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I can't even understand your first "problem". I think your second problem has something to do with voxel engines, but those are no where near as easy to build hardware accelerator cards for.
Yeah I'm sure all those CAD programs would stop using OpenGL, I'm sure Maya would stop using OpenGL for rendering, I'm sure Apple would stop using OpenGL for their 2D effects on the desktop. Somehow I'm doubting that because John Carmack retires that OpenGL will die. Maybe OpenGL games, but just about every 3D game on OS X/Linux uses OpenGL.
It's not that OpenGL goes away, it's that its rate of evolution goes in the toilet. You can accomplish all those cool effects at another level if the stuff doesn't go into OpenGL, but naturally OpenGL is where we want it so that all can gain the benefits.
For a computer nerd like myself, this is just as sad as hearing that my favourite band won't be making music any more.
That's pretty pathetic, isn't it.:)
Judging by the games, I'd say its closer to Stratovarious not making instruments anymore. No direct impact, but you might not play games based on carmack technology anymore =)
It's a little bit deeper than that, though. Carmack has done the programmers of the world a wonderful favour by opening up the code to id's older titles. I myself have learned quite a bit from Quake (1 & 2)'s code, and I haven't even scratched the surface of what's there to be learned (most of it, especially the actual engine itself, is way above my meager mental faculties).
He's kind of an idol, as much as Torvalds and Stallman, to me. Although I don't have a little shrine containing their images t
If you're serious, no, not really. John Carmack is the closest thing to a role model that I have -- he's inspired me to do a lot of things and for that, I thank him with my life. My favorite games all consist of something he's contributed to, even if it's just a 3rd party game running the Quake 3 engine. John Carmack transformed the gaming industry and he will never be forgotten. His next game will be nothing less than a total blockbuster. I'm happy for him and proud of all he's done.
Doom 3 is the best tech demo ever made and possibly the best mod platform ever made but I'd rank it third or forth best FPS this year.
It's not scary, it's cheap. Yes, it will startle you because stuff will appear right beside the character. After the reload the trigger point is known (though they're almost always obvious anyway).
While I can in no way slight his technical skills, I welcome a game industry without his hand in actual *games*. He freely admits he d
Their engines have served as a -very- good base for other, excellent games.
Thief, Half-life, Hexen, Soldier of Fortune come to mind ; as well as many games i might have forgotten.... And don't forget about the modifications either.
I think id software proved themselves to make great engines, and other studios take on the task to make even better games with it.
Thanks for the clarification there : Don't know when that 'data polution' crept into my brains : Always have been thinking that Thief was based on the Quake 2 engine :
Thanks for brushing that one up;)
Don't feel too bad about that mistake. When you consider just how many games are based on the Quake engines, its very easy to mistakenly assign games to that category. (I thought Thief 1 was based on the Quake 2 engine too, heh)
So you're saying that John Carmack, the best graphics guy in the industry, is responsible for games not being fun for you anymore? Jedi Knight II uses the Quake 3 engine that Carmack is responsible for.
Good, then maybe we will have some games that are fun to play.
I agree! It sucks how he keeps making other games not fun! What a drag! Not to mention the fact that he is holding back the industry from trying new concepts. When he stops making games, all other games will become much better! I'll finally be able to think of new game ideas.
Hey Moderators - how about modding the parent post down, and instead modding up someone who has some real criticism of Carmack. I appreciate that someone might not like his games, but blaming him for all games being not fun is senseless.
The thing is, developers see Doom3, and think only in terms of small changes. I have not seen anything interesting in 3D perspective game in a looong time, the only one that comes to mind is the Soul Reaver [eidosinteractive.com] line of games.
Better graphics doesn't make better games. The youth of today doesn't get that. I prefer IRL fistfighting, so I do that on my spare time. Because it's a challange, and exciting too.
Quake and Doom were more important for id as showcases for their engines. Ever wondered how they survive releasing maybe a game every two or four years? A pretty impressive chunk of the FPS genre is based on id engines.
Guess I'm an old fart, but I haven't had fun since Angband or maybe Lemmings; though the Jedi Knight games where quite entertaining, but that's because I grew up on the original films.
So you haven't enjoyed video/computer games since the late 80's/early 90's? Why the hell would the retirement of a programmer who started AFTER you stopped having fun be helpful to the gaming industry?
I was wondering when this speculation would start up again.
I note that this was also bandied around when he was working on the Doom 3 engine, where he said somehting akin to having "one more good engine in him"
People have been saying this for about... oh... three years now. The only one who knows is John - and he'll quit when he gets tired of it. That's all.
Developers at Id have all been asked this question at one point in time, and all have said "yeah, he probably has one or two more engines in him." All have pretty much indicated that he has a "holy grail" engine he has constantly been working towards since he wrote his first side-scroller. Once he gets that done, he'll probably go launch himself into space and work on the teleporter on Phobos himself.
There are two types of programmers. Those who entered the field because they have a natural inclination and interest in the field and those who heard it was a lucrative area. People in the first group tend not to retire at middle age. Semi-retire, yes. Go on a sabbatical, yes.
The above should not be interpreted to suggest that he will continue coding 3D shooter engines. Just that he will most likely be coding something.
Game programmers usually don't have really long careers. A big hit or two, and that's about it. Guys will start a company, have a huge game, then it'll break up.
One example would be David Crane, he's made a number of games, from the late 70's (Atari hits like Pitfall!), to the 80's/90's (NES games like Simpsons), to the recent remakes of Pitfall on PC/16 bit consoles.
On the other hand, you've got some of these 'old' guys working on Linux and other open/free projects, that ha
On the other hand, you've got some of these 'old' guys working on Linux and other open/free projects, that have been cranking out code since the 70's.
There is far less stress in open source. You have more freedom with release dates, slipping the schedule, features, etc. Not to mention you only have to work on what interests you.
I don't think he's "burned out" so much as ready to move on. He's got a new child to spend time with and a human space flight industry to turn upside down. Both of these would be higher on my "things to do" list than making another game engine.
I'm sure he'll go back to doing what he's best known for sooner or later... especially if the rocket thing doesn't quite work out.
People who are the best at what they do can never really quit. He'll retire and come back just like Michael Jordon. If anything he'll see trends in the game industry that he doesn't agree with and he won't be able to resist stepping in to show people his way of doing things.
Why CNN/Money is taking a stance on how long someone will work is beyond me. There's honest reporting and then there's implying that Id Software is not going somewhere because its founder has a new baby and a hobby building rockets. I mean, if you want to know what John Carmack's plans are, can't somebody just ask the guy? Geez.
if you want to know what John Carmack's plans are, can't somebody just ask the guy?
People have asked him what his plans are. They've all been alongs the lines of 'maybe one more game engine', 'not sure after this one', and 'I have no clear plans for my next 20 years of my life'.
by Anonymous Coward writes:
on Thursday September 09, 2004 @04:14PM (#10205243)
Considering that Doom 3 has not lived up to its expectactions besides being a tech demo, how well would the game have done and how much better would it be if John Romero was still there?
Answer: Simple. Romero would have made it legendary.
but no prize. Doom 3 has in fact surpassed most informed expectations both critically and commercially. Few people thought the scare factor would be so powerful.
Considering that Doom 3 has not lived up to its expectactions besides being a tech demo, how well would the game have done and how much better would it be if John Romero was still there?
Answer: Simple. Romero would have made it legendary.
I thought DOOM 3 was an great game. It had a decent storyline, was well paced, and was fun. On top of that of course, the graphics, and the sound and music. All and all, in terms of 'full fledged' games, Doom 3 is id's best to date. Most of their older games were pur
Why are we all sitting around speculating about this ? I only read this article to see if John Carmack posted a comment. WMDs, Carmack retires - typical CNN bullshit.
God, you people are whiney bitchs sometimes. If I ever needed to become stupider, i'd come here and actually READ your comments.
*sigh*
Don't you all have anything better to do than discredit the guy who makes the game engines for the games that you spend hours upon hours playing, losing track of time beating, etc. etc. etc?!?
Bunch a babies.
Although I still have respect for his technical prowess. After picking up Masters of Doom (almost done), I don't regard him as a god anymore. Like most geeks, his human-relations skills, according to the book, were lacking, and made it difficult to work with him.
It describes how, when he felt Romero was not putting enough time into the development of Quake, Carmack crafted a quick program to log how much time Romero was on his computer. He later used this data as "proof" that Romero was not pulling his
On the bottom of this page [cnn.com] it mentions they are thinking of a Doom movie
Finally, there's the long-in-development "Doom" movie. Bounced around Hollywood for years, the rights to the film now rest with Universal Pictures. And, barring production delays, it now looks like the film could be a reality.
GameSpy: Are you going to retire after DOOM 3? John Carmack: No. I've got at least one more rendering engine to write. The development of rendering engines is driven by two major factors. One of these is, of course, the question, "When you finish a game, is it time to write a new engine?" The answer is based on what is happening in the hardware space...
Perhaps you should read the article. Although I agree that the CNN speculation is stupid, they're talking about him retiring after the NEXT game that's coming after Doom 3.
Some may feel the inclination to blame (and flame) John for the disappointments of Doom 3, but it's really not his fault. The engine was almost ready in 2001 and it was amazing back then. The game should have been released in late 2002 or early 2003, but (as John himself told), the artists had extremely crappy tools and couldn't efficiently) work on art for a year and the team had some internal problems, slowing the work down further. Likewise, Brussard is not at fault that DNF is not yet released.:)))
John's engines are great, and the only reason why Doom 3 is disappointing and not much better than CryEngine/Source/X-Ray is that they had time to catch up. How it will work out in the future, I don't know... Everyone salivates about Unreal 3 technology and there are good reasons for it, but I think John may be able to bring another revolution and let's hope the id team will make it in time.
Right now top of the line cards play the game at 70+ fps in hi-res, which is excessive. It probably took several years for this to happen with Quake 3, for example.
Back in 2003 a moderately system with 1.5GHz processor and GeForce4 would probably play the game at ~20 fps in 1024x768. A top system would make it 30 fps. A lower-end system would need quality toned down a bit to get the 20 fps at 640x480.
But that was expected. Even a few months ago people here at/. and everywhere constantly repeated what tur
I thought Carmack already made this known prior to the release of Doom3, saying there was no more he could do and losing interest. Now his thing is the space travel endeavor he has started.
But as I said before without Romero Doom 3 isnt the same, perhaps it is time to leave while on top.
Oh well (Score:3, Insightful)
Just as 2.0 came out...
Re:colour (Score:2, Informative)
Re:colour (Score:2)
Re:colour (Score:4, Funny)
So you are a very interesting diesel engine which is commonly used in marine & rail applications which can't spell but sounds really cool...
I'm confused.
No.... (Score:1)
Trust me, he knows Mars!
Re:No.... (Score:2)
Re:Oh well (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Oh well (Score:2)
Re:Oh well (Score:1, Flamebait)
What, both of them?
Chris Mattern
Re:Oh well (Score:2)
Rockets and Impact (Score:5, Funny)
Well, I guess the former's ok but the latter might be bad for your new spaceflight business.
Re:Rockets and Impact (Score:2)
Re:Rockets and Impact (Score:2)
Here's the news release on his recent crash:
http://www.armadilloaerospace.com/n.x/Armadillo
And here's the video:
http://media.armadilloaerospace.com/2004_08_08/
Say it ain't so John (Score:1)
Sad (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Sad (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Sad (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Sad (Score:1)
The Parable of Ronald Regan
Donald Regan awoke to find that his arms had been gnawed off by wild beavers in his sleep.
"Boy!" he thought as he bolted upright in his blood-soaked sheets. "It's a good thing this parable isn't about ME!"
- Principia Discordia (SJG edition)
Re:Sad (Score:1)
He's kind of an idol, as much as Torvalds and Stallman, to me. Although I don't have a little shrine containing their images t
Re:Sad (Score:2)
If he does go... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:If he does go... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:If he does go... (Score:1)
...so what? Re:If he does go... (Score:2)
He will?
Doom 3 is the best tech demo ever made and possibly the best mod platform ever made but I'd rank it third or forth best FPS this year.
It's not scary, it's cheap. Yes, it will startle you because stuff will appear right beside the character. After the reload the trigger point is known (though they're almost always obvious anyway).
While I can in no way slight his technical skills, I welcome a game industry without his hand in actual *games*. He freely admits he d
Off Topic: Sig (Score:1)
Re:Good (Score:3, Insightful)
Thief, Half-life, Hexen, Soldier of Fortune come to mind ; as well as many games i might have forgotten.... And don't forget about the modifications either.
I think id software proved themselves to make great engines, and other studios take on the task to make even better games with it.
Re:Good (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Good (Score:2)
Thanks for brushing that one up
Re:Good (Score:2)
Re:Good (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Good (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Good (Score:5, Insightful)
I agree! It sucks how he keeps making other games not fun! What a drag! Not to mention the fact that he is holding back the industry from trying new concepts. When he stops making games, all other games will become much better! I'll finally be able to think of new game ideas.
Hey Moderators - how about modding the parent post down, and instead modding up someone who has some real criticism of Carmack. I appreciate that someone might not like his games, but blaming him for all games being not fun is senseless.
Re:Good (Score:1)
The thing is, developers see Doom3, and think only in terms of small changes.
I have not seen anything interesting in 3D perspective game in a looong time, the only one that comes to mind is the Soul Reaver [eidosinteractive.com] line of games.
Better graphics doesn't make better games. The youth of today doesn't get that.
I prefer IRL fistfighting, so I do that on my spare time. Because it's a challange, and exciting too.
Re:Good (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Good (Score:1, Troll)
So you haven't enjoyed video/computer games since the late 80's/early 90's? Why the hell would the retirement of a programmer who started AFTER you stopped having fun be helpful to the gaming industry?
I was wondering when this would come up (Score:3, Insightful)
I note that this was also bandied around when he was working on the Doom 3 engine, where he said somehting akin to having "one more good engine in him"
Re:I was wondering when this would come up (Score:2)
And isn't he always in favor of Nvidia? Maybe ATI will win from here on.
Putting speculation to rest... (Score:4, Funny)
Should've previewed... (Score:2)
Try this link [slashdot.org] instead.
* Rolls Eyes * (Score:5, Funny)
Developers at Id have all been asked this question at one point in time, and all have said "yeah, he probably has one or two more engines in him." All have pretty much indicated that he has a "holy grail" engine he has constantly been working towards since he wrote his first side-scroller. Once he gets that done, he'll probably go launch himself into space and work on the teleporter on Phobos himself.
Duh (Score:1)
I think I speak for just about everyone when I say (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, OK.
Epitaph (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Epitaph (Score:1)
When the day comes, sabbatical not retirement (Score:5, Insightful)
The above should not be interpreted to suggest that he will continue coding 3D shooter engines. Just that he will most likely be coding something.
Re:When the day comes, sabbatical not retirement (Score:2, Interesting)
He's probably just burned out.
Game programmers usually don't have really long careers. A big hit or two, and that's about it. Guys will start a company, have a huge game, then it'll break up.
One example would be David Crane, he's made a number of games, from the late 70's (Atari hits like Pitfall!), to the 80's/90's (NES games like Simpsons), to the recent remakes of Pitfall on PC/16 bit consoles.
On the other hand, you've got some of these 'old' guys working on Linux and other open/free projects, that ha
Far less stress in open source (Score:2)
There is far less stress in open source. You have more freedom with release dates, slipping the schedule, features, etc. Not to mention you only have to work on what interests you.
Re:Far less stress in open source (Score:1)
You need to work on games like Daikatana, and Duke Nukem Forever then.
Re:When the day comes, sabbatical not retirement (Score:1)
I'm sure he'll go back to doing what he's best known for sooner or later... especially if the rocket thing doesn't quite work out.
He will never really retire (Score:4, Insightful)
bullshit "journalism" (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:bullshit "journalism" (Score:1, Interesting)
People have asked him what his plans are. They've all been alongs the lines of 'maybe one more game engine', 'not sure after this one', and 'I have no clear plans for my next 20 years of my life'.
Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:3, Interesting)
Answer: Simple. Romero would have made it legendary.
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:1)
by putting hellspawned frogs in it?
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:2)
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:1)
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:2)
I can't leave without my Martian Buddy Superfly!
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:2)
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:2)
True, Romero does make legendary games. Daikatana totaly legendary.
But not in a good way.
Nice try Mr. Romero (Score:1)
Re:Doom 3 failure = lack of John Romero (Score:2)
Answer: Simple. Romero would have made it legendary.
I thought DOOM 3 was an great game. It had a decent storyline, was well paced, and was fun. On top of that of course, the graphics, and the sound and music. All and all, in terms of 'full fledged' games, Doom 3 is id's best to date. Most of their older games were pur
this is so stupid (Score:2)
Waaaaaaaah, I want my mommy! (Score:2, Insightful)
slightly related (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:slightly related (Score:1)
Masters of Doom (Score:1, Interesting)
It describes how, when he felt Romero was not putting enough time into the development of Quake, Carmack crafted a quick program to log how much time Romero was on his computer. He later used this data as "proof" that Romero was not pulling his
Re:Masters of Doom (Score:1)
Doom Movie mentioned (Score:3, Interesting)
Finally, there's the long-in-development "Doom" movie. Bounced around Hollywood for years, the rights to the film now rest with Universal Pictures. And, barring production delays, it now looks like the film could be a reality.
Next game announced... (Score:5, Funny)
Lord, we call this news?! (Score:5, Informative)
John Carmack is an accessible public figure. If you want to know, ask him. There's no need for speculation.
Re:Lord, we call this news?! (Score:2, Informative)
It's not his fault that Doom 3 sucks (Score:4, Interesting)
John's engines are great, and the only reason why Doom 3 is disappointing and not much better than CryEngine/Source/X-Ray is that they had time to catch up. How it will work out in the future, I don't know... Everyone salivates about Unreal 3 technology and there are good reasons for it, but I think John may be able to bring another revolution and let's hope the id team will make it in time.
Re:It's not his fault that Doom 3 sucks (Score:1)
Back in 2003 a moderately system with 1.5GHz processor and GeForce4 would probably play the game at ~20 fps in 1024x768. A top system would make it 30 fps. A lower-end system would need quality toned down a bit to get the 20 fps at 640x480.
But that was expected. Even a few months ago people here at
Given? (Score:2)
Now his thing is the space travel endeavor he has started.
But as I said before without Romero Doom 3 isnt the same, perhaps it is time to leave while on top.
John's last line ? (Score:1)
*Washington* state