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The Courts Government Entertainment Games News

Infinium Labs Countersues HardOCP 199

Posted by CowboyNeal from the making-good-on-threats dept.
loftydog writes "Gamespot is reporting that our favorite console manufacturer has thrown down a gauntlet in Florida. Seems they didn't want to play in Texas with HardOCP. Turns out that SCO doesn't have a corner on the lawyer market after all, and we'll see something from Infinium, even if it is an overpaid suit."
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Infinium Labs Countersues HardOCP More

Infinium Labs Countersues HardOCP

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  • May backfire? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by grub ( 11606 ) <slashdot@grub.net> on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:39AM (#8688716) Homepage Journal

    I'd love to see the judge say "OK, Infinium.. Let's see your console that HardOCP has been blasting." It may be another SCOish "We'd love to but it's our proprietary product!"

    • Re:May backfire? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Amiga Lover ( 708890 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:51AM (#8688752)
      This makes me realise it's a little bit WORSE than SCO.

      At least, at one point in time, SCO had a product.

      Now a vaporware company is suing the people who haven't reviewed their non products.

      (They had to step up from suing their own customers like SCO because, hey, being vaporware they HAVE no customers)

      • Re:May backfire? (Score:3, Funny)

        by Anonymous Coward
        Now a vaporware company is suing the people who haven't reviewed their non products.

        It's a diversion so that people don't find out that they're child molesters.

      • New legislation required (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Baron_Yam ( 643147 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @11:50AM (#8689266)
        It seems to me that companies like SCO and Infinium are abusing the American legal system. They are playing silly buggers with the law in order to extract wealth from the economy without actually providing a service or product of value in return.

        In the not-so-long run, this is damaging to innovation and fair competition which will in turn damage the economy.

        It's probably time for Americans who are aware of the issue to start lobbying for new legislation to target this kind of behaviour - removing the financial rewards and administering punishment to the responsible individuals.

        But hey, that's just me... I'm not even an American.
        • It's probably time for Americans who are aware of the issue to start lobbying for new legislation to target this kind of behaviour

          The country is run by lawyers :(

        • Re:New legislation required (Score:4, Insightful)

          by BobTheLawyer ( 692026 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @03:51PM (#8690645)
          you need one simple change: a rule that the loser of a court case must pay the winner's costs.
          • you need one simple change: a rule that the loser of a court case must pay the winner's costs.

            Of course, then the pendulum has gone too far in the other direction. Let's say I have a beef with some company that I believe manufacture's a faulty product. If the company wishes to nip in the bud a series of class action suits, they may just outspend me. I get stuck with a bill for the millions they spent on defense if I lose... This isn't how the legal system here is supposed to work.

            I agree with you thou
            • Of course, then the pendulum has gone too far in the other direction. Let's say I have a beef with some company that I believe manufacture's a faulty product. If the company wishes to nip in the bud a series of class action suits, they may just outspend me. I get stuck with a bill for the millions they spent on defense if I lose... This isn't how the legal system here is supposed to work.

              Then make the rule "loser pays to the winner either the winner's court costs or the amount that they'd spent on their o
        • They are playing silly buggers with the law in order to extract wealth from the economy without actually providing a service or product of value in return.

          On behalf of the 99.9% under the boot, I welcome you to America.

        • The problem is, America's IP laws are (were?) one of the keys to our industrial dominance. They provided the guarantee to entrepeneurs that if they came up with a new product and took the time and effort to develop and market it, then they wouldn't have to share the financial reward with parasites who simply copied their idea. Entrepreneurialism is the key to America's dominance, and patent laws are what ensure that potential reward is worth the initial risk. Other coutries, notably Japan during their we

  • They should update the old saying (Score:5, Funny)

    by ceenvee703 ( 655877 ) * on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:39AM (#8688718)

    "Those who can, do. Those who can't, litigate."

    (in reference to Infinium, not HardOCP, of course...)

  • Infinium Labs Vs. HardOCP - Round 2 (Score:3, Informative)

    by anandpur ( 303114 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:44AM (#8688735)
    Infinium Labs Vs. HardOCP - Round 2 [hardocp.com]

    HardOCP Press Release [hardocp.com]

  • Aw...Florida? (Score:5, Funny)

    by jmccarthy ( 228531 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:45AM (#8688737)
    While insane judicial stuff HAS been known to go down in Florida it just seems less likely the Infinium people will somehow face the death penalty there. *sigh*

  • Read the brief, and damn is Infinium sad. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by mwarps ( 2650 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:47AM (#8688744) Journal
    I just read the motion to dismiss and supporting brief relating to the Texas suit. Infinium is not going to have much of a fun time in this suit. Their counsel are incompetent. I've yet to read anything prepared by [H]'s lawyers, but it's got to be better than the inane dribble that Infinium has sent to the Tx District Court. Misspellings, wrong words, never mind the fact that they're plainly disrespectful in some places, and oh, flat out wrong in some, too.

    Motion to dismiss:
    here [videogamestumpers.com]
    • here's hoping they get this [nationalreview.com] judge.
      and remember, you could put an eye out!

  • Hhmmm (Score:5, Funny)

    by Talence ( 4962 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:48AM (#8688746) Homepage
    Judge: "ok, show your console"

    Infinium: "we can't do that as it would expose our business secrets"

    Judge: "so you have no console?"

    Infinium: "that IS the secret"
    • Which has what bearing on a libel case, exactly?

      • Re:Hhmmm (Score:5, Interesting)

        by tomstdenis ( 446163 ) <tomstdenis&gmail,com> on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:06AM (#8688807) Homepage
        Can't be libel if it's true. ;-)

        As I understand it they pointed out who the owner of the console firm was [e.g. his past] which was fairly accurate based on the fact that all the people they contacted didn't want to admit the truth... [e.g. some degree of freedom].

        It's also true that while getting investment for yet another business they have yet to actually produce a unit. [Recall: the dudes previous business ventures were flops too].

        So if anything the original article may have had some inaccuracies but the overall picture is right. e.g. this dude is a V.C. scammer looking for the next big dig.

        Tom

  • . Guess the console is delayed even more now (Score:4, Funny)

    by hc00jw ( 655349 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:49AM (#8688747)

    I was really looking forward to getting my hands on a Phantom game console, but now that Infinium labs are focusing on all this litigation, I guess I am going to have to wait some more!

  • Article Text (Score:3, Informative)

    by Biotech9 ( 704202 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:49AM (#8688748) Homepage
    Infinium sues HardOCP

    [UPDATE] Phantom console maker makes good on its threats and initiates legal action in a Florida court.

    Shacknews is reporting that Infinium Labs has finally made good on its threats to hardware site HardOCP and has initiated legal action. According to the report, the makers of the yet-to-be-launched Phantom PC game console filed suit in a Florida court this week over a corporate profile the hardware site ran last fall.

    As of press time, calls to Infinium president Kevin Bachus had not been returned. However, HardOCP owner Kyle Bennett confirmed the company's legal action. "Yes, [but] I have not gotten all of the paper work yet," he told GameSpot. However, what Bennett has seen does not bode well for a short legal battle. "It seems as though Infinium Labs and [CEO] Tim Roberts personally have filed suit against us," he said.

    The legal maneuvering started last month when Infinium sent HardOCP a letter saying they would sue the site for defamation if it did not retract the article, which painted a less-than-flattering portrait of several executives. HardOCP promptly refused, then filed a preemptive suit in a Texas court against Infinium.

    GameSpot will have more information on this breaking story as it becomes available.

  • Funny... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:52AM (#8688761)

    ...none of this would have happened if Infinium Labs had actually shipped a working product on time. Mudslinging or "legal relief" won't make them ship it quicker either. As far as I can tell, HardOCP has been more than reasonable with its assertions... more sites should have the guts to expose the true colors of the companies they cover.

    However exciting the infinium technology allegedly is, I temper any enthusiasm for that product with the reality that they're entering a market full of big boys who don't like to share their toys. Whoever gave them venture money to go head-to-head with Sony, MS, and Nintendo should have their head examined.

    Who cares if the product is interoperable, etc. As long as the big guys can sell their consoles below manufacturing cost via lucrative licensing deals, there is NO way that a small startup can compete. IMHO, the right thing to do in this case is Infinium giving what little cash they have left back to the investors and crawling back under the rock they cam from.

    This is going to become all the more ridiculous as the 970-based next gen consoles come out. I just don't see a way to outperform that kind of horsepower...

    • Re:Funny... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by ScrewMaster ( 602015 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @11:00AM (#8689040)
      Depends upon what you're trying to sell. IF that is extremely realistic high end graphics in a sealed-up console that you aren't allowed to mod in any way because of some stupidass DMCA violation, that's one thing. If, on the other hand, you are trying to appeal to the hacker mentality (not the criminal sort, but the kind that likes to take something apart and put it back together in ways the builders never imagined) then Infinium's product is marketable. I would certainly consider buying such a product just for the potential to play and experiment. As someone who did game development back in the mid 80's I would get a real kick out of an "open" console. Unfortunately, I don't see Infinium Labs as being the ones to provide it. There's definitely something wrong with that company. At this point I wouldn't buy from them even if they did have a product (any product) because I don't willingly support lawsuit-happy incompetents.
      • You might be interested in the XGameStation [xgamestation.com]. It's a console that you build (ahem, assemble) yourself based upon an open specification. The design is entirely open, though open as in visible [205.158.110.70] not open as in FSF. Hardware hacking is encouraged. You could probably build one yourself with the parts without calling down the wrath of the developers, though avoiding fumbling about for individual fuse suppliers and making your own breadboard would be worth the 100 or so dollars they will probably charge.

        Good st

  • Stop Pretending You're A Real Company (Score:5, Funny)

    by Fex303 ( 557896 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:53AM (#8688762)
    Obilgitory Penny Arcade [penny-arcade.com] link:

    "I heard Timothy Roberts, CEO of Infinium Labs, can't have an orgasm unless he kills a dog." -Tycho

    Penny Arcade want to be sued too. I guess they'll have to try harder.

    • Re:Stop Pretending You're A Real Company (Score:5, Insightful)

      by SendBot ( 29932 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:45AM (#8688965) Homepage Journal
      Read the news of the day that goes along with the next comic. Tim Roberts posted this on his forum, then retraceted after a PA reader grabbed a screenshot.

      "Actually, that is not what the comic portrayed. It actually meant they were upset that we wouldn't sue them and they ended with outright slander saying that I can only have an orgasm if I kill a dog.... very funny... love it... they want the publicity and traffic driven to there website like is happening to hardocp...

      The Penny Arcade guys were nice enough to call us in the beginning and tell us they didn't mean any harm and would be putting us through the gaming console initiation process that all of the past consoles have gone through with the hard core techies.

      Tim"

      Gabe claims they've never spoken with him.

      See for yourself [penny-arcade.com]

  • Credit where it's due. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by RandoMBU ( 740204 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @09:57AM (#8688774)
    I have to give credit to HardOCP for not backing down in the face of ridiculous threats. They posted a factual article that painted an unflattering picture, because the fact's ARE unflattering. I know Florida is home to some of the worst judicial decions ever [flcourts.org] but here's hoping they get this one right.

  • Interesting Site (Score:5, Interesting)

    by The-Dalai-LLama ( 755919 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:04AM (#8688796) Homepage Journal

    Their website is gorgeous. Takes forever to load, but the eye-candy is sweet.

    I'm not a cool-guy web designer, but they list a "Pentium III" as a site requirement. I can't recall seeing another site that listed a processing requirement. Is that legit?

    Also interesting to note that, according to the Phantom.net [phantom.net] branch of their site,

    "On
    March 31st, 2004 you will be able to build your high-octane Phantom Game System and for a limited time only purchase lifetime subscriptions." [emphasis added by me]

    The Dalai Llama
    constantly amazed at just how far people will go to get press...wait a minute, nobody visits my site, either. If you're reading this sig, expect to be contacted by my legal team.

  • $42 (Score:5, Informative)

    by Konster ( 252488 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:08AM (#8688815)
    They have $42 IN CASH!!

    They have spent more money on legal fees than they've spent on development of the console.

    See it all right here:
    http://biz.yahoo.com/e/040322/iflb.ob8-k.ht ml

    • Re:$42 (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:16AM (#8688845)

      Litigation expense 320,000
      Development costs 259,407

      I guess this pretty much says it all?

      • Comment removed (Score:4, Funny)

        by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:38AM (#8688918)
        Comment removed based on user account deletion
      • Advertising 45,691
        Marketing 65,789
        Travel and entertainment 106,523
        Website development 41,558
        Internet costs 26,518
        Printing and reproduction 12,655

        By my accounting principles, that should all be under "marketing," and that puts marketing at

        299031, or just about equal to development costs.

        And I know that running a business isn't free, but how can a company of about 4 people rack up thirty-one thousand dollars in telephone fees in the span of a year? This company is notorious for not returning phone calls.
    • They have $42 IN CASH!!

      Wow, someone must have actually bought a couple of things at their cafepress store.

  • Proof IL had property in TX (Score:5, Informative)

    by IgD ( 232964 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:09AM (#8688816)
    In response to the HardOCP lawsuit (http://www.videogamestumpers.com/images/Infinium% 20Motion.pdf), IL claimed that they didn't have a corporate presence.

    Check out the leases section of their 8K filing however:
    http://biz.yahoo.com/e/040322/iflb.ob8-k .html

    "Infinium leases office space in Sarasota, Florida and Richardson, TEXAS under operating leases that expire in 2009 and 2007, respectively. Minimum future rental payments under these leases are as follows"

  • Someone please explain this to me (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 27, 2004 @10:42AM (#8688952)
    I caught on that the Phantom was a hoax and Infinium a scam the first time I came across information about them last year.

    Why/how has it continued so long when it's obvious to even a dullard like me?

    I really don't understand. It's SO OBVIOUS.

    Classify this with SCO and Scientology in the "wtf!$?!$? It's SO OBVIOUS" category.

  • HARDOCP DIDNT SUE INFINIUM LABS (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday March 27, 2004 @11:09AM (#8689091)
    Once again, the slashdot editors skew the debate by misstating the situation.

    This isn't a "countersuit" because HardOCP DIDNT SUE infinium labs. They requested a declaratory judgement as a way of getting a judge to declare legal threats on infinium's part impotent.

    It happens in a courtroom but it isn't "suing".

  • Press quotes on thier website- soon (Score:5, Funny)

    by Jonas the Bold ( 701271 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @11:13AM (#8689101)
    I bet this appears on thier website soon:

    "our favorite console manufacturer" - Slashdot

    Just wait. You'll see.
  • If they ever do decide to release the Phantom (not likely), all this negative press is likely to harm sales similar to what happened with the N-Gage.
    • Release it? Have you not be paying attention? There is NO business, NO development, NO engineering and certainly, NO manufacturing. It's a scam that makes a few people rich and the expense of some other people that are richer.... ahh the american way... You act like they have a warehouse full of consoles rearing to go once the lawsuit pans out... The real story is they never got INTO the design phase... that would... of course cut back on the size house the CEO could buy.

    • Re:Remeber what the press did to the N-Gage? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by cgenman ( 325138 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @04:14PM (#8690827) Homepage
      Right. And remember Nokia's response? They sold what they had, and got right to work on building a superior version that addressed the issues that everyone was complaining about.

      Now I gave Nokia a lot of flak for their horrific original design, but to take such overwhelming criticism and respond by addressing everyone's complaints is admirable bordering upon heroic. And they'll get a superior product out of the other side to boot, which still will integrate well into their other product lines.

      Indrema, on the other hand, has responded to criticisms by suing everybody in sight. This is not the way to get customers, this is the way to shut up people who are blowing your cover. Nokia handled the (well deserved) response to the N-Gage elegantly and should be given a second chance in the market. Indrema has taken their (well deserved) criticisms terribly, and on the slight possibility that they aren't a scam their failure in the market should evoke no sympathy.

  • I've seen press releases that he is on the Infinium Labs advisory board [gamersmark.com]. I've looked on his website [xenatera.com] and searched google, etc, but I can't find any information about what if anything he may have done there.

    Does anyone know what the advisory board did, or knew about? Is that where some of the $350,000 in "advisory fees" went? That's about $50,000 each. I wonder what all that advising bought them.

    • Re:What about XBOX Hacker Andrew "Bunnie" Huang? (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Does anyone know what the advisory board did

      Let's see, their Advisory Board consists of:

      4 CEOs
      1 Attorney
      1 Marketing Specialist
      1 Bunny Huang, "Reverse Console Engineer"

      Obviously, they're designing the hardware. It's the only theory that explains their progress...
  • There's nothing like bad publicity to get a vaporware product off the ground!

  • More links (Score:5, Informative)

    by Torgo's Pizza ( 547926 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @12:08PM (#8689361) Homepage Journal
    I'm currently hosting the docket documents as they come in. I've seen several other people point to them so here's a quick update. (Shacknews must have gotten their info from my posts at Hardforum which where in turn picked up by Gamespot.) This is information that Gamespot hasn't been reported yet or Shacknews.

    A latest check of the docket shows that the Infinium Labs lawyers forgot to file a Certificate of Interested Persons with the court. It's just a list of people who a financial stake in the outcome of the case. When it is filed on Infinium's part, it could provide a look at the backers of Infinium and who else is financially involved with the company.

    In other news, the court ordered a mediation meeting as part of the process to get the two sides to settle. This has to happen by April 23rd. It's intended to be a face-to-face meeting with all parties, but I expect Infinium to go pro se and do a telephone conference. If a settlement can't be reached, then both sides will file a report to the court explaining why.

    Until the Certificate of Interested Persons is filed, the case won't progress much until the middle of next month. I've got the docs, but haven't uploaded them my site yet being as they are from the court and none of the parties. If there's a lot of interest, I'll post 'em.

    Infinium Labs has retained the following legal council in Texas. This is public information from the court docket.

    Baxter W Banowsky
    Banowsky Betz & Levine
    790 Coit Central Tower
    12001 N Central Expwy
    Dallas, TX 75243
    214/871-1300
    Fax : 214/871-0038 FAX
    Email: bwb@bblpc.com

    The latest info on the case can always be found at whereisphantom.com [whereisphantom.com] and the Hardforum [hardforum.com].

    Links to the essential court docket documents:

    KB Networks Civil Cover Sheet.pdf [videogamestumpers.com]
    Infinium Summons [videogamestumpers.com]
    Infinium Motion to Dismiss [videogamestumpers.com]

    • Re:More links (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Anthony Boyd ( 242971 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @03:39PM (#8690567) Homepage
      Infinium Labs has retained the following legal council in Texas. This is public information from the court docket.

      My advice: don't write to them. Don't tell them they suck. Looking at their documents so far, they don't really care about the case and are doing it half-assed. Don't stir them up, don't make them think there will be media attention, don't do anything. Let the Infinium lawyers continue to behave as if this doesn't matter. They are their own worst enemy, and will lose if we let them.

  • An online gaming/hardware 'zine vs a company that doesn't have any products.

    I do appreciate that there are issues regarding journalism which must be defended, and it's great that HardOCP is standing up for its rights. But this isn't exactly the Pentagon Papers or 9/11 at stake here. When all is said and done, the only people to have gained anything will be the lawyers.

    • Re:Amazingly little at stake (Score:4, Insightful)

      by The-Dalai-LLama ( 755919 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @12:58PM (#8689682) Homepage Journal

      I don't want to get hysterical and overdramatic, but I think this is an issue of freedom of speech.

      The greatest thing about the internet is its ability to put real power in the hands of the average citizen. Look at the Russian motorcycle chick's Chernobyl photos [slashdot.org] to see an example of just how much potential there is for the average person.

      I don't know, but I imagine that Hard OCP has its roots with some average guys who thought it would be cool to put out a gaming review and news site. Simple, not much at stake, no big deal.

      Except that these guys and their little gaming site brought forth some information that exposed a company that could have been (may still be?) on the way to screwing over average guys like me.

      A fairly small site (I'm sure they're big in gaming circles, but they're not CNN or even Hard Copy) harnessed the power of the internet to do this, and it's power that we all have access to. What's at stake here (and I know that this particular lawsuit seems ridiculous) is a precedent that could potentially scare off the average person from attempting to use the power that is at our fingertips.

      I can't afford a lawyer to defend against this kind of stuff. The threat of legal action would probably be enough to deter me: I can't afford to risk my home or my car over a BS lawsuit that I wouldn't have the money to even try to mount a defense against.

      The Dalai Llama
      stepping down from his favorite soapbox...

      • The beautiful thing is that even if they managed to get HardOCP shuttered, and financially ruin the site's operators, they'll have gotten so much attention for suing that average folks will reason that "where there's smoke, there's fire," and Infinium is even more screwed. The fastest way to get an idea to spread like wildfire on the Internet is to try to suppress it. The courts are particularly effective in this regard. Witness the MPAA's battle to suppress DeCSS and Diebold's attempts to keep evidence of

        • Re:Amazingly little at stake (Score:2, Insightful)

          by Anonymous Coward
          Heh, right. 'cause the MPAA is almost out of business, and Diebold isn't still selling voting machines? /. is not a barometer of the public interest.
          • Diebold in particlar has had its credibility and business harmed badly. Granted, the MPAA is still doing just fine, but Valenti is being forced out because his radicalism has turned enough public opinion against the MPAA that they had to launch a counter-PR offensive.
    • If there was really nothing at stake, HardOCP would have taken down the article long ago.

    • Surprisingly good for HardOCP (Score:4, Insightful)

      by cgenman ( 325138 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @04:25PM (#8690897) Homepage
      Hard OCP actually comes out on top of all of this, in my accounting. They get A: Slashdot traffic several times, B: Penny Arcade traffic several times, and perhaps most importantly C: an iron clad precedent if anybody else tries to muscle them into submission. HardOCP is going to come out of this as a force to be respected.

      And for this, they have to hire an intelligent intelligible attorney who can argue that water is wet.

  • The link to Gamespot in the article goes to gamepot, which is some sort of an ad site. Can someone fix the link?

  • Infinium Labs wasn't at GDC (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Animats ( 122034 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @01:02PM (#8689713) Homepage
    The Infinium Labs website, under "Special Events", says they were going to be at the Game Developers' Conference this week. I didn't see an Infinium booth there, and they're not on the exhibitor list [gdconf.com] or the booth map.
  • On infinium labs' website, they said they would be at the game developer conference Click here, then click on special events [infiniumlabs.com].. There was no sign of them anywhere... They didn't even give a keynote.. *shrug* Take this bit-of-info as you will.. =)

  • Boy, the material just writes itself (Score:4, Interesting)

    by superultra ( 670002 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @01:56PM (#8690034) Homepage
    Stuff like this is why gamers need a Daily Show, but for games. Or like Old Man Murray, but updated.
  • From the Cambridge English Dictionary: phantom [Show phonetics] adjective [before noun] describes something that you imagine exists or that appears to exist, although in fact it does not: Although she had to have her leg amputated, she still feels as though she's got a phantom limb. They discovered it was a phantom organization set up for the processing of drug profits. UK Although she grew bigger and felt ill, she later discovered it was a phantom (US false) pregnancy. I think this aptly describes the

  • Looking for an alternative console (Score:3, Interesting)

    by cgenman ( 325138 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @04:41PM (#8691008) Homepage
    ...that isn't run by a bunch of jacka$$#$? Try the X Game Station [xgamestation.com]. It's sufficiently obscure that it makes people think you're elite, and it's sufficiently vaporware that it will be a while before that's proven wrong.

    JK. Actually, the developers post on their forums all of the time, and seem like normal nice guys not prone to knee-jerk reactions and faked photographs. It's also not really vaporware, as they have released an SDK and other things... it's just a bit late. (Money... Burning... Hole...) It's also a little underpowered as far as primary gaming machines go, but that's not what you buy an alternative console for anyway.

    There are good alternative console developers out there. Even if the Phantom people are evil and the DIScovER people are ruthless jerks, some people are doing good things in the world of consoles.

  • Infinium not at Game Developer's Conference (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I got back from the Game Developer's Conference (GDC) last night, this is where us game makers go to learn the latest programming tricks & hardware. This is also where hardware makers go to gather support for their new products. Sony was there recruiting developers for PSP & PS3 as was Microsoft for Xbox 2, video card & peripheral makers show up to try to get people to support their titles, even Nintendo (who tends to snub the developer community) has a small booth. Yet one hardware company ge

  • Slightly offtopic... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Thedalek ( 473015 ) on Saturday March 27, 2004 @08:21PM (#8692331)
    We've heard an awful lot about the HardOCP/Phantom litigation, but there seems to be another story lurking. I direct your attention to the following section of Infinium Labs' now overly-linked-to 8-K financial form [yahoo.com]:

    NOTE D - CONVERTIBLE PROMISSORY NOTE

    At October 31, 2003, Infinium was involved in a legal dispute with a competitor. In January 2004 the Company, in conjunction with the settlement of litigation, issued a convertible promissory note in the amount of $100,000. The promissory note is non-interest bearing and must be paid or converted into common shares if Infinium has an anticipated merger with a corporation that has common stock trading on the over-the-counter or similar exchange within 241 days from the date of the note, or the liquidated damages total $150,000.

    Now this makes less sense to me than most lawyerspeak. Could someone walk me through it?

    The other interesting thing is that Infinium names at least one developer: Riverdeep [riverdeep.net], owner of Broderbund (that's how it's spelled on the site, folks. I know there's supposed to be an "o" in there, but they've changed).

    It would be interesting to see if Riverdeep actually acknowledges such an agreement...
    • It's in finance-ese. I'll do as best as I can. A bit of background: Infinium is a very thinly traded company on the over-the-counter market. As of early January, shares were worth around $1/share. Currently they are worth about $5/share. They raised $15MM in late Jan, by selling 2,000,000 shares at $7.50/share.

      As of January 2004, Infinium needed to come up with some cash, probably to pay their legal bills.

      They found someone to borrow money from, and issued a promissory ("I promise to give you money"

      • Re:Slightly offtopic... (Score:3, Insightful)

        by scm ( 21828 )
        "I just want to know, after all this ranting, is where IS that $100M? If the company is WORTH that, don't they have to have assets that you can sell at $100M?"

        No, and that's the magic of the stock market.

        Basically, company stock value is a combonation of assets and perceived future earning power. Investors are betting on the hope that the company will be sucessful enough to make their investment return a good profit (raise the stock value).

        Many overly ambitious bets on future value is exactly what caused

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