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Pro Drivers Are Competing With Gamers After F1 and NASCAR Canceled Races (theverge.com) 58

Posted by msmash from the life-moves-on dept.
For many, the cancellation of major sporting events was the moment that made the coronavirus pandemic feel real for the first time. But while fans of baseball, basketball, soccer are left wondering when they'll see players back in action, racing fans don't have to wait -- because many of their favorite drivers are already competing in online sim racing competitions that were spun up in the days since the first real world races were canceled. From a report: The first few of these substitute sim races, held last weekend, were successful in ways that surprised even the organizers. Now, many of the people who put them on have spent the intervening week trying to figure out how to use that momentum to fill the gap left by real world racing, as fans around the world hole up at home in a collective attempt to slow the spread of a global virus. It likely won't be that difficult, though. The success of these first few replacement races was a testament to how far sim racing has come during the rise of esports, but it also sheds light on a truth that a lot of motorsports fans have become familiar with: that a new age of competitive, virtual motorsports is already upon us.
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Pro Drivers Are Competing With Gamers After F1 and NASCAR Canceled Races More

Pro Drivers Are Competing With Gamers After F1 and NASCAR Canceled Races

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  • Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (Score:3)

    by ardmhacha ( 192482 ) on Monday March 23, 2020 @12:14PM (#59863190)

    Last week our local library started organizing "virtual" events. One of them was a Mario Kart 8 Deluxe Tournament using Nintendo Switch online. Not perhaps quite the same skill level but my son enjoyed it. Battling with others at his skill level rather than easily beating his parents and sister at home was a bonus.

  • Yeah but.... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by cayenne8 ( 626475 )
    ...without the very real possibility of cars crashing and potential injury....where's the real visceral feelings that make it dangerous and attractive to watch?

    Let's face it, a LOT of people just watch it for the wrecks.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by DrSkwid ( 118965 )

      yeah, someone should be picked at random and taken to the Red Room

    • Re:Yeah but.... (Score:4, Interesting)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Monday March 23, 2020 @12:28PM (#59863254) Homepage Journal

      There are plenty of exciting crashes in virtual racing and although no one gets hurt they still matter a lot and affect the outcome of the race.

      In Gran Turismo Sport there is also a penalty system that is supposed to punish bad driving but in practice it almost always seems to target the wrong person, which all adds to the drama.

    • I remember the first time I watched NASCAR I was very disappointed that they were still racing after 3 laps. Then my horror it was 200 laps. Then the fans telling me the best part happens in the last 10 laps... I was like. Why not just make it 10 laps?
      I actually find the Pit Crew to be far more athletic than the actual racers. I have seen once the entire front end of a car being duct taped together in under 5 minutes. While there is some excitement in the accidents, I find fixing from the accidents far m

      • NASCAR requires athleticism but not in the normal way. Its an endurance race so it requires a great deal of stamina. It's hard to drive on the limit at that speed for that length of time, with the noise, vibration, no AC, can't take a piss etc. Its a similar skill set to other forms of endurance racing like WEC. NASCAR drivers may not have six packs but if you have to condition yourself for that kind of driving nonetheless.

        You aren't pulling multiple G's like in F1, but the races are far longer.

        Probably the

        • I never stated that the Drivers were not athletes. Just that the Pit Crew seems the be the mostly silent heroes of the sport.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Nidi62 ( 1525137 )

        I actually find the Pit Crew to be far more athletic than the actual racers. I have seen once the entire front end of a car being duct taped together in under 5 minutes. While there is some excitement in the accidents, I find fixing from the accidents far more interesting.

        A guy I played football with in college did pit crew for a few years. Yeah, those guys are the real athletes of NASCAR. Those tires, jacks, and drills can't be light, and you have to move quickly and precisely or you're liable to get crushed or run over.

        • Re:Yeah but.... (Score:4, Interesting)

          by CaptainLugnuts ( 2594663 ) on Monday March 23, 2020 @02:22PM (#59863630)

          I have zero respect for NASCAR as a league, but I have tremendous respect for the drivers.

          I endurance race cars as a hobby. It is FAR more difficult than you can imagine unless you've tried it.
          Even with our relatively slow cars it's a real workout. We've had new people rent seats and expect to go two hours in the car. Most go about 40 minutes before needing to get out.
          We race in the Summer, there's no shade on the track so the cars bake.
          All the sound and heat insulation is removed so the cars get really hot inside, usually over 100F..
          There's no A/C.
          You're in a head to toe multi-layer insulating nomex suit with a helmet so there's no breeze.
          You're working really hard and your pulse is over 130. Our car only corners at a little over 1G, but there's no power steering.

          Now, while dealing with the heat, noise, and fatigue, you need to keep sharp mental focus.

          The only thing that keeps you alive is a cool shirt, it's a tee shirt you wear under your nomex with ice water pumped through. I'll turn 10-15 lbs of ice into warm water in an hour and a half.
            When you get out of the car all you want to do is strip off the nomex, sit in the shade, and drink water. I usually lose about 10 lbs of sweat in to hours.

          It's a tremendous amount of fun, you should all try it!
          https://24hoursoflemons.com/ [24hoursoflemons.com]
          https://www.racelucky.com/ [racelucky.com]
          https://champcar.org/ [champcar.org]

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by Aereus ( 1042228 )

            I drove CA1 along the Big Sur leg the other week and while I wasn't racing anyone, I was making a spirited pace of about 100mins for the 75mi route. When I pulled in for a break after that I needed some ibuprofen as the focus required really drained me. Much respect to racers.

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by lgw ( 121541 )

        I actually find the Pit Crew to be far more athletic than the actual racers. I have seen once the entire front end of a car being duct taped together in under 5 minutes.

        You might find Formula 1 interesting these days. Drivers have become like jockeys, selected for being very low weight. Meanwhile pit crews are astonishing, with 2 second pit stops [youtube.com] being competitive (that's replacing all the tires, and adjusting or cleaning the wings). Madness.

        • Seconded. I've put an F1 pit stop on slow motion and STILL sometimes had trouble following the movements of each team member. Less brute force than a NASCAR pit stop (wheels and tires are lighter), but way more precision required as every millisecond counts.

    • ... might be old now, but it had the best rcar physics of any racing game, even compared to games that came a decade later. (E.g. all the Codemasters games felt like a complete joke afterwards).
      Down to feeling if a wheel lost grip.

      And it was hard, had realistic damage and crashes, and was extremely rewarding ... that one time out of ten that you actually got past the first corner properly. :)

      Ok, gravity can't be replaced without expensive gear.

      And if you only care about spectacular crashes, may I suggest th

      • rFactor 2 is a really good sim for the feedback.
        The graphics aren't as good as the newer competitors but they are working on them.

        • Yes, some formula 1 type racing simulations may be even more realistic.
          But for me, they lack that special feeling.
          I only like rally-type driving.
          Like really feeling the suspension working, and properly and intentionally drifting around corners, close call scenarios when missing a tree or large rock, etc.

          Thanks for mentioning this anyway though. I bet the formula 1 type racing sim gamers will appreciate it, and I now know what to recommend them.

      • Dirt Rally has pretty impressive physics. Iracing is even better for tarmac. The model even takes into account tire temperatures and pressures.

        • RBR had, I think 148 or 168 parameters PER WHEEL.

          I've tried DiRT 2. Codemasters games have this weird physics, where the car seems to revolve around a single central pole, and the whole thing, especially brakes, feel very mushy. Also they have this bug, where you can cheat the physics by going off the gas for a very unrealistically short time, before turning the steering wheel, and suddely the car gets around corners much better, even though it shouldn't. Sure, you have to hit it right. But when you do, the

    • Let's face it, a LOT of people just watch it for the wrecks.

      Autonomous vehicles: CCTV edition.

    • Let's face it, a LOT of people just watch it for the wrecks.

      Not me. I go to YouTube the next day so I can see only the wrecks.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by rho ( 6063 )

      Easily solved by adding simulated machine guns to the hood of the simulated cars.

      Who wouldn't watch that?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by hey! ( 33014 )

      I'm not a big fan of spectator sports, by I get car racing. It's a lot like boxing. There certainly are people who watch boxing just for the brutality, but if you actually understand the sport it's quite interesting to watch. If you don't know anything about tactics it's just two guys slugging each other.

      If you take away any knowledge of race tactics or the incredible physical and mental demands driving a race car put on the driver, of course it's going to be boring.

  • Simracers worth watching (Score:5, Informative)

    by UnknownSoldier ( 67820 ) on Monday March 23, 2020 @12:30PM (#59863262)

    For anyone knew to simracing these two lads are worth watching:

    Jimmy Broadbent [youtube.com] aka shed boi
    SuperGT [youtube.com]

    Racing games played range from:

    * Assetto Corsa [steampowered.com]
    * BeamNG.drive [steampowered.com]
    * Forza 7 [xbox.com] (Win10 + XBox)
    * Gran Turismo Sport [gran-turismo.com] (PS4)
    * iRacing [steampowered.com]
    * RaceRoom [steampowered.com]
    * Project Cars [steampowered.com]
    * Project Cars 2 [steampowered.com]

    NOTE: The penalty system in GTS is a complete clusterfuck at the moment so the more hardcore sims are being played.

    For anyone wanting to get into sim racing here is a short list of wheels ranging from cheapest to best:

    * Logitech G29 / G920
    * Thrustmaster
    * Fanatec

    Barry from Sim Racing Garage [youtube.com] has excellent guides, reviews, and build advice if you want to take your sim racing rig to the next level.

    • Don't see Trackmania on the list which is very popular. Same with Rocket League.

      • Those are nowhere even close to being simracers.

        (Still worth checking out though if you like racing in general.)

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by lgw ( 121541 )

          Trackmania is bizarre in that, for all that it's purely arcade driving, the speedrunners have as high a level of skill in their own way as any competitive drivers. Speedrunning is of course very skillful in general, but there something just odd about speedrunning a racing game. You'd think "isn't that just playing the game", but it's a different world.

          You know, I used to think the height of human skill was the guys who solve puzzle cubes blindfolded, until I saw the guys playing the Punch Out games blindf

          • Game Done Quick definitely has some super talented players! One of my favorites is IlluminaHD [youtube.com] who set, not one, but TWO world records in Minecraft speed running!

            * SSG [youtube.com] (Set Seed Glitchless) and
            * RSG [youtube.com] (Random Seed Glitchless Any%)

            Thanks for the heads up about Mike Tyson's Punch Out -- blindfolded is pretty dam impressive! Interesting that speed running a racing game is even possible. YouTuber roninpawn [youtube.com] is another interesting streamer if you love watching Clustertruck [steampowered.com] speedrunning. [youtube.com]

    • I forgot a couple of other simracers:

      * Automobilista [steampowered.com]
      * Automobilista 2 [steampowered.com]
      * F1 2019 [steampowered.com]
      * rFactor [steampowered.com]
      * rFactor 2 [steampowered.com]

  • Why? (Score:2)

    by PPH ( 736903 )

    Why is F1 and NASCAR cancelled? Just ban the local spectators and televise the races. It's not like basketball, where the players might get some feedback from the crowd.

    • Re:Why? (Score:4, Informative)

      by Ogive17 ( 691899 ) on Monday March 23, 2020 @12:59PM (#59863364)
      One of the F1 teams had a crew member test positive, the entire team withdrew from the first race before they eventually cancelled.

      While the drivers are quite isolated, the pit crew and support staff are working very closely with the rest of the team as well as being in close proximity to other teams. Not a good idea to continue with a race when you've got crew members under quarantine.

    • The teams and logistics are pretty largr all on their own.

      Although seeing a race where the drivers have to do everythig on their own, sounds like more fun than what we see now. Only make sure there's an ambulance and firetruck standing by.

    • You are talking about F1 teams who consist of about a hundred people onsite, plus a few hundred off site doing data analytics and strategy, plus a hundred or so marshals, a few hundred shipping personnel etc etc etc.

      By the time the lights go out, that’s a few thousand people you’ve congregated before spectators get involved.

    • Because people driving cars around a track to see who can do it fastest is 100% non-essential ant anything and a complete waste of resources? Even without fans it would require several hundred people to meet up at a track to put on a race, and even one of them sneezing downwind from someone else would be too much risk in the face of no reward.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Cederic ( 9623 )

        a complete waste of resources

        It's a tremendous source of innovation and technology advancement

        It's also entertaining for millions of people, making them happier in their daily lives. Is that so bad?

    • Because it would essentially turn into a gamble and more a matter of luck than skill, material or anything else. How many of your pit crew are going to be sick this weekend? With a pit crew that does stops in 2 seconds, you can't just replace someone, these people have perfected working together as a unit to the extreme. You could of course go and get 3+ complete crews, but that kinda kills smaller teams that don't have the kind of financial backing and turn the whole F1 back into a matter of who can throw

    • That was my first thought too--the pit crew are even wearing full face protection and fire suits. It seemed like they'd be well protected. Then I realized that ambulances are standing by at all races for obvious reasons. Those are valuable resources that we can't afford to squander. One bad crash could take several hospital beds and ER resources that can't be spared right now.

  • I remember seeing top scores on Mario Kart (older version) where the top scores are from some guy who found one pixel in the out of bounds areas near the starting line that with some jumps counted as driving an entire lap.

    I am OK with cheats when you play solo. However online they are very unsporting, as you should play the game the way it was meant to be played, not take advantage of a mathematical glitch.

    • Quake 3 ProMode / CPMA and Defrag were amazing. The bugs really added to the game. They were even intentionally left in.

    • Fortunately when things are being streamed and actively refereed, these kinds of exploits don't fly. Someone who uses an exploit for all the world to see can easily be penalized.

      These events are also invitationals with real racing drivers and high profile Sim and Esports players with reputations to maintain. I don't think any of them would want to be caught cheating.

  • Jimmer beat Lando (Score:3)

    by thereddaikon ( 5795246 ) on Monday March 23, 2020 @01:16PM (#59863434)

    and got virtual points for Somalia. A great day for racing indeed.

  • and the crash physics were non-existent. When Johnson took out a bunch of cars, he just bounced around, not causing any real/noticeable damage. What good is a racing simulator where your car doesn't get jacked up like in real life?

    Heck, the old 2000 Papyrus racing game was 1,000 times more realistic than whatever software these guys used. I found that weird considering the technology today vs. 20 years ago.

  • TLDR, but basically, how good were pro drivers at these games? Better than average? Better than everybody?

    • The pros are generally excellent.
      All of the current drivers use sims to prepare for the next race as well as for coaching.
      Teams use sims to model possible changes to the cars.
      Studio 397 which makes rFactor 2, has a product rFactor Pro, which is used by many professional racing teams as the basis for their training sims.

  • There are currently a lot of pro-cyclists doing Zwift races & events as well.

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