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XBox (Games) Entertainment Games

Microsoft Cancels 2004 Xbox Sports Lineup 73

Posted by simoniker from the take-a-mulligan dept.
madopal writes "Well, it's no secret that Microsoft has been slashing internal development (Mythica, anyone?). Now, they've announced that they're cancelling their entire 2004 line-up of XSN Sports games for Xbox. Wow, with Ed Fries gone, it sure is a different place over there." The article quotes Kevin Browne of Microsoft as saying: "We need to be making great games, and the marketplace told us that we're just not at that level."
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Microsoft Cancels 2004 Xbox Sports Lineup More

Microsoft Cancels 2004 Xbox Sports Lineup

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  • Circle the wagons! (Score:5, Funny)

    by oDDmON oUT ( 231200 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @07:08AM (#8712619)
    Let's get back to our core business, making great operating systems!
  • "We need to be making great games, and the marketplace told us that we're just not at that level."

    when have you guys made anything great? it's ok take your time to think about it....

    only MS game i ever played was Halo and i didnt even like it. i played it because i bought an xbox and i beat the oddworld game too quick.

    plus do we really need more sports titles anyway? there are like 10 variations of each sport possible, and they all are released every year with the new team info.

    • Re:i like quote (Score:5, Informative)

      by *weasel ( 174362 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:18AM (#8712904)
      Age of Empires
      Asheron's Call
      Flight Simulator
      Halo
      MechAssault
      Crimson Skies
      Project Gotham Racing
      Counter-strike
      Shenmue

      Maybe they're not your cup of tea, but for millions of other gamers, they are great games. That Microsoft published them demonstrates an ability to identify quality games, and bring them to their gamers -- the only attribute worth having in a publisher.

      In my opinion, this move only demonstrates further that Microsoft does 'get' gaming. Their sports games were also-rans, and completely unnecessary given the great lineup of third-party sports titles for their system. Cutting them was a smart move.

      • Re:i like quote (Score:5, Informative)

        by PainKilleR-CE ( 597083 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:29AM (#8712973)
        Shenmue is a Sega title, Counter-Strike is a Valve title. As far as I know, the rest of those are in-house or 2nd party titles, so I have no issues there.

        What most people really seem to be missing here is that Microsoft cut the titles to work on the next year's titles, rather than cutting their sports line completely. They also make it fairly clear in the interview that the most well-received titles (Top Spin and Amped) were never considered yearly titles, and were therefore not part of the cut (though sequels may not have been in the works yet).

        Microsoft has a lot of solid code in their sports titles, especially with the number of code bases they have to derive from in some areas (like baseball titles). All they are doing now is giving their developers more time to make their titles competetive with EA and Sega titles. They seemed to be close their first year out, but their latest run definitely fell flat. This was probably the only way to save these titles, even if it means they won't have a new series on the shelves for a year (and isn't one of the biggest complaints about these types of games the fact that they don't improve much in a year anyway?).

        • Re:i like quote (Score:5, Insightful)

          by *weasel ( 174362 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:51AM (#8713124)
          I was addressing the fairly frequent accusation that Microsoft doesn't know games. If it didn't, it wouldn't have pursued Valve and Sega. Who did the developing doesn't really matter, imo. What matters is that Microsoft was sitting at the top of the decision making process, and thus their ability to identify value was tested.

          As for the yearly updates - Microsoft could easily carve a niche for themselves by simply issuing roster updates and gameplay patches over XBL several times each season, and only selling updated sports games based on actual improvements. EA and madden have been getting fat off essentially selling expansion packs each year, for full price. There is quite a bit of gamer animosity against them for it.

          But my point was simply that: Microsoft can and does identify quality titles and deliver them to their customers. They know good games, and they (demonstratively) have the balls to hold back games that aren't going to be top-of-the-line.
          (E.g. the well-documented delay of Crimson Skies until it was great, the delay of this sports lineup, and one is left to assume: the delay of halo2.)

          • Re:i like quote (Score:3, Interesting)

            by mr.capaneus ( 582891 )
            The quality/crap ratio for the Xbox may be higher than the PS2 but that doesn't mean there aren't plenty of crap titles. Also, aside from Halo and KOTOR there have been no really must-have titles for the Xbox and both of those games have now been released on the PC. MS really needs a few exceptionally strong exclusives (NOT released for the PC) to make owning an Xbox worthwhile.
            • In the game genres that you like, possibly this is true.

              Personally, I am a huge fan of these exclusives:

              Top Spin
              Links 2004 (better than PC version)
              Crimson Skies
              Mechassault

              I've looked into the number of games that I've purchased, vs. the number of games I've returned (crap)

              I've purchased 40 games for my Xbox, and sold back 7.

              That's a pretty good ratio.

              Sold back:

              Pac Man world 2
              Rayman 3
              KOTOR (I know that others don't agree)
              Simpsons Road Rage
              Phantasy Star Online

              And two other crappy games that I can't re
              • What I mean by must-have title is something like GTA3 or Final Fantasy. Whether or not you like those kinds of games, they are very popular and drive people to buy a PS2. Similarly, Metroid Prime and Zelda:WW are two GC games that probably drive people to buy a Gamecube. The Xbox just doesn't really have any of those kinds of titles. Halo was definitely one but it is getting pretty long in the tooth and has been released for the PC anyway. I think KOTOR would have been an excellent game to keep exclusi
                • You named two for PS2, two for GC, and two for Xbox. Your point? The PS2 may have a few others (Gran Turismo for sure) but the GC has even less to offer than the Xbox. And there are a few you left out for the Xbox: Splinter Cell was a time-limited Xbox exclusive and really drove the hardware sales for a while. Right now Ninja Gaiden is a great selling Xbox exclusive and we've (I work at Gamestop) even had people buy the system for that game. Later this year there are several other must-haves for the Xbox

                  • Re:i like quote (Score:2, Informative)

                    by nekura ( 600099 )
                    Dead Or Alive Ultimate (the first online fighter)
                    Capcom vs. SNK 2 EO, anyone? Me thinks you meant to say first online 3D fighter.

                  • Re:i like quote (Score:1, Interesting)

                    by Anonymous Coward

                    I strongly disagree with you, because I understand you to be wrong. Strongly.

                    Exclusive _third-party_ support for the Xbox is weaker than for GameCube: Xbox and PS2 share the same market, and it shows in the release schedules. For every Halo (now available for PC, but let's ignore that), KOTOR (now available for PC, but let's ignore that), Splinter Cell (now available for every system under the sun except for the Vectrex, and let's NOT ignore that), DOA 3, Ninja Gaiden, and Tekki, the GameCube has its Fi

                  • Re:i like quote (Score:3, Insightful)

                    by mr.capaneus ( 582891 )
                    Are you purposely misunderstanding what I am saying? Let's try to put the fanboyism aside for a moment. The two "exclusive" titles that I mentioned for the Xbox are not really exclusives. I play both of them on my PC. That is why I do not own an Xbox right now. I also really like Gran Turismo 3. I bought a PS2 to play it. I do not have the option of playing that game on anything other than a PS2. Also, I'm not talking about the Xbox having many "really great" games. That may or may not be true. My
          • I was addressing the fairly frequent accusation that Microsoft doesn't know games. If it didn't, it wouldn't have pursued Valve and Sega. Who did the developing doesn't really matter, imo. What matters is that Microsoft was sitting at the top of the decision making process, and thus their ability to identify value was tested.

            Except that MS publishes a lot of titles on the XBox, and in the end opening it up to publishing brings in a much higher percentage of bad titles than simply sticking to 1st and 2nd p
        • Microsoft may have bought a number of second parties, but their in-house development is something different (having had a friend who worked there). Can't say any of their in-house stuff has ever really interested me.

  • Read between the lines (Score:4, Insightful)

    by mandalayx ( 674042 ) * on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:01AM (#8712811) Journal
    IGN Sports: Since you don't expect the next series of games to be released until 2005, does that mean that all of the games are now in development for Xbox 2 rather than the Xbox?

    Kevin Browne: We haven't made any announcements about anything but the Xbox, so what we're talking about is this:     ....blah blah

    We know better than to believe most PR. Perhaps much of MS's energy is being redirected towards Xbox 2?

    Besides, as was pointed out earlier, Xbox sales are being driven by sports games, but largely not the ones made by MS: think EA, Sega, etc. Considering that Xbox hardware sales are not exactly a cash cow [slashdot.org], Xbox 2 seems to be of superb strategical importance for market domination, especially compared to the idea of doing Xbox 1 sports games.

  • April Fools, anyone? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by cableshaft ( 708700 ) <cableshaft AT yahoo DOT com> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:12AM (#8712851) Homepage
    Hmmm... XBox sports games sold pretty decent. Not great, but better than many of their other first party titles (better than Grabbed by the Ghoulies, certainly!). The only legitimate reason I could see for them doing this is if they came to an agreement with EA to add Live support to their next season of sports titles. OR, this could be an April Fools joke, two days early...has anyone else reported this as well? Without just stealing the story from IGN, that is?
    • The article is about MS sports games, not all sports games. MS sports games have never sold as well as EA, etc., so basically they're leaving sports to the sports games makers, and focussing their in-house effort on other types of games.

  • Start a petition! (Score:3, Funny)

    by eMilkshake ( 131623 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:30AM (#8712982) Homepage
    Let's start a petition for Microsoft to release the source code to these games now that they've abandoned them!
    • (probably a joke but)
      They didn't abandon them. They stated that they have yet to discuss an end-of-life for the current titles, and that the yearly titles will resume in 2005. In other words, they're taking a year to focus on improving the technical and gameplay aspects of these titles rather than releasing another rehash with updated rosters that won't pan out with the critics when up against Sega and EA.
  • What with this a nd the recent price drop, it's clear the Xbox as a platform is reaching the end of its life. M$ seems poised to release the Xbox 2 any day now. Or week, or month, or year. Whatever.
    • By that logic Nintendo will announce their next-gen system (other than the DS) because of the Gamecube's rockbottom cost and lack of first-party licenses to fall back on.

      Also the PS2 should be able to run for another 4 years because it can maintain a price of $179, its getting ANOTHER Final Fantasy game, and EA continues to release sports games annually.

  • So one less line of sports titles, eh? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Dragoon412 ( 648209 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:40AM (#8713059)
    Take a look at the market for football titles. It's absolutely flooded with drek. NFL Blitz, NFL Gameday, NFL Fever, NFL 2k4, and the only two good games: ESPN NFL Football and the Madden series. But even Madden seems to be heading away from being a football game and more towards a coaching or ownership sim.

    It's sad that Microsoft's cutting out the XSN games because they had a great idea combining sports titles with Xbox Live (which would seem to indicate many more possibilities than simply playing online), and the console could always use some strong sports titles on Xbox Live, but as sports games go, the XSN titles just weren't good enough to compete with other companies' offerings, online or not.

    Still I've gotta admit, I always got excited at the notion of what would be possible with Xbox Live sports games. Custom leagues, custom teams, drafts within the leagues... it could really break some new ground for the incredibly tired sports genre. Seems that won't be happeneing any time soon.
    • NFL 2K4 and ESPN NFL Football are the same game. Sega changed the 2K series starting last year to incorporate the license for ESPN more. Too bad ESPN tv doesn't promote the games better than they do the Madden series.
    • It's sad that Microsoft's cutting out the XSN games because they had a great idea combining sports titles with Xbox Live

      I think we're wandering back and forth across the line of XSN/Xbox Live, and I want to straighten this out:

      The thing they're cutting out isn't Xbox Live, but XSN. I can (and, when I want to be embarassed, do) play ESPN NFL on Xbox Live - I just can't set up a tournament or track stats like I might with NFL Fever (XSN).

      IMNSHO, XSN wasn't that robust to compel me to even TRY NFL Fever w
      • The thing they're cutting out isn't Xbox Live, but XSN. I can (and, when I want to be embarassed, do) play ESPN NFL on Xbox Live - I just can't set up a tournament or track stats like I might with NFL Fever (XSN).

        They're not cutting out XSN, they're just cutting out the games that they were going to release for it this year. They even stated in the article not only that they haven't planned to drop XSN support from current games, but that it's completely possible for others (Sega, EA, etc) to make use of
      • I agree with this comment- because I too suck at most games I play on-line.

        The only exception that I have found is Links 2004. Only because you don't play head-to-head with anyone. The simple fact that the other guy is better, does not make you any worse.

        In basketball for instance, if my opponent is good, he can completely shut me down. In golf though, if my opponent is good, he beats me by 10 strokes. I still get to play my game, but I just get beat worse.

        That is where XSN is great though. You can
        • That is where XSN is great though. You can enter tournaments that have 64 people. I will probably never be #1, or even #10. But I'm usually somewhere in the middle. That's a good feeling for us crappy older gamers.

          But not so great for whoever comes in as #64.

          But I understand what you're saying, and agree. I also suck at online games (well, at games in general), and prefer games where I can play and play poorly than games where being bad means I can't play. It's even worse when I'm merrily playing a s
    • I really have to think there's more behind the scenes than this announcement by Microsoft.

      I mean, they pushed into a market that would otherwise have been their own slaughter: EA and Sega have been doing sports titles (especially football) since the Joe Montana Sportstalk Football and Bird vs. Jordan Basketball days. They knew what they were up against. And even though the XSN line is only about 70% the quality of this year's EA/Sega lineups, they had innovation that gave them a chance: XSN network.

      Give
      • I'll let the article speak for itself, from page 2:

        IGN Sports: Last year, the ESPN games weren't allowed to have Xbox leagues because of XSN. Now that the Microsoft lineup is not coming out, will the ESPN games be allowed to have leagues this year?

        Kevin Browne: This past year, it wasn't a matter of them not being allowed, it was more that the technology came in at a latter date than what they felt comfortable reacting to. The ability exists for them to have the same sort of league functionality that exi
        • I call shenanigans on that interview answer! If Microsoft was intently honest in allowing their league "api" to be accessible to all, they would have sent out the basic public access hooks to the developers so they could have implemented it in their titles.

          He implies (no, states outright) that Sega didn't put the league ability in because they didn't feel they had enough time to react to the api. Hrm, maybe my memory is toast, but if I recall correctly, NFL Fever 2004 was released on August 26, 2003 (acco
          • He implies (no, states outright) that Sega didn't put the league ability in because they didn't feel they had enough time to react to the api. Hrm, maybe my memory is toast, but if I recall correctly, NFL Fever 2004 was released on August 26, 2003 (according to XBox's retailer website). ESPN NFL Football shipped out to stores on September 3, 2003 (according to Sega's website).

            If XSN was ready to roll for NFL Fever 2004 (it was the launch of XSN), and that game came out a week ahead of ESPN, that whole reas
    • I wonder if maybe Microsoft is cutting their sports line to make room for purchasing Sega.

      Sega does make good sports game and are really the only serious competition to the EA Sports line. If Microsoft bought Sega, MS's current sports line would be unnecessary. Purchasing Sega would also give Microsoft that flagship game character (Sonic) that they have desperately sought.

      Just food for thought.
    • Microsoft is the new Sega, except they have money because they do something other than Video Games. Microsoft is the new system for sports (though ps2 madden players might disagree) just as Sega used to be.

      I think it would be much better if other sports games just got XSN support. You could run a league for each game, so they needn't conflict.

  • Yeah, but really... (Score:4, Informative)

    by josh glaser ( 748297 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @08:44AM (#8713078)
    ...with the exception of Top Spin, they were really not that great anyway, and I doubt we would have seen a Top Spin 2004 anyway. So it's just kinda...meh.
    • Links was also a good game. After playing Links for a while, Tiger Woods (EA) seems like a big piece of crap. I hope they still come out with some more new courses that are downloadable.

  • From Sony to Nintendo, How MS is going to Xbox3.11 (Score:5, Interesting)

    by superultra ( 670002 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @09:22AM (#8713408) Homepage
    I think that this is representative of a couple of things.

    First, it shows how much more like Nintendo Microsoft is moving for game development. Quality over quantity. I think initially, Microsoft was emulating Sony with its mere quantity, as if it were Microsoft's job to fill in the gaps in the lineup. Maybe it's because they finally have the third party support to start focusing on quality first party (and when I say first party I am also referring to second party) titles. For the first year or two after the launch, Microsoft seemed to releasing everything they possibly could. Over the past year they became much more focused, told the in house dev studios to get it done but take their time (Crimson Skies, for example) and canned other titles that weren't up to par.

    Now, it seems they're getting even leaner.

    Which brings me to my second point.

    And this is the one that will draw the atypical slashdot trolls like flies to a honey factory. Say what you will about monopolistic practices or Microsoft always borrowing from other companies. It's true. But one of the things Microsoft excels at is adapting their products until they work. With regards to the Xbox, they've displayed much more willingless to change the xbox based on market movements than Sony, and especially Nintendo. Canning and revamping the sports lineup is just one of these macro-adaptations that will make them that much more formidable in Xbox2. Someone posted that the canning was because of Xbox2. I think that's true, but only indirectly. They're not going to be Azurik 2, Bloodwake 2, and Fusion Frenzy 2 with the Xbox2 just because they can. My guess is that it will 2-5 extremely strong titles.

    I know I'm sounding like a fanboy here, but it might take an Xbox 3.11 to start to dominate the market, but they're moving towards that, and this is demonstrative of that movement.
  • They didn't even bother to release any roster updates, tho they made sure to brag up and down that they could have.

    Good riddance to bad rubbish. Top Spin is the only good game to come out of all of the XSN junk, and even its load times were painfully slow.

    I dig my Xbox, but crap is crap.

  • Good news, everyone. (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:28AM (#8714119)
    There won't be as many shitty sports games flooding the market this year.
  • The Amped snowboarding games are the only snowboarding simulations out there. Though I think that development team has already been terminated, it makes me sad to think I will have to choose between 2 racing games for my off-season snowboard fun. As that isn't much of a choice at all, I guess that's $50 more per year that stays in my pocket. Bummer.

  • Crap^H^H^H^HSports games (Score:3, Funny)

    by IntergalacticWalrus ( 720648 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @01:22PM (#8716567)
    Don't worry folks, there are still enough XBox sports titles to fill up those bins of unsellable used games for the next 300 years.
  • While Microsoft is obvious very cash rich as a company, their games are on tight budgets and they are always trying to cut corners on cost. While throwing money at a game isn't a silver bullet, Microsoft's attitude in the end does hurt the quality of any game they are working on.
  • This is the first step in microsoft realizing that it has no place in the gaming industry...go ahead I know there's people bitching at me right now, but plain and simple...sony is outselling them. Xbox has no hope unless they make it backwards compatible, until they realize this, I will continue to talk about how stupid the development decisions are for Xbox.
  • Alright, I'll admit it and let the masses of /. cut me down ... I am a fan of the XBox. The controllers are a little bulky, but the graphics are great and they have some FUN games. Yesterday I finally picked up a copy of "Ninja Gaiden". I never played Ninja Gaiden for the NES but I remember hearing how cool it was ... for the XBox it is amazing. It's the best game that I've played on the XBox since Halo ... by far. Not only that, and this is where it's relevant to the topic, it has an XBox live feature
  • Gotta' disagree with what some other people are saying regarding a "flood" of sports titles.

    Fact is, there are what seem to be a huge amount of sports titles at first, until you realize how fragemented the games and series' are across systems and platforms.

    It seems to me that Microsoft killing off an entire line of X-box games is a huge blow to a genre that is essentially now left only with the EA Sports line of games across all platforms, with possibly Sega having a small share of that.

    It's sad. The RP
  • EA: Ok we will do Live but you need to back off from Sports title. MS: What? No?? We have NFL Fever out there MS: ok seriously.. can we continue rallisport and Top Spin? EA1 whisper to EA2: MS thinks rallisport is a sports game EA: ok.. release rallisport update now, push TopSpin for xbox2. Get rid of Links though. Tiger is mad about it. MS: Will do. But you will do Live before this Holiday season.. EA: We will!

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