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The Internet Entertainment Games

Building The Ideal Geek Gaming Center? 127

Posted by simoniker from the i-want-every-game-ever-and-and-and dept.
MongooseCN writes "After seeing the popularity of multiplayer gaming and the desire for fellow geeks to find better means of socializing, I've decided to open up a geek gaming center. It would allow people to play games together in the same building, and to talk and hang out too. I know there are a few of these places already, but few of them have taken into consideration what people want to see in these centers. Most of them open with only the owner's opinion of what would make the place fun. Some don't even allow people to hang out, since they charge by the hour. So what I want to know is what the /. community would like to see in a place like this. I want to start a gathering place for other like minded, techno-savvy geeks. What games, gaming systems/hardware, etc should it have? What would make it a fun place to hang out and meet other people?"
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Building The Ideal Geek Gaming Center? More

Building The Ideal Geek Gaming Center?

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  • Lots of Soda machines

  • Wish you luck. (Score:5, Informative)

    by Godeke ( 32895 ) * on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:20PM (#7989728)
    As a younger geek businessman I ran the numbers on such a place and tried to operate one back in the days of 386/486s. It may seem easy on the surface to run such a center, but make sure you factor in administration (some automated method to reload the machines from images in particular), hardware replacement costs (these centers are *hard* on equipment, due to the "it isn't mine attitude") and general manpower requirement to supervise sales and usage.

    If you have already considered these things, there are some things you can do that increase your revenue and customer retention:

    #1 - Snack bar/coffee shop (depending on your demographic). This should be a separate space adjacent to the computers (allowing drinks and electronics to coexist is not for the weak). You will need a different license to serve food.

    #2 - Adequate space for people to chill out. Atmosphere is key here to retain people and bring them back. Consider TVs like you see in sports bars, except maybe some can be showing the action in the game area. Remember the restrooms: don't make them some pit of dispair... people will avoid coming back.

    #3 - Special events. People will filter in and out, but on those slow days (Monday through Thursday, normally) having special events like tournaments is key to keeping an adequate number of paying customers.

    As far as hardware, you need to run games well, but not to bleeding edge. Since you will replace hardware every year (although the old hardware can then be tasked with server duty or older games), buy something in the mid range. Don't skimp on monitors though: large displays are a good investment, as they will last 3-5 years. Optical mice (no cleaning required, more precision) and throwaway keyboards (they take tons of abuse). Forget about joysticks, they are mostly obsolete, and were a huge expense back in the day.

    You can also consider consoles to augment the PCs: many have great multiplayer support, and on a LAN they rock. Just remember that console or PC, it has to be in a locked cabnets and thus is a pain to change out games), or you can kiss your investment goodbye. (Even with locked cabnets we lost games all the time, usually to brute force attacks, but sometimes to "could you switch this game/distraction created" events).

    As far as layout of the game area, I personally prefer semi private quarter cubicles (obscures line of site to the monitor, but not the people) arranged in circles. Remember good office chairs if you want people to remain for long periods of time.
    • In other words, get good at playing Rollercoaster Tycoon.

    • Re:Wish you luck. (Score:5, Informative)

      by Vaevictis666 ( 680137 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:38PM (#7989957)
      You can also consider consoles to augment the PCs: many have great multiplayer support, and on a LAN they rock. Just remember that console or PC, it has to be in a locked cabnets and thus is a pain to change out games), or you can kiss your investment goodbye. (Even with locked cabnets we lost games all the time, usually to brute force attacks, but sometimes to "could you switch this game/distraction created" events). The solution to this is not have CDRom drives in the machines. Get some licenses for something like Alcohol (or even just pick up Daemon tools, but it's not as user friendly) and host the cloned images on a net share on the server. If you can make it unable to list the directory contents but still allow read access to the files (I'm thinking unix or ftp permissions here) that will prevent blatant file transferring of the images. Then just let people know that the icon in the lower right is the CD switcher. Only install the games on enough machines you have licenses for of course, and then either prevent installers from running (my old Uni had a prog called UnInstallShield that prevented InstallShield from running) or artificially lock down the free space on the games partition to 300-400mb or so, to prevent "extra" installs.

      • Re:Wish you luck. (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Godeke ( 32895 ) *
        I would do it this way today, if I were to do it again. Back then, CD emulation tools were primative. Some games we were able to get to run via NOCD mods or the existing CD tools, but it was just a major pain overall.

        Additionally, tools for locking the desktops down are much more powerful, but so is the complexity of the game install. Most of the games we ran were DOS (which meant a custom menu loaded and selected most games directly - nice). Windows XP's Kiosk mode would be something to investigate (espec

      • Cybercafe software (Score:1)

        by Anonymous Coward
        I'm in the process of setting up some gaming machines for my workplace's lounge area, and have been considering trying to do an "Ask Slashdot" as to what software can be used to get around the need-the-cd problem.

        I see Alchohol mentioned here, and I have a CD with versions of "Cybercafe Pro" and "Cafe Manila" on them, but I haven't checked them out. Can anyone suggest good software towards this end?
        • For image emulation, both Daemon Tools and Alcohol work really well - there are others, but those are the ones I've had personal experience with. I prefer Alcohol personally because it integrates the image-generation bits (which with DT you'd need another prog, like CloneCD) and also has a nice memorized list of images.

          As for creating the images, the two best that I know of are the aforementioned CloneCD and Alcohol. One game in particular (I forget which) refused to accept the CloneCD image in .ccd for

    • Re:Wish you luck. (Score:3, Interesting)

      by wickedj ( 652189 )
      Wow, you really did think about this. I'm impressed.

      On the #2, restrooms a definite selling point. I'm not a hypochondriac but I do get turned off by really bad restrooms. I like my restrooms bright and sterile looking.

      On #3, I agree that special Events are pretty much mandatory in a place like this. The cost of slow days can be alleviated by closing for the day and just opening in the evening (most kids are out of school and workers are off from their jobs by then). Unless of course it's summer or w

    • Some other things to consider... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Alkaiser ( 114022 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @04:10PM (#7990496) Homepage
      Since this is the most correct post so far, I'd just like to add some stuff to this post.

      First, off, have adequate lighting in the computer room. The only places I'd seen that run LAN gaming always turn the damn lights off. Remember that you're not only trying to get geeks in the building, you're trying to get the common man in there too (operating a business trying to specficially target a niche is like trying to run a marathon after shooting yourself in the foot. You can do it, it's just gotten a lot less likely now.) as well as help change the overall perception of geekiness.

      While I'll game with the lights low at home, that's not generally what we'd consider a "friendly" environment for younger gamers, or non-gamers. Plus, even gamers don't really want to be in dimly lit surroundings that aren't their own. You can save on the electric bills by getting some of the low-energy, longer lasting bulbs, while keeping the place nicely lit.

      I'd combine your snack area and the break area. In Japan the internet/gaming cafes I went to brought food to you, but considering they, as a society tend to keep businesses and such fetishistically clean, I'd concur with the above post and keep food and CPUs in seperate areas.

      Stock all the consoles. Offer buybacks for games for store credit. Sell the buyback games you don't need on Ebay for a profit.

      You probably want to staff a short-order cook. (Not a fancy-shmancy guy...someone who can be trusted to make smoothies, burgers, breakfast burritos, and nachos.) TV screens with a tethered remote (VERY important. If I'm the guy with the screen showing the CS action, and I'm the Average Joe trying to watch the Lakers game, I'm going to be less-than-thrilled...the tether keeps the remote from accidentally wandering off.) make the place friendly. Stock some magazines.

      Also, hire janitors. Janitors do a much better job of cleaning stuff than the standard apathetic high-school student forced to wear the cashier hat and the janitor hat. Cleanliness makes your place much more conducive to return visits.

      While we're on the topic of hiring, hire some women. Don't go all out trying to hire really good looking ones, just some decent looking women who have a knowledge of things geek. If they main adequate decorum, they can be a boost to return rates, without you having to be exploitative..just get a good mix of people in there. People who like your business idea, but aren't misanthropes. Simpsons Comic Book Guy is just going to get jumped in under a week.

      On the other side of the coin, the people who don't know anything about games and don't care to learn are going to get chided out of the building. Have the right people on board is going to be key. You don't want EB syndrome, either.

      Have people smoke outside, and make sure there's adequate ventilation. Computers + tons of bodies in seats = lots of hot air.

      Most importantly...calculate out the numbers beforehand. Figure out what you're going to need to break even after determining exact operational costs and make sure you're charging enough. Have a promotional thing with a nearby school, or community college that has a draconian computer lab, and get people in to "beta" the store for you. That'll spread word of mouth, and you're set after that.

      Good luck. Fight the good fight.
      • If you want some ambient light while keeping it dark at the same time (so there isn't glare on the screens), try using blacklights. You can actually buy them in standard 48" fluorescent sizes (so you can use regular lighting fixtures). These provide quite a bit of light, though it may cause eye strain after a couple hours. Might want to have normal light on other half (where the snacks are), which will only encourage food consumption (ching ching).
    • As far as hardware, you need to run games well, but not to bleeding edge.

      You might think about having a few (maybe even just one) top-notch rig. You can either rent them at a slightly higher price or make them VIP machines. Give them to the winner of the last tournament when he/she is around, or maybe to the guy/woman who is currently in last place during the tournament as a sort of consolation prize.

      If all else fails, you can use it when you want to get in on the action.

      Maybe also have some open ethe

      • Re:Wish you luck. (Score:3, Insightful)

        by mcmonkey ( 96054 )
        Maybe also have some open ethernet connections (and perhaps monitors) for people to bring their own computers and play.

        Eh...that's sounds very sketchy. Beyond cheaters, there are virus/trojan/worm issues, on top of the usuall technical issues of added a machine to the network.

        I would reserve this for private parties where one group has the whole room, and you have a damage deposit. I would also have a boot disk with virus scan that runs on every machine before it touches the network.

        • Maybe the best way to solve this problem is to have a set "LAN party room". Have a server in the room with all your ROM images, but now outside connection. People could BYO or use yours, and rent the room for a day ( $100-300, make it $10-20 per player ) plus a discount on food ( $1 hot dogs, like they had at the LOTR trilogy would get scarfed like nobody's business ).

          Make sure that the room has dividers so that teams can talk strategy, and have someone come in once an hour to pick up the trash.
    • Instead of just keeping the consoles locked up near the televisions, why not lock them up behind the main counter? That way, the clerk on duty always has an eye on them, and it will make game swapping a lot easier. Just buy some REALLY long a/v cables, and tuck them under the carpet.
      • Nintendo makes this really easy; just buy 4 Wavebird controllers per console, then lock the console up behind the tv or something. They last forever on 2 AAA (AA?) batteries, and have an insanely large range. Hand out the controllers when they're needed, maybe put some sort of magnetic strip that sets off an alarm if the controller is taken outside.

    • As an addendum, I'd add a very important:

      #4 - Free, and plentiful deodorant/anti-perspirant.

      Seriously man, most LAN places fucking stink of B.O. If they didn't reek so badly, I might even go occasionally.

  • let people hang out and loose money (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    If you want to run a business, you need turnover. Let people hang out, and they will take advantage by bringing in starbucks and filling your ashtrays. There is a reason that the only places that you know about charge by the hour.

    duh.
    • Let people hang out, and they will take advantage by bringing in starbucks and filling your ashtrays.

      Don't allow outside food or drink of course..

      But also, I think the idea about hiring chicks is a great one really, for this demographic.

      Using something like Alcohol 120 is a good idea also.. Having identical PCs of course is a good idea, and maintaining a master image on some locked up computer to ghost out to the game PCs seems mandatory. That way, really.. who cares if a Windows installation gets
      • fyi: in most areas, if you prepare food in your establishment, it's a health-code violation to even allow outside food or drink. Unless the kitchen is closed off from the rest of the store.

        eg. a door in the way and no large open-air counters.

        imo: the best way to do hourly rates is to allow for a monthly membership as well. charge, say, $5/hr, or $10/mo and $3/hr. Hourly rates as sole revenue stream are hard on accounting, as it is entirely undependable.

        In my experience most of these businesses go under
    • Hanging out is kind of important for a good place like that... just do like movie theaters and don't allow outside food and drink. That also brings up an issue: smoking. Allow or disallow? Seperate section? I say no smoking, but I don't smoke.

  • Prices (Score:3, Interesting)

    by illuminatedwax ( 537131 ) <`ude.ogacihcu.inmula' `ta' `egnardts'> on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:26PM (#7989803) Journal
    You're going to want some sort of pricing range that keeps things profitable for you, but doesn't keep gamers away that might not be able to afford games at home. You will probably want to go for more customers at a lower price, because the social "LAN-party" atmosphere is what makes such places fun. You probably won't want to do it on a hourly basis (who wants a time limit playing games?), and maybe have a monthly or yearly pass option available to those that want it. Really, your main profit should come from extras like snacks, just like movie theaters do.

    Also, if you aren't setting this up in a town big enough, you can pretty much bet that it's going to fail relatively quickly.

    Good luck,
    --Stephen

  • Gaming/Cafe (Score:2, Interesting)

    by wickedj ( 652189 )
    You know, I had been thinking about this for a very long time. I think that it would have to have a small cafe area where people can socialize freely and watch current games on monitors (almost like a sports bar). Maybe having it multileveled, gamers downstairs and public viewing/cafe upstairs (almost like an ice skating rink near where I live). Then have several different areas for gaming. A general area with individual gaming units. Some small 4-6 player rooms where teams can play in private. Perhap

  • be wary (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Joe the Lesser ( 533425 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:31PM (#7989873) Homepage Journal
    Geeks need a place that embraces all the major echelons of geekery.

    Do not go all PC or all Mac or all Unix or all Linux.

    Have a variety of games availiable on the computers, from FPS to MMORPGs.

    Have consoles!

    Charge when they leave, have memberships, give the first hour free.

    Allow them to have bottled drinks. (have cupholders, away from the keyboard).

    You may gain extra income by selling video games too, and if you name it right, merchandise will sell.

    Good luck!

    • Re:be wary (Score:5, Insightful)

      by corbettw ( 214229 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:43PM (#7990064) Journal
      Having a wide selection of game systems sounds great, but don't forget you'll need space to put all those computers. Every console you add is another PC you can't have. Same with Mac. It's better to focus on one area, and do it right, than get too spread out.

      To that end, forget about Mac and Linux. There just aren't enough games on those platforms. If you go with a console, pick one, or at most two, but don't have more than 25% consoles. PCs will be your bread and butter, because you can rent time on them for more than just playing games. You'd be surprised how many people come in just to use a fast internet connection to chat with their friends.

      Food and drinks are a must. If anything, lose money on the hourly rental fees and make it up in snacks. Starbucks has proven that people will gladly pay $5 for coffee and $7 for a small brownie. If you charge some nominal amount for computer rental ($2 an hour), you'll be surprised how many people stay there the whole day. Sure, you'll only make $30 on someone on a Saturday, but you'll make another $50 on the food they eat. Also, don't allow any outside drinks or snacks, period. If someone wants to eat while playing, have them pay you, not the Mickie Dee's down the street.

      And don't worry about selling games. Maintaining retail inventory is a bitch, and requires all kinds of controls you won't need for a cafe.

      • Re:be wary (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Firehawke ( 50498 )
        Hmm.. well, one could try setting up a cross-promotion with the guys at Console Classix [consoleclassix.com]-- being able to offer legal emulation would be a huge bonus and allow you to advertise a lot of older games that you just can't find these days.

        Maybe a few arcade machines, while I'm on that line of thinking.. Atari and Capcom offer legal arcade roms through several sources, and if nothing else a couple of the favorites in actual arcade machine form go over very well with the crowds.

        Consoles you'd have to definitely ha
        • Ah, not really thrilled about the idea of replying to myself, but I didn't think about this until AFTER I posted the last one.

          Another idea that comes to mind is to have a tournament platform somewhere in the center of the place. Design it so that you can put whatever you need to in there depending on the situation. Got a counterstrike tournament going on? For the finals, you'll need to put a number of PCs over there. Got a Street Fighter tournament going on? You'll need to be able to put an arcade machine
      • Since you mentioned space, if you (the owner) can afford some extra space consider reserving a special area for people who want to bring their own computers. Just set aside like 4 gaming areas where players can bring in their PC/Mac/laptop and plug into your LAN. Very simple especially thanks to more user friendly networking systems. If it doesn't work out, you could always buy 4 more systems to fill up the slots.

        The reasons for this is simple. First, bragging rights. Every hardcore geek builds their compu

        • One big problem with this idea is the use of bots and cheats. If you don't control the PC, how can you be sure the player isn't cheating?
      • Food and drinks are a must. If anything, lose money on the hourly rental fees and make it up in snacks. Starbucks has proven that people will gladly pay $5 for coffee and $7 for a small brownie.
        Starbucks has shown that to be true for decent coffee and decent brownies. (There's also the factor of atmosphere and cool, hard to re-create on a budget.) Try and sell cheap stuff at those prices and you'll be having a going out of business sales.

  • GameTime Nation (Score:4, Informative)

    by bluethundr ( 562578 ) * on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:32PM (#7989881) Homepage Journal
    A favorite place for me and my fellow IT'ers to hang out at after work is a place called GameTime Nation [gametimenation.com]. What they offer are lots of comfy couches and flat screen (not panel) displays to play the games on. The hardware is a choice of X-Box and PS2 on each machine. With soda/candy for sale and booming hip hop music plus eps of Red Vs Blue projected on the wall the place is a great geek hangout. It has apparently developed a large-ish social network of young hip-hopsters who play (what seems to be) mostly Halo and cheer and jeer each other on voiciferously. It'd be nice to find a correlate that had networked PC hardware, but thus far this place is the best I've found of this type. The one I go to (I think it's a chain) is on 13th (12th? don't go there that often) street between 3rd and 4th Aves in the best city in the world. Close to the Astor Place subway, walkable from Union Square.

  • Geek Gaming Centers (Score:5, Funny)

    by Giant Ape Skeleton ( 638834 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:33PM (#7989905) Homepage
    Around here we call them Chuck E. Cheese.

  • Consoles (Score:1, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Don't forget console games! A great idea for a place like you describe would be to have an area for console gaming, with some couches, big TVs and several game systems and games to choose from. This would also be good for tournaments and the like.

    I know I would like to go to a place where I could place Super Smash Bros or Soul Caliber with a bunch of people. Consider a liquor liscence as well. It would be great to go to a place where you could have a few beers and play some games (a la Dave & Bust

  • license problems (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Tom7 ( 102298 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:36PM (#7989926) Homepage Journal
    Be wary that the licenses for most games don't allow you to just install them on the computers and char people to play. You will need to make special deals with the software publishers, or else just keep quiet and hope they don't sue you. =)

    Also remember that many geeks genuinely prefer the oz curtain of sitting behind a terminal with nobody else around.

  • well, (Score:1)

    by odorf ( 733882 )
    To atract all the true gameing geeks you would have to have two thinks, a real old Super street firghter arcade machine(which many geeks would pay good money just to come and see, none the less play) And an arcade machine with nethack;) Not sure hoe common those are, but:P there's got to be one somewhere!

  • As far as consoles go... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Gothic_Walrus ( 692125 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:37PM (#7989945) Journal
    Having all of the current consoles is a definite requirement. But I'd suggest getting some of the now defunct consoles as well.

    Their benefits? They're cheap and still loads of fun. And you could make the older consoles cheaper to play, if you so desired. In any case, it wouldn't take too long to get a return on your investment.

    At the very least, I'd suggest getting an N64 and a Dreamcast, each with some of the best multiplayer games available. The N64 has a ton of awesome games, but the four required titles are Super Smash Brothers, Goldeneye, Mario Kart 64, and Perfect Dark. Those four alone have given millions of hours of entertainment to gamers worldwide.

    I don't have very much Dreamcast experience, but having a console running the old Capcom fighters (I particularly like the Marvel Vs. Capcom and Street Fighter Alpha series for the DC) would be a great thing.

    Heck, if you really wanted to, get a Genesis with all of the old sports games. Get an NES with all of the classic games - Mario, Ice Climbers, Excitebike, Tetris...Go wild! No matter what, older consoles will STILL be cheaper for you than the newer ones, even if the supply of new games is nonexistent.

    Go retro...it's cheap, and there are still plenty of gamers who love older consoles. Besides...a game never loses its fun as it ages. :)

    • For N64, screw GoldenEye. Get The World Is Not Enough.

      Same James Bond franchise, better game.
    • I'm thinking build a couple of MAME cabinets as well. They don't have to be as grandiose or custom as some people (namely myself) have built, but a monitor with a *good* joystick interface and a quarter drop should be there. Nothing like getting the kids' parents in there at the same time, and the quarters DO add up in no time. MAME ROMs can be bought, legally, on the web.

      --trb
    • Forget the old systems - get emulators on the computers and good gamepads (You might want to buy USB adaptors for the orginal pads). As long as you own copies of the games you won't have any legal problems. This will make maintenance of games much easier (people can't steal them); just make sure that access to writing is cut off - no access to CD-R drives, floppy drives, or unused USB ports. You won't need this on all computers; just the ones designated for old games.
      • Second time I've seen an emulation discussion spring up today...

        Emulated games are NEVER legal if you download them. Ever. If you make the copy yourself, then it's legal...but ONLY for backup purposes.

        Admittedly, Nintendo isn't sending out SWAT teams to seize your computer. Best to be safe rather than sorry, though. And considering where the games would be used (public place), being safe is a very good idea.

    • One of my favorite hole-in-the-wall arcades/pool rooms(The Rack 'n Cue in San Francisco State Uni's student union) has an NES set up at the counter. Anyone can play, though they have to request their game to the person staffing it(not exactly an outsider-friendly system, which is useful in some ways). If anything, it probably helps business, because it gives the place an additional attraction as a "hang-out spot" for the young after-school crowd, one of the place's two sets of core customers. (The other is

    • If you want to appeal to the masses, I suspect that the NESs and Dreamcasts aren't going to go very far. I'm not sure the teens will appreciate your love of classic gaming...

      And one other cautionary note to add to the above and indeed the rest of this thread. Just because a comment is rated +3 or +4 or +5 doesn't mean the author has the faintest notion of business sense. Just because we are gamers doesn't mean we have any idea how to run a gaming centre. All we know is how to use one. Talk to somebody who

  • Does anyone play board and card games socially [theludoclub.com] anymore?

  • If you're going to make it a LAN party design... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by herrvinny ( 698679 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:43PM (#7990055)
    You should run Counterstrike, etc tournaments every once in a while. Helps bring in the people. And people are going to be hard on equipment, so standardize. Select a good gaming system, and buy a lot of them. When you do this, call around. If Dell, Gateway, HP know that you're standardizing on their equipment, they might give you a discount, because their name is going to be all over the place. Take one computer, install what you want on the hard drive, then Ghost the installation to all the other computers. If a computer happens to get a virus or something, just reGhost it.

    There was a /. article a while back about a failed tourny, learn from it's failures. [slashdot.org] Numero uno, cache server. If you're running Steam or something and it needs updates, download the update to a local cache server, then have the client machines "pull" it from the cache server. Two, huge pipeline to the Net. Games like CS can take up a LOT of bandwidth.

    You probably won't make too much money off the computer and game usage; make the most money off refreshments, etc. In the hours that gamers are gone (school) perhaps turn it into a Net Cafe. And atmosphere is key. A little on the dark side, toned down colors, flashy lights, etc. And remember, sell Bawls. [thinkgeek.com] This stuff is so full of caffeine I know gamers who live off it, and think nothing of drinking 6-7 of them in one sitting.
  • A pretty good resource for how to and lots of helpful stff available (at a price) from igames.org [igames.org]
  • A ten meter air weapons range, four or five point. Quite fun, though it probably wouldn't attract geeks only. Not necessarily a bad thing for a business.
  • Make sure there is adequate ventilation and a bunch of automatic air fresheners. Seriously. While it might be a broad generalization, anyone who spent time down in the WotC center on the Ave in Seattle will know what I'm talking about.

  • One very important request.... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by HotNeedleOfInquiry ( 598897 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:49PM (#7990175)
    Female Geeks

  • Don't forget the architecture! (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Myself ( 57572 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:54PM (#7990262) Journal
    As much as many geeks like to claim form follows function, a lot of us are closet artists. Sure, that extra fan keeps your machine cooler, but admit it, the window was just for show!

    The first gaming center I ever visited was Dig' Ops [digitalops.com] in Ann Arbor, Michigan. They're located downstairs in one of those little hole-in-the-wall spaces you find in an old city. It was less than brightly lit inside, which seems camp now, but it honestly added to the atmosphere then. You see, the dim lighting made it just a bit hard to discern the strange shapes of the black metal cube that dominated the center of the room.

    The cube had people sitting in it. Four on the bottom, and four mostly on top. The design supported stairs, monitors, keyboards, mouse shelves, and the most interesting seats I've ever experienced. Down the central column were the computers and all the wiring for the audio comm system. The whole thing was made of black iron pipe, and it just exuded an intense feel of industrial tech.

    I've never been much of a gamer, but I'd go there just because it had such an amazingly cool atmosphere. I ended up playing more than my share of Action Quake because of it. The midnight-to-whenever time block, which had to be specially reserved, was my usual excuse to indulge in way too much caffeine.

    At some point, D. Ops decided to dismantle the cube and replace it with much more mundane seating arrangements based on aluminum channel frames. The games were still fun but I couldn't find an excuse just to show up and play. I haven't been back in a year or two so I don't know what they've been up to lately.

    Lately, I've been visiting LanLords [lanlords.biz] in Howell, Michigan. They've also got an odd sort of interior design, with the seating "cubicles" made of ribbed steel sheet material. The machines are well equipped, and Sennheiser headsets make for an immensely comfortable gaming experience. I'm mostly there for the people rather than the games, though. The geek running the show picks the muzak, which is quiet enough that it's not distracting once you have the headphones on, but it keeps things interesting if you're just hanging out.

    Digital Ops started out with an isolated network, but they added an internet connection before too long. Lanlords has had a fast pipe from day one, but some games still run locally to keep the pings absurdly low. Once in a while, the two centers will hold us-vs-them games across the internet, and the sense of local comradery is intense. If you're in the area, I highly encourage you to stop in.

    Both places do a number of things right: Keep a fridge well stocked with various caffeinated and unleaded beverages. Let newcomers wander around for a while and watch before trying to turn them into customers. Wait for a break in the action before trying to organize a collective pizza order. Strictly enforce the no nose-picking rule.

    The biggest factor that will keep people coming back to your center is the hardest one to control: If the "regular" gang is friendly, or if it's hostile to newbies, how do you encourage or change that behavior?

    Good luck!

  • A Place That Worked (Score:3, Informative)

    by MS_leases_my_soul ( 562160 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @03:56PM (#7990286)
    We had one place near us that was run by some college students. They rented a two-story auto center that had empty for about two years. The owner was willing to get anybody in there at that point.

    They put folding tables in rows in what was the showroom area. Half of these tables were filled with gaming PCs. The other half of the tables had networking run to them and were left empty for BYOC gaming.

    They turned the counter into a snack/coffee bar and sold geeks drinks like Jolt Cola. They put a couple racks in to sell gamer crack, oops, I mean Magic cards, and gaming books (D&D, Vampire, etc.). They also put more folding tables downstairs in the autobays and put used partitions up between the bays.

    They charged three different hourly rates:
    1) you could rent a place for your PC at one of the open tables.
    2) You could rent one of their PCs.
    3) You could rent one of the gaming rooms downstairs for role-playing or collectible card games. You got a discount if you paid a month at a time.

    They also had monthly membership where you got unlimited play on one of their PCs for one monthly price.

    They did very well for a year and the owner seriously jacked up the rent. About six months later, they graduated and closed shop.

    I can't remember their pricing for the gaming (I went for RPG downstairs, not computer gaming), but I seem to remember $6 an hour? The gaming tables downstairs were $15-25 for a four hour block depending on the size of the area. The $25 area was usually used by the Warhammer guys.

    Hope that gives you some ideas.
    • That's a great idea, it's an easy crossover from computers to RPG/mini/CCGs and product sales are a great secondary revenue source that doesn't require a ton of investment, in addition to table rental.

  • LanPlace (Score:3, Interesting)

    by spir0 ( 319821 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @04:00PM (#7990346) Homepage Journal
    Here in Wellington, New Zealand, we have a place called LanPlace. You can hang out for free because you only pay when you use a network port. There are gaming servers there, and there is hardware available to hire, but pretty much eeryone brings their own rig. Of course, there are limited numbers of monitors for hire and the 19's are always gone within a few hours of an announcement of an event.

    There are also 2 projectors which can either have PCs connected to them for movies or one on one comps, or for the inhouse PS2's.

    People do hang out there occassionally who aren't playing, but there's no lounging space set aside.

    Cameras are operated in all corners of the room for security and the images are available on the website so people who aren't there can see what's going on.

    I won't give the URL in case it gets slashdotted. But if you're in wellington, you already know about it.

  • Games for all types (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Dracolytch ( 714699 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @04:03PM (#7990382) Homepage
    You'll want to make sure that you can find a way to keep lots of people interested, not just the FPS/RTS crowd.

    Social games such as Dance Dance Revolution are good to increase clients of both genders, and across many ages. This also works well with some kind of snack bar since it will work up a good appitite.

    You will never be a replacement for people who do their own home gaming. Be free with advice and information regading system upgrades and maintenance.

    ~D

  • culture, atmosphere (Score:2, Insightful)

    by UrgleHoth ( 50415 )
    You can tailor your place to attract a certain group, but that does not guarantee that you will get that clientele, since gaming has become so popular (10 years ago, if you said gaming in a public forum, people would have thought you were talking about gambling, now people ask which kind). For example, you are targetting true geeks, but instead, get blockhead gamer/jocks and dopeheads. So you have a less friendly, less geek-chic place. You still may make money, but the place does not have the dynamics you w

  • Here are a few.. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by JavaLord ( 680960 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @04:14PM (#7990579) Journal
    Having worked at a few arcades, and played in quite a few tournaments, I would recommend the following....

    tournament stuff

    1. Run tournaments bi-weekly, either charge a fee to join, or charge per hour. Use this money to hand out prize money every week. It doesn't have to be a lot, $50-$100 will do. Break up the prize between 1st, 2nd and 3rd place. Keep detail stats of all the tournaments, overall leaders per game, and overall leaders in all games. Break the year up into seasons, and offer a prize for points leader per season. Put all the results on your website, including pictures.

    2. Have a "wow" factor thing in the place, a big screen TV hooked up to a computer will do it. Make it a prize to be able to use it, or rotate people getting to use it during tournaments that way everyone else can watch them. Arcade tournaments used to do this with big-screen arcade machines, they would put the higher seeded players on the big screen machines so everyone could see them.

    3. Hire security when you know the place will be crowded. I'm serious, even if it's only 1 guy (an off duty cop will run you about $100 a night). You may think geeks are cool people and all, but I've seen fights break out a tournaments, players intimidated, etc. I recall a recent slashdot article about someone pulling a gun at a counter strike tournament. No one wants to go to a place like that.

    4. If you are playing FPS games, See if you can arrange matches between a team made up of the best players from your place with another cyber cafe

    5. Setting up consoles and such would be nice, but I'm not sure what fees are involved. You will need a licence in most states if you want to put in arcade games. Personally, as an old Mortal Kombat/Street Fighter player, a place where I could go play Fighting games and FPS games would rock. It might not be practical though.

    6. Never let a player leave feeling ripped off by a tournament for any reason, they wont come back.

    atmosphere

    1. Keep the bathrooms, and the place in general clean. Someone else mentioned this, but it is very important.

    2. Music is good, as long as it doesn't interfere with the games. Techno type music goes well with games but anything will do.

    3. Have a snack bar with the standard junk food (burgers, cheesesteaks, pizza, etc) try to stock some exotic stuff too, (deep fried oreos, strange sodas, etc)

    4. Cool lighting effects (dim, blacklight, etc) can be fun.

    5. A lounge where people can just hang out, maybe with a small bookshelf and some board games (chess, checkers, etc).

    6. Strange Animals can be cool also, one place I went to used to keep pirahana's in a pool up front. I have no idea why, but it was fun to throw popcorn to/at them.
    • I'd say throw some Bawls in too...

      I'd think the big screen would be best used ONLY for spectators, obviously following either the action, or the highest scoring player.
  • don't think of it as a 'gaming center' think of it more as a racquetball-club type space.

    have a coffee shop/snack bar in addition to vending machines (fountain drinks are cheaper for everyone)

    have lots of 'chill' space that isn't necessarily in front of a screen. your most lucrative market will be people who are looking for somewhere to go spontaneously to find fun - not just dedicated gamers who want to walk in, plug in, and play. they might come to read a book, or study.

    and don't lock down your layout
  • I pay a monthly membership to my gym and get to work out as much as I want (which, as it turns out, isn't that much).

    Give me a LAN center like that. My local one is $3/hr, which I guess is okay pricing for entertainment (say vs going to a movie or going bowling), but not if you do it ALL THE TIME like a lot of gamers do
  • As people are saying above, the concession stand's where you're going to make your money. If you want people to hang out, and you want to turn a profit, you have to sqeeze money out of the customers. Look at it this way. To survive, you need to make an average of X dollars per hour. Say you have N customers. That means you need to get an average of X/N dollars an hour. Most places do this by charging at actual fee per hour. You want to do it largely through other means. This will mainly consist of selling e

  • Play... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by nekoes ( 613370 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @04:48PM (#7991050) Journal
    There's a local arcade around here, that does most of the things right...

    I suppose, first of all, it provides a very comfortable atmosphere. Couches, lounge chairs, and carpeting are pretty much necessary. Also, it is very well lit.

    I don't quite understand what the hell people are thinking when they say, "Give it atmosphere, make it a little on the dark side." Or whatever. That's crap. It's horrible when you're trying to play a PC game for the first time and you can't see shit because the place has "atmosphere." You want to be able to see if people are jacking your stuff and whatever else is going on in the place anyway.

    The kind of atmosphere that a hang out really needs is one of like a room at home. Living room, your room, whatever. Give it lots of comfortable sofas and lounge chairs, ones that can be moved around at will. Keep the lights ON and up high so that you can see everything in the place. The music should stay down low enough so that you can hear other people, and what is going on in game.

    Games that would be necessary... I'd say... go with DDR first of all. Give DDR an area and a couches for sweaty people to hang out on after doing all that work on the machine, or for people who just like to watch the asians go crazy on it. It's a fun social game, so give it what it needs.

    As for the PC side, I suppose there's really no wrong way to set it up, as long as the games are easily accessible, and it's clear what you can do and what you can't do just by looking at the desktop on screen. Headphones would be good.

    Consoles are also great fun, chain a few xboxes or ps2s together.. a lot of this stuff is probably easy for you to come up with. Pay by the hour, whatever.

  • server VS loose CDs (Score:1, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I'm not 100% sure this is feasable, but i just thought of it when reading a comment about stolen games... rather than giving out CDs and hoping to get them back, i would just keep all the images of the games on the HDDs of the computers (or a server) and use daemon tools or something to allow access. yeah it's a HDD hog, but it would mean less lost/scratches cds. alternately, burn copies to give to customers rather than giving out the originals.
    obviously you need to have the proper licenses to use the games

  • Consider Target Demographics (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 15, 2004 @04:57PM (#7991207)
    There is one such cyber-lounge near where I live. Let's call the place Foo (names changed to protect the guilty). The owners of Foo have bought into the mentality that need to be hip and edgy; the name of the place has an X in it, the monitors, keyboards, mice are all black rather than console-gray, the lightning is dim, there's faux camoflague drapped all over the place and I'm sure you can picture the place now.

    Right now, Foo is in trouble. The only people comfortable hanging out there are teenaged males tired of thrashing in the parking lot. As a result, the place is packed Friday and Saturday nights, and virtually abandoned the rest of the week. This despite Foo being two doors down from a fairly major movie theatre. The straw that's breaking Foo's back is that these mall-rats really don't have a lot of money to spend, so they buy an hour of game time, then sit around and talk and scare off potential customers.

    In contrast, there's another place a few dozen miles away that has taken many of Slashdot's suggestions to heart. Blah (again, names changed), is a fairly large place with cream colored walls, potted plants, windows at the front of the store, a variety of seating arrangements, and the owners have even gone as far as to reward students with good report cards with free time on the computers. Right now, it's maybe 70% occupied every day with a nice mix of kids, adults and seniors, male and female. The only reason Blah isn't doing better is because Blah is tucked away in a strip mall in the midst of surbania.

    I'm sure if you reversed Foo's and Blah's locales, both places would be doing a hell of a lot better than they are now.

  • Make sure to have some tables that have ethernet jacks and nothing more. Many gamers are a lot more comfortable using their home rigs (esp those who specifically design LAN ones) than locked down store-owned ones. Wireless can also come in handy. Keep plenty of network cable (little 6 foot ones) in stock. Get some of those USB network adapters (both wired and wireless) and rent them out for $5 or so for the duration of your stay.

    Some sort of electronic membership card (w/ a mag stripe) could make time allo
  • How many hours a day of computer time do you have to sell to cover your overhead - Space lease, employees, wear and tear on equipment. Now go down to one of those other places and ask them how many hours a day of computer time they're managing to sell. Whoops! Looks like none of them are making any money! You wanna do this as a hobby, fine. But don't expect to make any money (or even break even) while doing it.
  • An area with a couple computers dedicated to internet access would probably be appreciated by most gamers (check their email, etc). Perhaps a couple phones thrown in there as well.

  • Use a membership model. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Josiwe ( 703514 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @05:56PM (#7991910) Homepage
    I'd suggest using a membership model, like a YMCA, for several reasons.

    1) People hate paying money. If you only ask them to do it once a month, they'll be happier.

    2) If people make an investment for one month, they will keep coming back, making friends and getting attached to the place. Suddenly you have a returning customer base.

    3) This gives you membership promotion models, like bring in a friend and get a month free.

    4) You have a much better grasp of your financial status because you can say pretty much what your income is for each month.

    5) You know who's coming in and out of the building - theft becomes harder.

    6) If you want, you can let people charge drinks and snacks against their accounts, bring guests for $5 bucks a visit, and all of this convenience makes your customers happy.

    Remember, most geeks have to have plenty of money to support their geekery, so they'll be happy to pay you reasonable fees for services and convenience. I believe there was another thread recently where someone cast the slashdot community as valuing their time much more than their money - I would posit that this is true of your target audience in general.

    • Hell, that's a great idea just so you can BAN people that need banning. Maybe even use something like a point system, like drivers' licenses. Make it harsher, though.

      I think it's a great idea to just make sure you can KEEP TRACK of who's in the building, who's on what equipment, everything. A couple cameras in there couldn't hurt, either.
    • 16 Xbox hooked up in System Link ( Halo [bungie.net], Rainbow Six 3 [rainbowsix3.com], Ghost Recon [ghostrecon.com] ...)
    • Bawls [bawls.com]
    • PCs (this has already been covered in other posts)
    • Lot's of tables and chairs for board game, collectable card games, role playing games, ... Maybe even for chess, who knows!

    Also consider making your Gaming Center a store for theses geeks. Why not sell video games, collectable card games, figurines, comic books, ... You could even sell and repair PC hardware, since you will probably need a technical person there at all time

  • Get all your permits (Score:1, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Be sure to check well in advance with the city where you build this. The few acts of violence related to these places have caused a lot of cities to adopt regulations that apply to them. You might need additional parking (for example, city planners assume parking spaces turn over every 40 minutes in a retail center, and you want people there for hours, so you might need three times as many spaces available compared to a retail store in that space), additional security requirements, certain electrical and
  • There's nothing worse than sticky keys when you try to play.

    And use an antibacterial cleaner - if you have one geek with the flu, you could lose your whole base crowd for weeks at a time.

    You might invest in a UV antibacterial light to store game controllers. Don't leave them plugged into the games - pass them out when someone wants to play.

    And keep the place CLEAN. It'll smell better, look better, and be more comfortable to come back to.
  • Okay, a lot of the suggestions so far are completely worthless. First and foremost, you'll need to create an environment that people will not be embarassed to admit that they go to or to be seen going to. Like they say, sell the sizzle up front and the steak in the back. Your target audience is people with money, not gamers. Gamers most likely already have their own setup that they have spent hundreds of hours customizing and tweaking to their liking, and the mere thought of using an imaged machine make
    • The age limit solves two problems: it weeds out the people without any money, and it automatically legitimizes the customer. They are no longer embarrassed to be seen there or to recommend the place to a friend. As a side note, it also reduces the amount of vandalism and theft that goes on with a younger crowd.

      Because we all know that a) everyone over 18 has money and b) only people under 18 vandalize things
    • D&B rocks!

      I was at a conference in Chicago in 2002. They rented D&B for the night, set up buffets everywhere, had free drinks and gave everyone a loaded up card.

      Eat, drink and play all night!

  • Have a Ladies' Night, or permanent discounts for women.

    A mixed-gender crowd will be more social, and groups tend to gravitate towards the same hangouts to socialize (the "Third Place" idea). The longer people stay, the more you can charge them for time, and the more food and merch they buy.

    Having women around brings in more guys. Too many women may scare off some of the more, um, reclusive gamers, but that market is so small that depending on them is suicide.

    Having women around brings in more women, e

    • Re:Thoughts (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      I work at a gamecenter that has free play for females all day Sunday, and we never get more than 4 in a time. And another thing to consider, the average age of them is like 16. :(
      Maybe need to make it free for 18+
  • Dance Dance Revolution machines. Great fun, and some actual excerise for geeks. You should keep it in another room though, so it dos'nt annoy non-fans.

  • #1 thing: STAY IN BUSINESS (Score:3, Informative)

    by sbma44 ( 694130 ) on Thursday January 15, 2004 @07:30PM (#7992890)
    That's what I'd value most -- a gaming spot that can actually stay afloat for more than 6 months.

    This means you have to appeal to more people than just the slashdot crowd. Have a bar/lounge area with unobtrusively placed consoles. GET A LIQUOR LICENSE. Sure, keep it accessible to the kiddies as much as possible. But don't be afraid to go 21+ at 10 or 11 on a friday night. I don't think it's likely that you will make your money on the games -- try to cover costs with them, but make your profit on drinks, food and coffee.

    Get a few TVs to show sports on. Run a madden tournament on monday nights during the football season (and other appropriate games during other sports seasons, although the MNF tie-in is probably more likely to be lucrative). Anything to get non- or casual gamers in the door.

    Cause sure, I'd go there. But could I convince my girlfriend and friends to come along? Friends who don't even know what an LPB is? If it's a big room filled with beige boxes playing counterstrike and a Jolt machine in the corner, the answer is going to be no, and you're going to be stuck with a much smaller clientele.

    • league nights. Send flyers to local businesses that have a lot of young, nerdy employees; get them to join teams. Offer a mandatory coed league to get some women in the door (via guys cajoling their gfs into playing), and to open up the window to newbies.

      Go oldschool(ish): there are a lot of people who played goldeneye but have no idea what WASD means. Get them in the door. Then sell them on a Halo tournament. Then provide a free hour one weeknight where people can try games they haven't played befor

  • Seems these places are most busy after work (perhaps all night on weekends), and maybe lunch hour. Since you rent space for 24 hours a day (less if in a mall that closes) can you keep busy?

    I think you can. Put some good printers behind the counter (you need them anyway for your own use, get a nice color one too), and programs like MsWord on the comptuers, let people print on a quality printer. Kinkos and the like make money renting comptuers. (but not a lot)

    Others have suggested that big gaming scre

  • Make sure to get a copy of Steel Battalion [capcom.com] or four, so you can hook 'em up on LAN when Steel Battalion: Line of Contact comes out.
    • Oh, and as far as stomosphere goes:

      Think dorm lounge, IMO. Sofas, comfy chairs, CARPETS, well lit, and plenty of room to just chill out, chat, and/or read. Whatever. You wanna make the place very social, a neat place to meet people. And by that token, don't make it pure geekdom. Make it for everyone.

      I also support a combination of per-day/per-hour/monthly pricing, not just one in particular. Events (bring a friend free, tournies) are a must as well. But, the most important thing is that atmosphere I'm tal

  • Everybody else has covered the other things, but the most important thing is STAFF

    You will need the tech support types. Get computer savvy guys, who are not ubergeeks to walk around and help people. I hat to say this, as I am one, but avoid getting pizza faced nerds to be omnipresent, as a lot of gamers don't want to be associated with nerds, and will help the cred. However, you should have a couple of people who are ubernerds to try and fix something when it goes real bad. The non ubernerds should

  • along with PCs and consols, there should be some classic arcades like your street fighter, galaga, etc... also.. pinball, it kicks ass and is addicting and at least with me, when i find a good one such as star wars, indiana jones or south park, i spend all the money in 1 dollar bills i have. a plus for sure
  • I've noticed a few people mention putting MMORPGs (along with FPSs, RTSs etc) on the computers for people to play.

    I was wondering - due to the sheer size some of these MMORPGs take up on the hard disk, you'd probably have to limit how many MMORPGs you could offer. Would try and only offer the larger MMORPGs such as Everquest, Star Wars Galaxies, Dark Age of Camelot etc? Or would you put on some other MMORPGs for variety - such as Lineage (not big in NA, but big in Asia), Anarchy Online (does well in Europ
  • Being a geek still in High School Ive met Jock/Gamer (AKA ASS HOLE!) crowd, and I hate them. My local LAN party place was full of clients who were jerks, are you looking for the crowd who goes nuts at the mention of Miyamato-Sama or the one who thinks, and this a real experience 'Im too 1337 for Lan partys fool of stinky nerds', while not only showing his ignorance, he does not embrace the full on geekyness of gaming. You attract them by not going all out with the classic gaming (WHICH IS A GREAT IDEA) and
  • I know this may just be filler, but the little game center in town just opened three or four months ago, and it seems pretty good. I haven't gone in, but that is simply because I can't spend $5 an hour playing Battlefield 1942.

    First off, the name of the place is F.R.A.G (obvious reference to LAn parties, but they also turned it into an acronym, but i don't remember what it stands for). They have about 10 PCs in very stylish cases with large monitors. Walking through the place, you can tell they loaded e
  • The ultimate gaming machine: Yoshi's Boxx [techtv.com] - which includes, all in one box:

    # Atari 2600
    # Nintendo Entertainment System (8-bit)
    # Microsoft Xbox
    # Nintendo GameCube
    # Sony PlayStation 2
    # A custom PC
  • Allow people to run custom games. Hold workshops. Have fun.

  • a few ideas (Score:2, Insightful)

    by decepty ( 662114 )

    Heavily caffinated beverages

    Free Wi-Fi network (maybe a discount for those that bring their own boxen?)

    Have the gaming area and a separate lounge-y area (kind of like bowling alleys)

    Keep the Yakuza at bay... Im afraid to go to the gaming centers in my area because they're all asian gang run and folks keep getting shot...

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