Fast-and-Loose Culture of Esports is Upending Once Staid World of Chess (nbcnews.com) 41
Grandmasters and upstarts are reinventing the game online, becoming its most visible ambassadors and arguably its first entertainers. From a report: On Twitch, the most popular internet platform to livestream esports, time spent watching chess has risen by more than 500 percent since 2016, according to data from the company. With that consumption has come some money, mostly donations from viewers facilitated by Twitch but also in sponsorship dollars. That growth persuaded Botez in September to try livestreaming chess full time. She now has more than 60,000 followers on Twitch. And while streaming is offering players like Botez a new way to make a living from their chess skills, it's also giving new life to one of the oldest games in the world. "It's crazy to me to have this kind of support and this kind of viewership online for chess," Botez said. "Chess has always been a passion of mine, but it was never something that was popular. It was never something I would have imagined would have grown to what it is today."
Chess came to the attention of Twitch less than four years ago, when the company formed a partnership with Chess.com, the largest chess website, with almost 33 million members. "Across all the different various competitive games on Twitch, chess has seen some of the most substantial growth in the same period of time than any other esport in the world," said Justin Dellario, Twitch's vice president of global esports. The rise of esports -- both in terms of competitive gaming and more social online gaming -- first gained attention in the 1990s and the early 2000s before emerging in the past 10 years. The gaming and esports market research company Newzoo forecast that 2019 esports revenues would hit $1.1 billion. Twitch is by far the largest esports platform. Chess hasn't enjoyed similar growth. While the game has a young, marketable genius in world champion Magnus Carlsen, it has struggled to attract the kind of money that can help sustain its growth.
Chess came to the attention of Twitch less than four years ago, when the company formed a partnership with Chess.com, the largest chess website, with almost 33 million members. "Across all the different various competitive games on Twitch, chess has seen some of the most substantial growth in the same period of time than any other esport in the world," said Justin Dellario, Twitch's vice president of global esports. The rise of esports -- both in terms of competitive gaming and more social online gaming -- first gained attention in the 1990s and the early 2000s before emerging in the past 10 years. The gaming and esports market research company Newzoo forecast that 2019 esports revenues would hit $1.1 billion. Twitch is by far the largest esports platform. Chess hasn't enjoyed similar growth. While the game has a young, marketable genius in world champion Magnus Carlsen, it has struggled to attract the kind of money that can help sustain its growth.
never trust the headlines (Score:2)
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This. HN is funny and a super GM. Worth watching so you can know how bad you are at chess.
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The Twitch chat is a big draw too. It's like IRC used to be. They basically reinvented IRC but more accessible and monetisable.
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p>So, the solution is to infect the world of Chess with all the rampant narcissism of social media combined with the visual monikers of livestreaming?
In other forms of entertainment, that's called sportscasting.
Re:Be careful what you ask for. (Score:4, Funny)
Magnus Carlson is about as likable and telegenic as anyone.
In addition to repeatedly winning the world chess championship, he has worked as a fashion model [nytimes.com].
My 20-year-old daughter told me that she would be happy to have unprotected sex with him if he was willing. I am not sure I would object since his genes would ensure smart grandchildren.
PS: Magnus, if you are reading this, please message me and I will put you in touch with her.
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Top chess players earn the 'right' to call themselves and be referred to as 'Grand Master' for life. Nothing narcissistic about that, right?
I found while doing some internet searches: According to 'chess.com' [chess.com] (well, a forum post in that site) Narcissism is one of the top 10 personality disorders of chess players. Perhaps it's well suited for live streaming?
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Why the ridicule quotes? Grandmasters do indeed earn that title; it requires a top-notch lifetime record (as recorded by their FIDE rating) and then an exacting set of high-place finishes in specially designated gruelling high-level tournaments. It is very hard to get. Not disputing that top chess players tend to by narcisstic (or at least egomaniacs), but grandmast
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Given that DSM-V recognises ten named personality disorders, a "top ten" list is guaranteed to include them all
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Top chess players earn the 'right' to call themselves and be referred to as 'Grand Master' for life. Nothing narcissistic about that, right?
Since it can take many many years to achieve a ranking of Grand Master (not unlike the "Masters" in martial arts), I'd say it's more a title that's well deserved, and not grounded in self-serving narcissism.
And those who earned a silver or bronze medal in the Olympics aren't referred to as "losers". They're still Olympians, so give them the damn respect they deserve. Just because you retired doesn't mean the doctorate you hold or the title of "Doctor" disappears. You'll know when you've found the profess
Re:Be careful what you ask for. (Score:4, Insightful)
Be careful what you ask for. Actual skill is what is still valued in Chess. The last thing that 1,500-year old game needs is a "champion" determined by clicks, likes, and breast size rather than Elo ranking.
Not surprisingly, the girl this article is about isnt exactly top-notch in the skill department either. Her rating still has never broken 2100. Any of the tens of thousands of chess clubs across the world will have someone with a similar rating.
There are low-level grandmasters on youtube that get far more views, and one of them (Ben Finegold) has repeatedly spanked her in game after game while streaming
She is nothing but a pretty face for all the young nerdy types to crush on.
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Not surprisingly, the girl this article is about isnt exactly top-notch in the skill department either. Her rating still has never broken 2100.
In chess, there is always somebody better than you.
2100 is crazy high in my book.
& what percentile are you in when you're 2100 on chess.com, for example?
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So no, not "crazy high" and literally relying on your ignorance (its what you did) to make an argument doesnt reflect well on you.
Your argument can be directly translated into "it sounds high to me even though I dont know what high is"
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How is better than 95% not high?
Thanks for making sure your reply is both pedantic and insulting.
(fitting in "ignorance", "doesnt (sic) reflect well on you", "I dont (sic) know what high is", the nicely passive aggressive "you understand that, right?")
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She isnt in the top 5% of good players. She is in the top 5% of all players.
Its like firing up a casual counter-strike game, 20 random players in total, and scoring higher than all the other randomly selected players. Not of note. Not evidence of anything.
I think you have a motive here. SJW much?
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I was with you until you mentioned Finegold.
Finegold is everything chess doesn't need. I have watched quite a few of his youtube videos and, if you don't know he is a chess GM, he appears to be signficantly mentally retarded. Talking down to the audience, impressed by his own cleverness, speaking in a weird patois of baby talk and jokes that only he laughs at. I really don't think he is any kind of role model for anyone, except perhaps fat kids with depression who are resigned to being socially awkward t
Re: Be careful what you ask for. (Score:2)
I think you exaggerate slightly. You might be correct about those specific attributes not being the preference of chess spectators; but if Elo were really the decisive factor we wouldnâ(TM)t bother with human players. Chess isnâ(TM)t formally solved in the sense that Checkers is; but humans havenâ(TM
Re: Be careful what you ask for. (Score:2)
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Computers are able to calculate perfectly, but their judgement still isn't as good as humans (this tells you which skill is more important in chess).
Yes, chess is mostly calculation. You can have all sorts of grand plans, but if a particular position has a tactical flaw then the plans don't matter.
...humans play more interesting moves in chess, so the games are more exciting.
That was definitely true until Alpha Zero came along.
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"Alpha Zero is in general stronger due to the extremely powerful GPU, but it has no chess knowledge except what it taught itself by playing games. Also Alpha Zero is relatively weaker in the endgame, and rather blind to perpetual checks in many positions."
I'll again give my opinion that human players play more interesting lines, but that is of course my opinion.
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Alpha zero is just a huge lookup table; it's not even simulating playing chess. It's pretty worthless except as an indicator as to how little intelligence is involved in most AI projects.
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To quote Larry Kaufman (who has probably more knowledge of chess engines and Alpha Zero than anyone): "Alpha Zero is in general stronger due to the extremely powerful GPU, but it has no chess knowledge except what it taught itself by playing games. Also Alpha Zero is relatively weaker in the endgame, and rather blind to perpetual checks in many positions." I'll again give my opinion that human players play more interesting lines, but that is of course my opinion.
How Alpha Zero arrives at its decisions is not so important. The games it plays are extremely interesting. Some citations:
Vishy Anand [youtu.be]
Magnus Carlsen [youtube.com]
Jan Gustafsson [youtu.be]
Agamator [youtube.com]
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I don't quite agree with that without much more context.
My grand father use to watch Tour de France religiously. I have lots of friends who watch football religiously (the European kind). I don't find watching the game of the latest installment of call of duty much different.
Watching games of Leagues of Legend can get you to understand the game much better. Speed running competitions are fascinating.
Now some people may be using video game stream as the only social contact they will have. But I am not sure h
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> Game streaming is dumb.
Get off your fucking high horse. People watch various sports games on TV and the Internet. The medium is irrelevant. Streaming is no different.
Not every stream is full of stupid emoji. I've actually interacted with small streamers sharing gameplay tips live and it has been a blast to see the streamer immediately get better and have an interaction with them.
T90 streams Age of Empires 2 games and uploads matches to YouTube. His commentary is funny and serious.
Instead of focusing on
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I'm going to have to disagree with you there. As Marshall McLuhan said, "The medium is the message."
It's a different chess (Score:2)
If you're thinking of people watching a traditional, slow moving chess match, they're not. Since the nineteenth century, competitive chess has always been played on a timer with each player given a set amount of time to make his moves; if he runs out of time, he loses. It used to be (and still is in truly serious matches like the World Championship) each player got something on the order of 90 minutes or two hours, with more time added if the game went on for a lot of moves. These people are mostly playi
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These people are mostly playing blitz chess, where the typical time limit is 5 minutes for each player.
Five minutes is actually a long time among streamers. Hikaru Nakamura, for example, typically plays one minute games.
Fast-and-Loose Culture of Escorts is Upending... (Score:2)
Made perfect sense.
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How to *talk smack* in esport Chess (Score:2)
(Presses chess timer)
Your move, bitch.
oh look... (Score:4, Interesting)
... /shock, she's bangably hot.
Here's a news flash, they're not watching the chess.
Young (and sometimes old) men will watch anything with a hot chick on it.
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The internet has an endless supply of free porn. Twitch itself has cosplayers doing body painting or gamers with low cut tops. This lady dresses modestly and plays a slow game of chess. I doubt many of her viewers are in it for the cheap thrills.
More likely they are in it for the community. Twitch attaches an IRC style chat room to every stream and a big part of becoming popular is making your chat a place where people want to hang out. A lot of revenue comes from chat too as people pay for things like spec
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You can watch chess games a lot of places.
Your choice is watching chess with some dullard, foreign white dude, or a vivacious young woman.
99% of straight men are going to go for the latter.
Still think her hotness or femininity is irrelevant?
All the games we like are because of the graphics (Score:1)
Means and ends (Score:2)