Wolfenstein 2000 Confirmed 103
Jacek Fedorynski writes "Rumors have been floating for a long time now, but this time it's official. Castle Wolfenstein 2000 is currently in development at Xatrix Entertainment, the creators of Kingpin, and is scheduled to hit the stores by Christmas 2000. I can't wait to see it. " The confirmation is at the end of the article - anyone have more details?
Not by id? (Score:2)
Re:platforms? (Score:1)
How about a little research next time?
BZZZT! Sorry. Thanks for playing. (Score:1)
id Software bought the _RIGHTS_ to the name and basic premise to "Castle Wolfenstein", an old Apple II game that John Carmack and John Romero both loved.
The game "Wolfenstein 3D" was developed by id. John Carmack wrote the engine, Adrian (sp?) Carmack (no relation) and Kevin Cloud did the artwork.
You can find a LOT of _researched_ information about Wolf3D in Stan Staziak's (now maintained by someone who's name escapes me) Wolfenstein 3D FAQ.
(anyone got an URL handy?)
But in addition to my previous rant (Score:1)
Wolf3d got me through my GCSE's and QII assisted me through my first couple of contracts. W2K should be great if Markham lives up to past form.
Did anyone read past the 1st page? (Score:5)
Markham defends his possition and the possition of his company on the Littleton massacre to the end "...here I am playing a video game...and you tell me that's going to translate to holding a real gun? You show me someone who says that and I'll show you someone who belongs to the Flat Earth Society..."
Towards the bottom of page 5 [newtimesla.com] Markham talks about the development of previous games touches on what is to come in the future. "...games will get more violent, he says. 'Why? Because they can.' "
IMHO a brilliant article coupled with great researched that will go unread by most as it is billed as a game announcment. COME ON!
This is getting too demanding. (Score:1)
Due to the effects of moderation, karma, and the "10 hot comments" box, Slashdot discussions are becoming increasingly contaminated by worthwhile opinions supported by actual "facts". The proportion of trolls and flamewars is dropping dangerously.
We need immediate action. I propose that any user introducing unjustifiable amounts of well-researched information into a discussion be immediately punished by having a link to his webserver published in an article, or, failing that, the equivalent penalty of ICMP flooding.
Steve 'Nephtes' Freeland | Okay, so maybe I'm a tiny itty
Re:platforms? (Score:1)
I think this will be a sweet game, and I would like to see it on multiple platforms, but I highly doubt they will port to Be.
Stan "Myconid" Brinkerhoff
The Diet Coke of "Legal" (Score:1)
Re:Another Media Hack and Slash (Score:1)
Actually, Wolf3D was called Wolfenstein becuase it was set in Castle Woldenstein- when you beat the first 10 levels that was what you ran out of, after collecting all the Nazi gold and killing a bunch of german soldiers. So this is a remake of Wolf3D, they are just calling something a little different.
I mean, if you want reality, go outside.
And get arrested for blowing someone's arm off? "This guy's" whole point was that games such as Quake and Redneck Rampage are not reality, they are set with aliens and you shoot everything you see. Ask a inner-city gang member or a prof. soldier how often you indescriminately shoot everything. The author's point is that by adding intelligence to the characters in the game, you can no longer shoot everyone, you have to interact with them and decide the best course of action. It brings first-person games one step closer to reality. And yeah, it will never be reality, unless your reality involves blowing people's arms off with shotguns. The whole point of simulations is to do things that are not possible in reality, be that flying a 747 10 feet over the Golden Gate bridge, or shooting a fellow human in the face.
And the reporter uses him to make another story on how we are all going to turn into Satans minions.
Get down from whatever pedistal you are on long enough to actually read and understand the article. The reporter put togeather a well balanced article about an individual that makes very violent games. Both sides were presented evenly. If the reporter had neglected to present the side that fells games are evil, it would have been a poor story. But every argument against games was countered by the view of the industry. I for one thought it was an intelligent and well written piece.
remember, Wolfenstein != Wolfenstein3D (Score:3)
Wolfenstein 3D was a pure shooter, and a darn fun one. I still play it from time to time. But iD intentionally removed all the sneaking and disguises to make the game move faster. Probably a wise idea at the time, but I think we've reached a point where a game can be done like the original again - with plenty of tense moments and a lot less shooting.
I mean, we already have plenty of 1st person shooters. How about something that requires more wits for a change?
On the note about graphic violence... (Score:1)
But on to the crux of the article...
I have a simple comment about the gaming industry vs any other media industry around. Notice that if you try to rent an R rated movie before you're of age, they usually have blocks available for parents so that Timmy who's 7 can't rent it for his slumber party.
I've noticed a lot of games around these days that have the M rating (probably requires the same amount of graphic content as the R rating in movies) but I haven't seen people harping that there isn't enforcement of the rating. I can imagine Timmy going into Best Buy and being carded for half-life, but really has anybody seen it happen?
Also I've seen arguments that "Oh, it's just a game." And I'm certain that those same people turn around and say that "X movie is too violent!" (put your favorite gore fest in for X)
I don't think you can blame the developers of the software since the rating system has been around. It's kind of like going after Paramount (or whoever) if some kid did a copycat of Scream (or whatever). First of all, Paramount's got beaucoup money in legal teams, and secondly, no judge would say "Well, even though it's rated R and Timmy was 7, I'm going to find you, Paramount, to be responsible." Further no jury would either simply because every movie is known to be rated.
Thus the problem to correct here is perception. Media shouts of "Graphic video games!!!" are common, but they never mention these games' ratings. I think that if gaming companies want to save their soon to be tarnished image ('cause once a lawsuit goes against 'em, it's all downhill), I think that a consortium to start actively promoting the awareness of the rating system will quiet the media (to an extent), and parents (because now it's back to being their responsibility in a quasi-legal^* sense)
* Quasi-legal - legal because of popular opinion rather than an informed bias. In these respects, parents are quasi-legally not responsible because the majority of people still think of video games to mean pong and the old Atari classics. Not enough people know that the major video card companies have nearly reached a perfect 2-d representation of 3-d real life and thus are shocked to see how graphic glQuake or Quake II can really be.
hey hemos! mien-lieben? (Score:1)
mien is definitely no german word.
there is not even a word that sounds
alike, except in a very strange dialect.
if you want to say something like:
"my dear friends" then "meine lieben"
should do. although not 100% correct.
"meine lieben freunde" is much better.
:-)
but what does that have to do with W2k ?
(wolfenstein 2000 != windows 2000)
Re:Did anyone read past the 1st page? (Score:1)
Well... (Score:1)
Kingpin looks to have some pretty sophisticated gameplay and interesting AI. I have no doubt that they will find a way to interweave an interesting plot into an old game.
I see these guys have also made Redneck Rampage. Granted this game was not a technological fest, but it was decently up to date. It had a great comedy element that was lacking in alot of games around that time. These guys seems to know how to make a game interesting, so it will be -interesting- to see how it turns out.
Anti-anti-semitism? (Score:2)
The mission areas for my F19 Stealth-figher game included eastern europe, the middle east, and siberia, but not south america, asia, or north america, where I can think of a few targets...
I look back at all my "WW-II" and "cold-war" games and wonder if perhaps they should be let to die in peace.
Re:oooh! (Score:1)
Re:Not by id? (Score:1)
I really don't care who develop the game. The important thing is a *fast* and good graphics engine that may deliver speedy graphics and so forth.
Also, they should make it multiplayer. You should be able to choose if you want to play the nazi's, or the escaping prisoner, or maybe a deathmatch between several soldiers and prisoners
I'm really looking forward to slaying Hitler in his machine again.. uhh, if they dare to rip that of ID that is.
Ohwell.. nostalgia.
--
Re:Nostalgia aside.... (Score:1)
This is why they didn't just take the Wolf3d textures/maps and slap them on the Quake engine. Heck, they'd be done by now if they were doing that
The only way to sell a rehash like this is to a) appeal to nostalgia and b) actually make it worth having for it's own merits. So in theory, we should get a new game with some cool features and what not.
Trivia: Wolf3d actually had a raytracing engine. Be glad there was no real z axis to it or it would have been SLOOWWWW.
Re:Trivia (Score:1)
Re:platforms? (Score:1)
It may be a mutually beneficial thing to let Be do the port however... Be benefits by having more "cool apps" to lure users, and one more way to show off how cool BeOS is to the media...
Xatrix benefits by getting increased exposure, free cleanup work on making the code portable (useful if they want to do other ports like Linux or Mac), and free revenue -- they don't do the work...
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
Re:It would be fun if... (Score:1)
Using the Wolf engine wouldn't make the game fun, or even have significant nostalgic benefit. It would simply be a hindrance.
I think what would accomplish what you want, is if the engine they used, the art they came up with, and the game mechanics all preserved a distinctly "Wolf" feel... Then you get the best of both worlds... But that is a very hard thing to pull off...
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
Re:Grew up on this... (Score:1)
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
Re:Question… (Score:1)
Xatrix has a history of making interesting games, and Kingpin pushes the edge with it's A.I. and gameplay...
Potentially this could be the Next Big Thing... Or it could be a big flop.
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
Re:oooh! (Score:1)
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
Re:Is this really an "id approved" game? (Score:2)
Hasn't Carmack talked of letting outside developers contuing the Doom line with a "Doom 2000"? If he's amenable to that, I see no reason why he wouldn't be amenable to an external Wolf 2K...
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
It's an interesting idea but... (Score:5)
Ok, so Wolfenstein 3D doesn't have a rich storyline to offer. Then what exactly does this game bring to the table? Q3A and UT have DeathMatch locked down, Kingpin, and Half-Life have rich single-player locked down...
Perhaps there is room for an "old-school" kill-fest but it will have to be as visceral and cutting edge as Wolfenstein was in it's day...
Jon Frisby, Senior Internet Software Engineer,
Personal Site (MrJoy.com) [mrjoy.com]
Re:Grew up on this... (Score:1)
Grew up on this... (Score:2)
Longing for the old days - sporty
Re:id didnt "develop" wolfenstein (Score:1)
id software developed it,
apogee (who now is essentially 3DRealms) published it.
GT Software (Later, GT Interactive), published the semi sequel, Spear of Destiny, though this was just more maps and enemies. Nothing notable.
How long before ... ? (Score:2)
Gotta catch 'em all!
--
Re:cool (Score:1)
Sorry, but this is BS. Being the outsider has been a situation all throughout human history. And going on a killing rampage, etc. has never been the proper answer in a proper society. Sitting there and calling someone a victim because they are assholes and nobody likes them, or blaming video games or other forms of media is just screwed. People have free will and the ability to make choices. They aren't forced to behave in certain ways or take particular actions.
The difference between people and animals is that people aren't totally reactionary. If someone really has not free will to make decisions based on their own and societies moral standards that's when they become no different than any other tool or object. I don't know about the rest of you, but when my screwdrivers have been stripped down to being an icepick they go in the garbage and to put it bluntly that's how I think we should treat anybody who isn't willing to stand up and take responsibility for their actions.
-sw
Re:cool (Score:1)
Sure it would be nice if we could solve the problem of some people not being "normal" but you can't define "normal" and it's really not our right to decide that someone or other needs to be "fixed." But it is our right to defend ourselves from others.
-sw
Is this really an "id approved" game? (Score:4)
Trivia (Score:1)
I thought it was a raycasting engine... *shrug*.
Re:Are we talking about the same Wolf3D? (Score:1)
Re:Not by id? (Score:1)
Gunning down attack dogs with a gatling was fun, too.
Re:I remember (Score:1)
Hope the new version is as cool as W3D (Score:1)
oooh! (Score:1)
Wolfenstein was such a truly classic game. Can this do it justice?? I'm have my doubts, but I'm keeping an open mind. Maybe those days aren't so long past...
-----------
"You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding."
Re:Is this really an "id approved" game? (Score:2)
Xatrix and id have a history of working together, not only did Xatrix's Kingpin license the Quake 2 engine, but they also made one of the two Quake 2 add-on packs for id. I would be willing to be bet that Carmack is behind this.
After all, he has been hinting that they want to make a Doom2k themselves, what better way to build up to it then to have someone else do a Wolf2k?
They've got a customer in me as long as they have Linux versions.
-
Re:Moderate this down!!! (Score:1)
It would get on slashdot, but as an "Look what these guys did they are horrible"-story. Face it, even slashdot is P.C.
Furthermore, killing people is not what slashdot is about, but slashdot sure as h@ll is largely made up out of 25/30 year olds who remember textgames, 2d-topdown games on a $2000,- machine and the thrill of shooting a 3d-nazi.....
I know I do.... (Bang... Aaaargh, mein leben!!!!.... The wonders of a 8-bit soundblaster!!!)
Re:hey hemos! mien-lieben? (Score:1)
I might be wrong here and you might be right...
Hemos?
"Bang..... Aaaaaargh... Mein leben!" yeah!
cool (Score:1)
Now, on to a quote from the article, on another topic:
"What happens is that some of these kids who aren't succeeding socially turn to video games," she reported. "And they don't learn social skills. They aren't learning how to solve problems. Instead, there they are in front of a screen."
And of course this is the KID'S fault and the VIDEO GAME'S fault, NOT the fault of those who alienate and shun them. So blame the victim. It's not societies responsibility to REACH OUT and HELP kids. Instead let's just let them rot, and then blame them and the video game industries, when, after being alienated and shunned for years they do something wacky, instead of taking a look at ourselves, and wondering what WE did wrong to allow such a thing to happen before our eyes. Kick em when their down.
You know, it's almost as if some people just have willingful mental blocks just so that they can stay safe in the homogenous nondescript majority thinking.
Re:social skills and solving problems (Score:2)
Re:cool (Score:2)
Re:cool (Score:2)
I remember (Score:1)
Okay, so it doesn't give any details to the game. That would be nice to have. And does the story change at all?
Re:I remember - Readme (Score:1)
Are we talking about the same Wolf3D? (Score:1)
Doom was a masterpiece, but all the blathering about Wolfenstein 3D is peculiar. Like many a black and white coin-op from the mid-1970s, it has not aged well.
What I want to know is... (Score:1)
In all seriousness, though, with all the innovations in gameplay that have taken place since the dawn of the FPS, they could really do something spectacular with Wolfenstein 2000. Imagine a combination of Half-Life and Thief, where ammo is low and you have to sneak around corridors, avoiding Nazi scum or dispatching them quietly with a shiv in the back, or what have you. Hell, with technology being what it is now, they could add some serious plot -- perhaps the time-tested tie-in with Hitler's occult obsessions, a la Raiders of the Lost Ark, and so on.
Not that I think they will do any of this, but I'm just saying it would be great if they did. The cynic in me thinks it'll be just another quick knock-off to make a few fast bucks off nostalgaic suckers (me included, likely as not).
---
Re:Grew up on this... (Score:1)
As kids we used to play with two paddles (no joystick back then), with one person steering the body and moving with the button, one aiming the gun and firing with the button, and someone else operating the keyboard.
Ah, the good old days - of course you can still play it on the various Apple II emulators. Still do, sometimes.
Amusing (Score:1)
Anyone else find it amusing that this is a large article about violence in computer games, and the only thing anyone cares about is Wolfenstein 2000 is coming out?
Sweet! (Score:1)
Re:remember, Wolfenstein != Wolfenstein3D (Score:1)
I still remember holding up grunt soldiers for their bullets with an empty gun. Now that was cool.
Re:platforms? (Score:1)
Voodoo does not work in BeOS nor does the voodoo rush.
MMMmmmm... (Score:1)
Personally, I'd like to see the original Nazi's back (along with
new material as well, of course).
(Perhaps those huge overly bulky women from Kingpin
were prototypes for big burly Nazi women?
Re:Nostalgia aside.... (Score:1)
Whenever I setup a faster new machine, the first game
I play on it is Wolf3D. A ritual that stems from seeing
how much faster my new machine is, I'm sure. But at this point (k6-2/266),
it's not going to run any smoother, but I'll still do it.
Domian Names (Score:2)
Wolfenstein3d.com & Wolfenstein2000.com are still available.
Ho-hum.
Re:How long before ... ? (Score:1)
You'd think shooting Nazi's would be therapeutic for some people...
Quote of the Year (Score:2)
"I'm sorry to inform people of this, but that's how we got here. We beat the crap out of everybody else all up the evolutionary tree. That's why we have dominion over this planet now. You don't wring that out of your DNA in just a couple of generations because people are uncomfortable with where things came from. We are some ethnocentric, murderous motherfuckers."
-Drew Markham
If the videogame business doesn't work out for you Drew, I'm sure you can always get a job teaching evolutoinary theory down in Kansas.
I'm *really* looking forward to seeing this version of Wolfenstein.
ah good (Score:1)
What's Wrong with Anti-anti-semitism? (Score:1)
Why shouldn't the Nazi era be a subject for computer games? Have we become so politically correct and morally relativistic that we can't even condemn attitudes and behavior that are certifiably evil like the wholesale genocides carried out by the Nazi's in WWII?
I look back at all my "WW-II" and "cold-war" games and wonder if perhaps they should be let to die in peace.
Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it.
Command line... (Score:1)
and open access to GOD MODE.
Question… (Score:1)
Re:hey hemos! mien-lieben? (Score:1)
Ja, as someone else pointed out, he almost certainly meant "Mein Leben!" which translates to "My Life!" (as in, "Oh no, there it goes"), which was the death-cry of the SS in Wolf3D. Of course, back then it often came across as a throaty warble 'cause sound cards weren't quite so common or advanced.
-Kevin
"Castle Wolfenstein" from 1981: kinda pre-iD (Score:1)
No wonder that many slashdotters are assuming iD owns the whole franchise of Wolfenstein. People born after "Castle Wolfenstein" are legally able to vote and join the Army.
Anyone else remember the sound of a 1MHz 8bit processor trying to modulate an 8ohm speaker directly, to curse in German?
Kinda interesting that the entire top ten popular software were games, except for #7, which was an operating system. Talk about your "killer apps."
Re:On the note about graphic violence... (Score:1)
Remember Wolfeinstien 3D on the start screens? "This game voluntarily rated PG-13"
Self rating. They knew what they put into it. They knew what to label it.
Re:Grew up on this... (Score:1)
Still illegal in Germany? (Score:2)
I reckon the game will still be illegal in Germany. It'll be interesting to see how they handle it this time around. Compuserve was one company, easily intimidated. The internet's a lot more difficult to control. (I'm assuming there will be a playable demo of the game, of course.)
... (Score:1)
I have long waited for this day.
Thank you. Goodnight.
wolf3d 2000 (Score:1)
id didnt "develop" wolfenstein (Score:3)
Re:Did anyone read past the 1st page? (Score:1)
I'm actually glad that first-person-shooter video games are getting more violent. It makes them more realistic. At the same time, I would be glad if the simulation games became more realistic too (I'd logged more hours in a Learjet 45 in FS98 than I've spent in class).
The goal of the computer gaming industry is to make games more realistic. Not necessarily real compared to the "real-world", but real compared to the game. Games are trying to be as true to the world it portrays as possible. And as long as they continue to improve, it'll be a good thing. I for one, do not want to go back to playing Pong. I would prefer playing Rainbow Six (or Rogue Spear), where one bullet will take you down.
Sim-Alia (Score:1)
In high school, I was really addicted to the Sim-whatever games. Sim-Earth, Sim-City, Sim-Ant, I played whatever I could get my hands on. I found them so fascinating I went on to fantasize about other topics which could be simulated.
At that time, there was a lot of civil unrest in Somalia and the US had sent its troops to the area. I figured I'd love to play Sim-Alia, where you get to distribute food to people, fight crime lords, deploy troops, and build a thriving country out of a third world country.
My dreams never realized, but when I think about it now, it still seems like a good idea. Heck, it could probably qualify as Edutainment these days. "Learn how to help poor people by simulation!"
Anyways, that's it.
Bart
Re:remember, Wolfenstein != Wolfenstein3D (Score:1)
Re:It would be fun if... (Score:1)
In a way this forces id's hand?? (Score:1)
Personally, I can't wait to see Quake 3: Arena with actual bots...
Nostalgia aside.... (Score:2)
Nostalgia aside.... (Score:2)
Is anyone really interested in playing a "kill the guard, kill the guard, find the key, kill the guard, kill the boss" kind of game? The FPS genre is so chock full of titles at the moment I fail to see how a throwback to the daddy of them all is going to be something to lose sleep over.
Given the current saturation of the FPS market a game has to bring something special or new to the table in order to be something other than a rehash; and, forgive me for being cynical, but the fact that they're leaning on the goodwill of the original title has me wondering if they have anything at all.
Hey, I could be wrong, look how many great 60's movies and TV shows have been remade into modern classics lately.
No, really...
Stop Laughing
Re:Is this really an "id approved" game? (Score:1)
Re:I remember (Score:1)
So we can now move on beyond "killing is bad" to more particular issues, if "talking about the ethics of war" even has any place on Slashdot.
Re:id didnt "develop" wolfenstein (Score:1)
Yippe!! (Score:1)
Re:Is this really an "id approved" game? (Score:1)
Wolf 2000 (Score:1)