an online social network
As a [former] gamer who was never into sports as a kid, this. (You could even cynically say that it's better to be s functional loser than a non-functioning one.)
How many losers does the lottery have? (Score:2)
I wish I hadn't returned that book, but today's children are smarter than that. Now they want to become Internet celebrities. Much more likely path to success than professional athletics. Also less effort and fewer hours of tedious training. I give them credit for their realism.
The career path of this story is in many ways similar to that of professional athletes. The problem is that the barrier to entry is much lower. At least in the case of professional athletics you can easily tell if you have a chance j
What is really needed then - pro evaluators (Score:2)
The answer is a question : Does your child have exceptional talent at gaming?
It seems like a great service to offer parents, would be professional evaluation of potential gaming talent. Like do they have natural aptitude for skill, do they have fast enough reflexes that they can measure up to other pros with training? It seems like you could have a board of tests, along with evaluation of gamer profiles and streamed games, to at least understand if there is real potential or they are hopeless... there's n
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It seems like a great service to offer parents, would be professional evaluation of potential gaming talent.
Yep, and you make sure to tell every parent that their kid has potential, and for the low low price of $X, you will hone their abilities.
Re: Pro Athletes (Score:2)
E sport athletes are required to have a certain stamina in order to stay competitive and focus for the required 30+ minutes a game might take. Especially MOBAs and StarCraft. Look at any world tournament and count all unfit kids participating in the second round. Most if not all are physically fit though most aren't buff.
No! (Score:2)
There, glad to be of service. It's the same thing you should say when your kid wants to become an actor or sports legend. As a parent you are supposed to advise them with your life experience.
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And always, always, ALWAYS have a fallback plan in the form of at least an average education.
Re: No! (Score:3)
You should always encourage your child to pursue their dreams.
So you're one of those who thinks you should treat a fourteen year old like a four year old. Don't worry; that's common.
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Pursue your dreams is one thing, being delusional usually follows on its tail.
Just because someone wants something doesn't mean that he is ever going to get it. How many High School football "stars" make it into the NFL? How many kids learning guitar manage to even make a living off music? We are not talking about a kid wanting to learn a trade or pursuing a study that the parent might not consider viable but is a viable life choice for a large portion of the population, we are talking about a career that i
Yes, with provions (Score:2)
Kids should have a chance to try to make what they want to do into a career.
However "gaming" comes with some problems:
1. You can only do it while you are young due to reflexes
2. It may well be that only the upper 1% or so can ever live off this
3. It is unclear how this will develop
So my take would be that this should be treated the same as kids that want to become actors, musicians, athletes, youtubers, etc.: Support them, but make sure they have a fall-back option. No leaving school, no complete focus on t
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You don't have to be particularly good to stream as long as you're entertaining.
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You still have to get enough followers. Many people that are pretty good, but are more special-interest are struggling.
Re: Yes, with provions (Score:2)
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Actually, not being particularly good can be what gains your followers.
I'm still waiting for the 80 year old geezer streaming him playing some twitch game and not even noticing when he gets blown to pieces.
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I think he meant the upper 1% of everyone who tries to make it into a career. Personally, my gaming compared to the professionals is like the dad that kicks around a soccer ball with his kid on Sunday afternoon in the back yard. I just do it for my own entertainment, not for the world's.
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I think he meant the upper 1% of everyone who tries to make it into a career.
Indeed. As the original story was about gaming as a career. Gaming as entertainment has completely different numbers, of course, and I am one of those too.
No (Score:3)
No. And no one is making 500k a month either. That is just hype.
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Hype supported by verifiable facts: https://www.businessinsider.co... [businessinsider.com]
Of course, that's before Microsoft paid him a substantial fee to switch platform.
Kids and dreams (Score:2)
Look folks, kids are stupid. They're fed bullshit from their earliest memories that they can be whatever they want. Dream the dream, don't accept anything less. And they believe it!
Except we all know that's not how the real world works, and as adorable as our kids are when they're young, they are going to need to be functional members of society at some point. That means taking care of themselves and any offspring they bring into the world, which means not pursuing that dream of being a world famous pro
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If you want your kid to succeed in life, teach them to file paperwork and manage information without ever losing track of the details. They used to call such people "secretaries" and give them peanuts. Now you get titles like "admin" and run well over half of every corporation in existence...
Even if they get stuck as a "research assistant" the Nobel laureate they work for will have to be sure they are paid well enough to eat in order to collect the prize.
Does it matter? (Score:3)
They shouldn't support them becoming NFL players, but they do anyway.
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No, it's unhealthy. (Score:2)
A pro-gamer are very young because the "sport" has a deep connection to reflex speed. Pro-gamers cannot be professionals very long since our reflexes decline as we age. So if you aren't developing the skills you need for life because of a possible path of employment that lasts 10 years at most then you are going to end up in poor condition (mentally, socially and even physically) at the end of that short period.
Obligatory. (Score:2)
Nintendo's animosity toward esports (Score:2)
I guess Mr. Larson drew that comic before Nintendo's animosity toward esports [arstechnica.com] became evident.
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Keep in mind the headline was them looking into the future, that comic was probably around before 1995. (I don't recall reading much Larson after high-school, but that is one I remember)
My friend's sister, shining example (Score:4, Interesting)
My friend's sister started off doing pro gaming, sort of aged out of it by 25, give or take, working as a waitress to pay the bills. Then she started a pro gaming statistics company, which sounds like crap, but they have more than five full time employees now and she's giving talks all over the world and has been at it for the better part of a decade. So in that respect she managed to make it in to a career, much like how Joe Montana started off as a football quarterback, but then became a sports commentator and also invested his reputation into video games and probably makes more now than he did as a quarterback.
I don't think most people have the business acumen to rotate from being a player to being a business person, but for those who do, it's worthwhile to do pro games/sports to build the business connections to be successful later in life. The rest are just going to fall by the wayside, go work in accounting or construction or something.
The money isn't in the sport itself (Score:2)
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During the Gold Rush in the mid-1800's the surest way to get rich was to be the one with buckets and shovels for sale, not mining.
Re: The money isn't in the sport itself (Score:2)
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The modern-day equivalent of "mining the miners" would involve making and selling devices containing SHA-256 ASICs, correct?
Re: The money isn't in the sport itself (Score:2)
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As a game developer ... (Score:2)
no, I would steer my kids into a "traditional" career.
Today's "eSports" (god, I hate that term) remind me of the days of Chess at the turn of the 20th century. Job security is still highly volatile especially whilst we have "fad" gaming. CAN you sustain your income playing games? Only if you are in the top X % You would have better luck being a YouTuber and/or having a Patreon account.
Another huge long term health concern is carpal tunnel. Gaming for long hours that are needed to reach and STAY in the t
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Meh, just steer them slightly towards games that require scripting skills in order to win... They may just become programmers (or at least sys admins) without even realizing it.
At worst they can work 80 hours a week helping EA sports make games.
Yeah sure (Score:4, Insightful)
Depends (Score:2)
Short term thinking (Score:2)
Unless you're one of the .01% that makes it to the big time ( like actors, professional athletes, celebrities, etc ) the " dream " isn't sustainable in the long run.
At 25, your reflexes aren't going to be on par with the 15 year old you're playing against so unless you make ludicrous money in the first ten years AND have the wisdom not to spend it all, you're going to be in a financial world of hurt once you're no longer able to compete. ( Tip: No one in their 20's has the wisdom to save and / or inves
I wouldn't support them being pro athletes, either (Score:2)
Maybe the teens should support the parents (Score:5, Insightful)
Teach them Stratego, Monopoly, Laster Tag (Score:2)
If I may suggest, help them learn a sense of _tactics_, and a sense of strategy. Good reflexes are wonderful, and reacting well under pressure or when surprised are useful life skills. But help them learn _real_ physical skills involving tools, and perhaps even some physical combat skills. Being the best e-sports player in the world will not save a teenager from a swirley. It also won't help them engage with the much larger "real world" if it's all they focus on.
Depends (Score:2)
How long will the parents mind their grown children living in the basement -- not paying rent?
Seriously, don't only about 5 people in the world (figuratively) make a living being a pro gamer?
Probably would (Score:2)
It takes a lot to be professional gamer, and it's not the kind of thing everybody's meant to do. If my kid is going to tournaments, and winning, I'll support her in it. For my kid, it's not a great leap of the imagination that she would try to do such a thing eventually. I don't think my plans would change a lot. As it is, I'm trying to guide her into a technical engineering career. She's got the head and artistic sense for it. If gaming is what she wants to do, and she's any good at it, yeah. I'll be a goo
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A problem with all the 'glamor' careers - for every successful star in sports, screen or music, there are thousands of people who were inspired by them but didn't quite have the talent, or the luck to meet the right agent at the right time.
It's legal, so support them. (Score:3)
I despise the parents that try to push their children into selecting a job they like - whether it be for practical reasons or something else.
Yes kids will make mistakes. That's part of being a kid. Parents can and should give advice to their children about what they want. But once the kid has made the choice, you have to support them.
Otherwise you are sabotaging them. Note sabotaging THEM,not there career choice.
The kid has to live with their choice, not the parent. And more importantly, THEY ARE NOT KIDS. Not when they are actively working towards getting the job. That action makes them an adult.
In fact, if you are 30 and not working toward a job, you are still a kid. But if you are 17 and working toward a job, you are an adult.
Yes. Fewer regrets that way. (Score:3)
Being a pro gamer isn't any less "balanced" than being a pro at anything else. At least if your kid washes out at being a pro gamer, he had fun and has plenty of time to be something else.
He won't be living his life thinking about what he could have been if only his family had been supportive. How many people complain their family was too supportive?
People end up regretting what they never tried, not the things they tried that didn’t work out.
Odds (Score:2)
Supporting Gaming Contestants? (Score:2)
Computer games are supposed to be FUN. If they get so good at their game that peopl will pay money to watch, then go for it. Should PARENTS pay to support them?
Not THIS parent.
Yes, but... (Score:2)
Yes they should, but at the same time making sure they are sufficiently educated for when it doesn't work out.
You get them to do courses on business management (because being a streamer is being self employed), video & audio production.
Just don't let them go down a path where they end up in your basement on welfare waiting for their streaming career to take off.
Well written article (Score:2)
I don't think there's much more to say beyond what's written there.
No, obviously (Score:2)
Just like any other sport.... (Score:2)
stupid question... (Score:2)
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Pushing a child to do a certain activity is bad parenting. Parents should try to expose their children to as many activities as possible so they can figure out what they like.
If the goal is to be a professional gamer, that's fine, and a parent should support them in this endeavor but also make sure the child understands it's a long shot and they need a fallback plan if that doesn't work out.
parenting 101 (Score:2)
the answer is already in the summary;
"If your child is dreaming of being a professional gamer, I advise parents to answer just as they would a teenager who wants to be a professional athlete. Play your game. Improve your skills. But homework and other responsibilities come first. And don't sacrifice sleep. .. Parents can support their kids' interests while also providing a reality check... You say: I commend you for your dream. I applaud your dream. I support you in your pursuit of your dream. But dreams do
Well... (Score:2)
Morally, sure.
But not financially
Dangerous delusion (Score:2)
It is like those poor suburb kids who waste their time playing soccer all the time hoping some international recruiter gets lost in their shantytown and notice them. Or girls who believe they are going to become famous models or actresses.
The ones who have these kind of dreams are often the ones who need the most to do their homework and get marketable skills because they don't have a family business to fixed them up.
I like video games, sports and sex but i don't think i would be very happy if i tried to ma
he makes A half million per month? (Score:2)
Yeah, support him. In fact, quit your job so you can support him better. He should be paying you a salary now.
And get a good financial attorney
Dismissive of their "passion"? (Score:2)
Call it what it is - an addiction - using the same techniques that keep people mentally chained to slot machines.
Soccer, swimming, track - these are healthy pursuits. As in they actually make a person healthy. Video games, not.
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Re: this is a fairly new job description (Score:3)
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He's a Streamer, not a Professional Gamer.
My understanding is that he is both, or at the very least has been both.