Sony Finally Turning a Profit On PS3s 117
When the PS3 launched in 2006, estimates pegged the price of producing the consoles to be as much as $250 more than the price at which they were sold. Production costs have dropped since then, but there have been several price cuts as well. Now, almost four years later, Sony Worldwide Studios president Shuhei Yoshida says they're finally turning a profit on the hardware.
"This year is the first time that we are able to cover the cost of the PlayStation 3,' Yoshida said. 'We aren't making huge money from hardware, but we aren't bleeding like we used to.' In May, Sony began shipping new PlayStation 3 consoles with smaller and more cost-effective graphics chips. Now, Yoshida said, Sony is looking at replenishing retail stock that has been running on empty since January rather than cutting the price. 'When we bring the cost of hardware down, we are looking at opportunities to adjust prices if we believe that will increase demand,' he explained. 'At the moment, we are trying to catch up our production.'"
Why cut prices? (Score:3, Interesting)
Why not return the features that were removed? Why not add more features? I was going to buy a PS3, but scrapped those plans when several things went out the window. How many other people are like me?
A cheaper turd is still a turd.
Re:Why cut prices? (Score:5, Interesting)
Features such as PS2 backward compatibility. I'd mention Linux but, frankly, the backward compatibility is the big one.
Funny that they don't mention dropping hardware for PS2 games. Wikipedia says they don't even emulate anymore. Guess that saves them some time and money too.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Why cut prices? (Score:4, Informative)
It wasn't software emulation at all at first, and it was never all software emulation. The very first PS3s actually had what amounted to a PS2 built into them (hardware compatible PS3s were never sold at all in Europe). Then they eliminated the most of that hardware and covered it up with software emulation (which resulted in the PS2 emulation breaking with some PS2 games). Then they eliminated the rest of it and told folks, "Want a PS2? Buy a PS2." PS3 models that were built to emulate PS2s still do; it's just Sony hasn't manufactured PS3s that do that for years now.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Why cut prices? (Score:5, Informative)
You can see the evidence if you open a PS3 with PS2 backwards compatibility, and one without and compare their motherboards (or go to a website that does that sort of thing). Then you'll see that the newer ones don't have the PS2 chips. PS2 emulation on PS3 always relied on PS2 hardware inside the PS3. At first it had both the CPU and GPU, then they removed the CPU and emulated it on the Cell processor but left the GPU in there. Finally they removed the GPU so it wasn't possible to run PS2 games anymore. I don't think the PS3 is powerful enough to emulate PS2 games at full speed in software.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
I'd also like to recommend to Slashdot readers the cheap PS3 route; I bought a YLOD 60GB unit (with a 320 GB drive in it) for $100 off Cragslist. Disassemble it, remove thermal compound from the RSX and Cell, and bake the motherboard in an oven at 425 for 12 minutes. I've done this twice, and gotten good results both times. I think I'm the best uncle ever; I
Re: (Score:2)
Why would anyone buy a PS2 if he can have a PS3. I never understood that. I would never play a PS2 game on a PS3. Why? For what? And if you have PS2 games it is highly likely you do have a PS2. So again, why?
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
How about cost? I bought my current PS2 slim a few years ago, but after the PS3 had launched. The PS2 was at the time about 30% of the price of the then-new PS3. I needed a new DVD player at the time, which the PS2 was good for (and which I still use today as my main DVD player), plus I'm not a console-heavy gamer. I prefer gaming on PC, but I have picked up a dozen or so PS2 games at a fraction of their original price. Compare that to the ridiculous price a current-gen console game sells for when new. I ha
Re: (Score:1)
Graphics to the max of what standard definition is capable of, very rich 3D environments.
Today the PS2 is a very affordable (cheap) console, with a gaming experience on pair with high end systems, I would only recommend getting a PS3 or XBOX to hardcore gamers, for everyone else, the PS2 is the console to love.
Who cares about AC3 sound or super high resolution, when you are having great of fun shooting and escaping from enemies in fast-paced games like "Black" or "Call of
Re: (Score:2)
And if you have PS2 games it is highly likely you do have a PS2.
Unless your PS2 broke, or unless you're getting into PS2 for the first time after seeing the low price of used game discs. Or unless Sony stops making new PS2 consoles, which will cause the eBay price for used ones to shoot up.
Re: (Score:2)
Or unless Sony stops making new PS2 consoles, which will cause the eBay price for used ones to shoot up.
This hasn't happened historically. The eBay price is loosely fixed to the Funcoland^WGamestop price. It's not until the console becomes scarce that the value begins to rise; there's more used PS2s out there than at which you can can safely shake sticks.
Re: (Score:2)
The eBay price is loosely fixed to the Funcoland^WGamestop price.
Until even GameStop stores stop carrying PS2. I got my Dreamcast on clearance; GameStop stores don't carry them anymore.
there's more used PS2s out there than at which you can can safely shake sticks.
This will remain true only until the lasers in existing units start dying. Then the console will start to become scarce. Or is it like the NES, where an easily found replacement ZIF connector makes a console work like new?
Re: (Score:2)
Until even GameStop stores stop carrying PS2. I got my Dreamcast on clearance; GameStop stores don't carry them anymore.
You can still get Dreamcasts for $20 at flea markets and such. By the time this is not true, statistically, no one will care.
This will remain true only until the lasers in existing units start dying. Then the console will start to become scarce. Or is it like the NES, where an easily found replacement ZIF connector makes a console work like new?
I suspect that the laser units will continue to be readily available. They're just ripoffs of discman parts, and they have been since the PS1. This is why they suck so bad, Sony has never been able to make a reliable laser read head, or pickup, or whatever you call it. (It's got the laser, the pickup, the lens, and the lens height control, it ought to be called a head.) If Sony should
Re: (Score:2)
Why would anyone buy a PS2 if he can have a PS3. I never understood that. I would never play a PS2 game on a PS3. Why? For what? And if you have PS2 games it is highly likely you do have a PS2. So again, why?
I have a fat ps2. It has a harddrive in it. I have MCFreeboot, so I don't have to use the dvd drive for anything.
Has a good SNES & Genesis emualtors (others seem a bit lacking, like no harddrive support).
Oh, and I have a ton of games I can play off the harddrive. Plus new games are still being released for it.
Buddy paid me some money to do a ps2 up for him that way. For about the price of a new ps3, he has a ps2 with a bunch of games, like rockband 2 and stuff. He's happy, his kids are happy.
But
Re: (Score:2)
I picked up a PS3 about 9 months ago, primarily because of the Blu-Ray player. I never owned a PS2 so I don't have a library of PS2 games, but I am aware that there is a huge number of really awesome older games for the PS2. Backwards compatibility would be a wonderful feature for me, and users like me. New PS3 games are expensive, but for $20 I can grab a classic game (or two) from Gamestop.
I always assumed this was reason Sony discontinued backwards compatibility support was to discourage the second-han
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Why would anyone buy a PS2 if he can have a PS3. I never understood that. I would never play a PS2 game on a PS3. Why? For what? And if you have PS2 games it is highly likely you do have a PS2. So again, why?
I don't match any of your scenario.
I never had a PS2, and I bought a PS3 specifically for its PS2 compatibility. Actually, I bought a PS3 when they announced they were clearing stock of PS2 compatible PS3. Guess what, I still were able to buy old PS2 games new, and several PS2 games I bought went gold after I bought my PS3, like Persona 4.
And I play all my PS2 games on PS3. Even worse for you, I even play PS1 games on it!!!
Some people are more gamers than graphics whores, which is why FFVII PSN sold very we
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
I have dozens of Sing Star games. I don't want to throw those away just because I've played them once.
Re: (Score:1)
Features such as PS2 backward compatibility. I'd mention Linux but, frankly, the backward compatibility is the big one.
Funny that they don't mention dropping hardware for PS2 games. Wikipedia says they don't even emulate anymore. Guess that saves them some time and money too.
the ps2 hardware emulator was removed right after launch, european ps3 never had it, instead they used a software based emulator, so yeah there was no real reason to remove it from newer models to cut the price, the only reason is that the ps2 is still selling well after 10 years, and probably because the emulator didn't work very well. Microsoft halted the xbox1 emulator development after a few months too but I don't know if they removed it from newer models.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
This earlier post [slashdot.org] in this same thread corrects you.
(My european PS3 does indeed have hardware to do PS2 emulation)
Re: (Score:2)
No, the Euro version never had full harware BC. The launch US 60GB and 20GB had the Emotion Engine (CPU) as well as the GPU from the PS2 built in.
The launch versions in Europe had the GPU, but used software emulation of the EE right from the beginning.
There has never been any version anywhere that had full software emulation of the CPU AND GPU, so when people say software emulation, they mean of the CPU only.
So no, your European PS3 does not have hardware BC. It has the software emulation.
Re: (Score:2)
The launch versions in Europe had the GPU, but used software emulation of the EE right from the beginning.
==
(My european PS3 does indeed have hardware to do PS2 emulation)
***
so when people say software emulation, they mean of the CPU only
No, as evident from several posts in this thread where people believe Sony "turned off" software emulation in newer PS3s when the fact is that the hardware support isn't there.
Re: (Score:2)
My 360 elite still plays original xbox games I have around. Cant speak for the slim though.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Some say it's an emulator, but considering how it requires downloading some kind of compatibility info for each game to your 360, I'm guessing it's a compatibility layer.
It's what the emulation scene calls a "high-level emulator". It emulates the user mode part of the game (which is x86 bytecode) and reimplements the "Windows XB" operating system (which is function names).
Re: (Score:1)
I always assumed the downloading for every new game you insert was the xbox downloading code to sign the executable to your system. Maybe I'm just being paranoid. I just find it really odd that after you download an arcade game, it has to download MORE data. Couldn't it have done it all at once? Or fix the original download?
Re: (Score:2)
I'd mention Linux but, frankly, the backward compatibility is the big one.
At least, if backward compatibility ever worked on your PS3, it still works today. But Linux was forcibly removed from bought-and-paid-for consoles—at least, it was if you wanted to continue using any online services, and many people applied the patch anyway without knowing that their Linux installations would be trashed—because of some paranoid anti-piracy strategy. That isn't just corporate greed undermining a product's features, it's downright malicious to your private property, much like the
Just use PCSX2 (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Backward compatibility bothered me at first because I wanted to consolidate things; but there are so many great PS3 games out there now, that I just don't have time to play them all. I still have my old PS2 with some unfinished games that I never seem to turn on anymore.
I guess if you're a voracious gamer who spends 40 hours a week finishing one game after the other, you should worry about having a huge library available. But since I only average 5-10 hours a week, the PS3 market keeps me more than satisf
Re: (Score:2)
I have one of the 60GB PS3's from the first run - the ones with the hardware PS2 emulation. Recently someone offered me an xbox slim & a ps3 slim for it, which I found hilarious.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Blu ray playback is still fully available, and support has been added to ever since the release, to become a REALLY good BluRay player.
The only thing that has been removed by Firmware is the OtherOS (allow running of linux). The PS3 slim never had that capability anyway.
Backward compatibility was available 100% on initial sales of the PS3 in the US, by including the full PS2 HARDWARE in the console. That got removed in a hardware update. The initial Euro versions had the GPU, but the CPU was emulated. Even
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Hardware wise, the only "audio format" that was removed was the SA-CD (and maybe DVD Audio) which went with the 40gb PS3. Not a "great" loss, but then again, it has gained other formats (such as WMA, etc) which were not in the launch configs.
The USB ports, are annoying, but not a "great" loss, as you can add a normal USB 2.0 hub quite easily, I bought a 7 port one, and it works fine. I do have a really big issue that they didnt put at least one USB port on the back on all versions (which would make the addi
Re: (Score:1, Troll)
Ditto. I was planning to purchase a PS/3 for our home entertainment system just before they decided to end support for the Other OS feature.
Then again, their Linux support was never that great with their intentionally crippled hypervisor. What use is a Linux console without accelerated 3d and video? I can build a dual core system with 2gigs ram and accelerated graphics for under $150.
Re: (Score:1)
I can build a dual core system with 2gigs ram and accelerated graphics for under $150.
Where? In Lala-land? A *decent* dual-core mobo and the CPU would already be around $150. Add another $100 or $150 for a starter graphics card.
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
I'm in the same boat. There is a ton of PS2 games which i like. in fact, there's a whole lot more ps2 games that I like, than PS3 ones. And there's also a lot of PS ONE games that are still great fun. Asking for backwards compatibility to that level would be way, waaaaayyy too optimistic.
Re: (Score:2)
All PS3s (and PS2s and PSPs) can play PS1 games.
Re: (Score:2)
All PS3s (and PS2s and PSPs) can play PS1 games.
Has the entire library of PS1 games been made available in the PSN store, or are some still missing due to copyright issues?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Actually it DOES upscale PS1 games and performs smoothing too. http://manuals.playstation.net/document/en/ps3/current/settings/gamesettings.html#2443 [playstation.net]
Re: (Score:2)
I have not checked, especially recently, but my impression is that it is just a sampling of popular titles, nothing even close to the entire library.
Re: (Score:2)
not only that, but the price was atrocious at launch. Did it really take them 4 years to realize that they needed to lower the price from the straosphere?
$400-600 for a console is retarded.
Re: (Score:2)
Prices were lowered years ago. Not to their present level, that took a couple of steps, but they began lowering when they took the BC out a couple of years ago.
Re: (Score:2)
BC? (what does that stand for)?
anyway, they're still at $275-$400+, which is still atrocious. Sony just doesn't want to give in to market pressure, you know, demand, which says that lower price = higher demand and a better revenue (Although a smaller margin). Given mass manufacturing, shrinking your margins to raise your revenue is an obvious decision.
Sony has been retarded on this. Anyone with basic economics could have told them this from the start.
Re: (Score:2)
Why not return the features that were removed? Why not add more features? I was going to buy a PS3, but scrapped those plans when several things went out the window. How many other people are like me?
A cheaper turd is still a turd.
I'm with you on that.
I guess those conflict minerals are bloody cheap (Score:2, Troll)
1. use conflict minerals to make playstations [kotaku.com]
2. fund warlords
3. ???
4. profit!
Re: (Score:1)
Why indeed. It seems to me that the most profitable and smart solution is to have "trim levels" for the PS3 (or any game console for that matter) separate from the hard drive size. At launch, if I recall, the PS3 was about $800 US. It could replace the following hardware: Blu-ray player, DVD player, CD player, PS1, PS2, PC (taking advantage of the Linux option), Anything that has a PPC emulator for Linux (NES, Sega, etc.), DVR (so I've heard), and possibly others in one box.
It was the ideal machine for peo
Re: (Score:1)
IOW, SNAFU (Score:3, Insightful)
The old hardware's too pricy to keep making, there's not enough of the new cheap stuff so they're bleeding in new and interesting ways - not having enough product to sell is making distributors angry and their profits small. They're hoping that passing on some of the savings to some of the distributors will make them less angry. That will make their per-unit profit even smaller but they hope to compensate with volume, maybe, someday, when they are able to make enough of the damn things.
SNAFU? Not necessarily... (Score:2)
That will make their per-unit profit even smaller but they hope to compensate with volume
If they make a profit on the hardware at all, they are in a better position then before.
Most of the time (and including earlier PS3), console hardware is sold at a loss to push it into the market and the vendor regains the money from game sales. The Wii was the first among the current generation consoles that broke this tradition. Now, after some cost-saving redesigns, PS3 sales also cover the cost for the hardware. I'm not sure about the present situation of the XBox 360, but when it was new it was sold at
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Most of the time (and including earlier PS3), console hardware is sold at a loss to push it into the market and the vendor regains the money from game sales. The Wii was the first among the current generation consoles that broke this tradition.
This "everyone sells its console at a loss" is a myth.
This was never a tradition, so the Wii didn't break any tradition. Nintendo is the older console manufacturer still alive, so is the traditional one, and they never sold their console at a loss, except the very first months of Gamecube because they quickly dropped the price before launch.
Sony is the big one that introduced this business tactic that was then followed by several companies or gaming division of companies which all met their demise. This inc
Nintendo says... (Score:5, Funny)
"What's that?! Speak up! I can't hear you from this giant pool of money I'm swimming like Scrooge McDuck!"
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
I was thinking more in terms of home console (profits from base system) vs home console (profits from base system). You know, Wii vs PS3. Yes, yes, they're not direct as in beer competitors Coors and Bud (in that they're selling the same piss flavored shit) but they are still aiming for the same function so there's a pretty big overlap of markets.
Also, PS3 is getting its own motion controller. Different products are becoming not as different.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Sony is pushing 3D gaming, which makes the PS3 a direct competitor of the 3DS.
Anyone who remembers SCEA's almost-ban on 2D games from the PS1 and PS2 era will take issue with your comment. At least one Metal Slug game was Xbox-exclusive in North America because of this. By "3D" did you mean stereoscopic?
Re:Nintendo says... (Score:5, Insightful)
Handy tip for those who don't know: Add #t=XXmYYs to any Youtube link to jump directly to that timestamp.
The above AC link would become http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vouJTvrpHGQ#t=3m30s [youtube.com] - and you can thus easier see how non-funny it was.
And just in time! (Score:5, Funny)
Now, they can start not making a profit again when they ship Move!
Re: (Score:2)
That's the risk that anyone runs by being an early adopter of any new tech. I had a similar experience with the Xbox 360 (though MS did man up and extend the original warranty). That is why I waited for a few generations to get a PS3.
Could Sony have done more product testing and developed a more reliable system? Probably. But I doubt they intentionally engineered a defect just to make money on repair services. I think Sony would be much happier if every unit they manufactured performed perfectly fo
Re: (Score:2)
Except Sony's rewarded early adopters of PS3s with PS3s that do more than the current PS3 (save one feature). Launch PS3s could do backwards compatibility (it had a full PS2 inside it, unlike second revision GPU-only). It used to do Linux. It had a card reader (useful if you wa
Has the console arms race ended for now? (Score:4, Insightful)
3DO, Dreamcast, Saturn, PS1, Atari Jaguar, N64, Philips CD-i, in addition to existing ones like Genesis/SegaCD/32x and SNES which were in the prime of their lives in the early 90s.
Now the 360 has been out for five years and the PS3 has been out for four. Neither company seems interested in making new hardware anymore, which is understandable since they lost so much money working out the bugs. But it seems that nobody wants to one-up the other anymore.
Rather than pursue hardware that is clearly superior to their competitor (as many attempted in the 90s), they just blow money purchasing exclusives.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
Maybe they noticed the success of casual gaming (Wii mostly), and figured that better profits await if they can sell equipment to wider audience. That instead of pushing expensive bleeding-edge hardware to small group of hardcore gamers.
Hopefully a break in hardware race forces the game publishers to move from "my effect-bling is better than yours" mode to actually compete in gameplay and quality content.
Casual? (Score:3, Informative)
Maybe they noticed the success of casual gaming (Wii mostly), and figured that better profits await if they can sell equipment to wider audience.
Or maybe they're gluing feathers onto their bodies and trying to fly. I wouldn't say "casual" is exactly the right word [50webs.com] for Nintendo's strategy.
Re: (Score:2)
Anyone new to this market would be sued out of existence by the holders of game related patents (not to mention the initial cost of hardware development, the initial cost of software development - devices and SDKs, the cost to produce games that will sell the console and so on)
Re: (Score:2)
There is little point upgrading hardware for any other reason than improved visuals. You can get better rendering, AA, FPS. etc, but most people are satisfied with the visual quality of the current HD gaming systems.
Are there even enough potential buyers to support a new generation of consoles? I honestly don't know, but I think they are aiming at the majority of the user base (casual), like myself who will need some serious justification to encourage me to buy a new
Re: (Score:2)
I also think the economy has a big part to play in things as well. It's taken Sony 4 years to break even. And given how much it cost initially, it priced a lot of people out of the market. Especially casual gamers. I have a PS2 now collecting dust because I don't have time but more over it got to the point where I wasn't willing to pay out $60 per game. Most of the PS2 titles I have were the $20 bargin games that had been out for a while. People just don't have the money to spend on it as much because
The empty shelves claim again, Sony? Really? (Score:3, Funny)
Good job Sony! (Score:2, Funny)
Dear Sony (I know your a shiver corporate hivemind is lurking here)
Like to topic says, good job and congratulations on finally turning a profit on your product!
You only had to alienate a large section of your customers and potential customers. Hell you even managed to piss off The USAF, so that's something at least.
Odd.... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
I think they bought into their own hype. They thought they could make a machine so powerful that the Xbox 360 wouldn't be able to touch it, and that people would pay a ton of money for it. They also convinced themselves that the world was hungry for Blu-ray the same way that it had been for DVDs.
It turned out that $500-$600 was excessive for many people, the Cell processor didn't provide an insurmountable advantage, and PS3 games are not always graphically superior to 360 games. And while the Blu-ray player
Re: (Score:2)
Yeah, I'm one of SCEfoo's hardcore fans, GAP member and everything. If they'd have asked me back in the PS2 era what kind of features I would have wanted in the PS3 I would have said:
1. HD output.
2. Ability to run Linux out of the Box with no additional hardware required.
3. built in hard drive.
4. built in memory stick reader
5. at least 4 USB ports.
6. PS2/PS1 compatibility.
7. PS3 versions of the PS2 Japan only BBN features (web browser, CD ripping, video, demos, downloads)
So they listened to people like me
Unfortunately, they had to cut a few features (Score:2, Funny)
To make this profit, though, Sony had to cut a few features from consoles (retroactively for already-sold ones as well, unfortunately):
* Linux can't be used anymore (we already know about this one)
* Blu-ray playback now includes commercials every 15 minutes
* When connected to the Internet, you must allow it to be a node in a botnet, or online play will be disabled
* To save cost, gaphics are now displayed as in The Matrix, but they say you'll quickly be able to see everything in 3D with some practice
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:1)
I think they make a loss on hardware but make it up on the fat margins on games when the console is launched. Now they've finally reached the point where both the console and the games are profitable.
Probably the XBox360 is profitable too.
Which makes you wonder if the Sony and Microsoft couldn't just both agree to not launch any new consoles since that would put them back in the position of selling at a loss again.
Re: (Score:2)
Which makes you wonder if the Sony and Microsoft couldn't just both agree to not launch any new consoles since that would put them back in the position of selling at a loss again.
Which would work, for a time. But Nintendo would eventually launch a new system whose graphics capabilities were on par with or better than the 360 and PS3, begin recapturing the hardcore gamer demographic, and that would be the end of that.
Total profit per PS3.. (Score:1)
I just bought a PS3 (Score:1)
- Do I need another general purpose computing device?
- To make it a good gaming PC to play latest titles with decent graphics, I need to shell out at least 500 or more (add another 100-150 for a monitor, luckily I was just going to hook it to a TV)
- Can i get similar media solutions on non-PCs
The PS3, at least for me, was already designed for gaming, decent with media (and hook to media servers -
Re: (Score:2)
Reading your list, I'm curiious why you went with PlayOn as a media server when it costs money.. I stream just about everything possible via MediaTomb for free.. Any DLNA or uPNP based server will work. PS3 doesn't read MKV's but a lot of the servers transcode on the fly now (won't work well for 10g 1080p movies tho..)
There's another server... Playstation Media Server or something? Can find with google that works really well (but requires a GUI or Windows which my Linux Server doesn't have)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Further to my post..
http://mediatomb.cc/ [mediatomb.cc]
That's what I use.. it's not very user friendly but very customizable.. I have it (almost) setup exactlly how I want it, and doesn't require much
Playstation Media Server is what I recommend when people want something that just works, and the media server is a Windows Box (also runs OSX and Linux I believe). Seems pretty sweet honestly, but haven't tried it myself.
http://ps3mediaserver.blogspot.com/ [blogspot.com]
or
http://code.google.com/p/ps3mediaserver/ [google.com]
Good luck, if you go with Me
It's from buying replacments (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
re-enable linux then? (Score:1)
This would be a good time then, to re-enable OtherOS again.
Universities that buy ps3 farms would no longer hurt them, but help them instead.