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GameCube (Games)

Nintendo Spokesman Talks Next-Gen and MS 128

Posted by Zonk from the big-three-don't-get-along-very-well dept.
Thanks to GamesIndustry.biz for an article outlining comments made by Nintendo VP of sales and marketing Reggie Fils-Aime. His comments confirm that Nintendo's next console will release around the same time as the PS3, and bashed MS for rushing to the next console generation. "Our focus is this: we will bring Revolution to the marketplace roughly at the same time as the competition," Fils-Aime told US website IGN. "We are driving our timetables based on what we believe Sony will do."
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Nintendo Spokesman Talks Next-Gen and MS More

Nintendo Spokesman Talks Next-Gen and MS

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  • Ouch. (Score:5, Funny)

    by marktaw.com ( 816752 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:21PM (#10496112) Homepage
    Our focus is this: we will bring Revolution to the marketplace roughly at the same time as the competition
    OUCH! Now that is a slap in the face to Microsoft.
    • ...completely failed to win over the 13 to 30 age group.

      Not true. I bought a Gamecube when I was 29. Now I'm 30 so I'm still in this group :-)
      And I'm very happy with my little machine. Sometimes I take it with me when I visit friends to play Soulcalibur 2 or F-Zero.
      Couldn't do that with the much heavier and bigger PS2 or XBox.

      • Re:Ouch. (Score:1, Offtopic)

        by wheany ( 460585 )
        Couldn't do that with the much heavier and bigger PS2 or XBox.

        YOU ARE A PUNY GIRLIE-MAN! I CAN CARRY THE XBOX AND THE PS2 UNDER MY ARMS AND STILL BE ABLE TO LIFT THE GAMCUBE FROM ITS HANDLE. GRRRRR!

  • Hmmm... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ivan256 ( 17499 ) * on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:26PM (#10496165)
    What is Microsoft's motivation here anyway. I mean... Right now all they can really boast about over the PS2 is that they have a years worth of hardware advancement better graphics, and even that isn't helping the bottom line. If they come out way ahead with the next generation machines and Sony maintains it's development lineup strength, they won't even have better graphics to boast about in the next generation. All you have to do to see that being first isn't what makes you successful is to look at the Dreamcast.

    The only think I can think of is that perhaps they're still losing money on each Xbox they sell, so the pressure is on to get something with lower manufacturing costs out the door...
    • Could the ease of hacking the Xbox have anything to do with it?

      • Re:Hmmm... (Score:1, Insightful)

        by Anonymous Coward
        What an appropriate sig for your comment :)
    • What is Microsoft's motivation here anyway. I mean... Right now all they can really boast about over the PS2 is that they have a years worth of hardware advancement better graphics

      They have Live, which is a big advantage.
      PS2s CAN be online, but MS has really taken the lead on this.
      • Live isn't much of an advantage. Really... look at Microsoft's subscriber numbers versus how many people actually own an XBox. Look at PS2 network adapter sales, more people, smaller percentage.

        Online doesn't matter much at all right now except to a very small percentage of the total market.
    • you are right about the manufacturing costs right now ms has to buy each of the video chips from nvidea for each system so they are losing money but in xbox 2 they will be licencing the technology from nvidea so they will be able to improve it and manufacture it themselfs making the cose of the xbox2 less than xbox
    • The only think I can think of is that perhaps they're still losing money on each Xbox they sell, so the pressure is on to get something with lower manufacturing costs out the door...

      Last I heard the Xbox 2 would have no hard drive, which would take a sizable chunk out of the manufacturing costs compare to the current Xbox.

  • Heh... (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Lowtekium ( 216265 )
    All the way up the corporate ladder, even the VP of Sales and Marketing for Nintendo knows that they are only playing catch-up to the big boys. "We'll do what Sony does" because god knows we can't afford anything else after fast-tracking the DS.

    That's the spirit Nintendo! Cut your morale and business practices down, because everyone knows with that attitude you'll never be on top again.

    Sigh...

    I like Nintendo, I really do, but I can't help but watch this company fumble and bumble in every aspect of their

    • Re:Heh... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by ivan256 ( 17499 ) * on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:32PM (#10496217)
      What happened to bravado [...] they once had?

      Bravado doesn't earn profits, whereas their current business model rakes in the cash.

    • Re:Heh... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by HoneyBunchesOfGoats ( 619017 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:49PM (#10496422)
      They still do have the bravado and innovation, they just know not to let it get the better of them. They did have more overall public bravado when they were unchallenged in the console market, but heavy competition changed that. This contrasts with the handheld market, where Nintendo still dominates (and is acting with the bravado you speak of by stealing all of Sony's PSP thunder with the DS).

      The situation is reversed in the console market, and Nintendo knows they have to play their cards carefully. Look what happened to Sega: they released an innovative console well ahead of Sony, but Sony dissuaded people from purchasing it, making unfulfillable promises about the Playstation 2 (Toy Story in real time, etc.). (This is not to say that Sega didn't screw up either.) Nintendo surely saw this happen, and knows not to make the same mistakes. Sony is the dominating leader in the console market, and Nintendo is wise to plan carefully, and to keep that plan close to the vest.

      • Re:Heh... (Score:5, Interesting)

        by abandonment ( 739466 ) <mike.wuetherick@g[ ]l.com ['mai' in gap]> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @01:08AM (#10500902) Homepage
        exactly - nintendo is NOT going to go the direction of the 50-100 million dollar games, which are becoming expected budgets for ps3 and xbox2 titles - the next generation is exponentially increasing development budgets and time...

        nintendo has done the math, they know that sony & microsoft can (and seem to be willing to) develop themselves to death and still not produce good games...it's only a matter of time before the return on investment simply does not add up.

        you spend $50 million (HL2, Sims2, etc) to make a game, how many do you have to sell before it's considered a success for the company?

        usually investors (stockholders, etc) want an 'increase' in their returns, not barely breaking even...

    • Re:Heh... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Daetrin ( 576516 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @03:54PM (#10497024)
      And please tell me what corporation _doesn't_ incorporate their rivals' plans into their buisness strategy?

      I really doubt it's an issue of what Nintendo can or can't afford, given that they're swimming in cash at the moment. Rather it is an attempt to judge what release window would give them the biggest bang for the buck. And Sony certainly didn't have any problems admiting they needed to play "catch-up" to the Dreamcast back before the PS2 came out, and they did a great (if slimey) job of it and look where they are now.

      No company survives by ignoring the competition, and if Nintendo tried to deny that they're currently in second place in the console wars you'd just say they were going to fail because they were insular and self-deluded and couldn't adapt to the changing times.

      • Every corporation should involve the rivals in their equations, however, that doesn't mean they should ONLY factor them in. If Nintendo is truly waiting for whatever Sony does and whenever Sony does it, they will always be a step behind.
    • >What happened to bravado and innovation they once had?

      Virtual Boy...it was all downhill after that :)

    • All I have to say is that Nintendo had done a hell of a job catching up in the past year. And I'm definately looking forward to the next generation of console wars. After XBox vs GCN vs PS2, everybody seemed to look at Nintendo as a dying breed, but I think people are looking at them to be a serious contender in the next gen again.

  • desperate moves? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by apostrophesemicolon ( 816454 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:39PM (#10496303) Journal
    quote from the link:

    speaking at the ELSPA Game Summit in London last June, former Nintendo Europe boss David Gosen said that "in every cycle, some manufacturer not profiting from the current cycle is eager to kick-start the next one..."

    the signs are there:
    M$ tried to steal the market by being the first cutting the price on their console Xbox, and now they're going for a head start to steal the nextgen console market..
    IMO, aside from HALO, xbox doesn't have much to offer (pls no flaming,xboxers).. since the start, they jumped into a highly competitive market that needs carefully precised timing of release & strategy.

    The way I see it, in global terms PS3 will have a breezy launch with slight competition from Nintendo and even less from M$
    • They are no more trying to steal the market than Sony did with their PS and PS2. They're all companies, so why don't we stop the corporate bashing. It's not like Sony is a tiny home run business. If anything Nintendo is the only thing that can even slightly boast coming from a family business.
    • I hope you don't consider this a "flame", but have you USE an XBox with Live service?

      I mean, say what you want about Microsoft, but there is NO console ANYWHERE that offers an online experience half as good as XBox Live. HALO might be the most high-profile game on the system, but it's certainly not the only one. There are dozens of good titles-- at least as many as the Gamecube.
    • IMO, aside from HALO, xbox doesn't have much to offer (pls no flaming,xboxers)

      It's always the people offering flameBAIT who have to go out of their way to ask for no flames.

    • Go ahead and mod me Off Topic.. but I need to interject here. Why does everyone still think there aren't f'in FANTASTIC games for the Xbox?? Seriously people.. I don't mean to flame here (but so be it), crawl out from your little holes. My Xbox broke recently.. (!!!!) I wasn't going to buy another one at first.. then I remember I didn't even pay for my Xbox in the first place. Then I remembered: Jade Empire KOTOR 2 Kingdom Under Fire Starcraft Ghost just to name a FEW.. so I made up my mind and I'm
      • Perhaps I was remembering MORE REASONS to go out and buy a new XBox.. things to come, per say. Ever think of it like that? That's exactly what I meant.

        Since you want a list of current GOOD games, how about: Burnout 3, Splinter Cell (both), Prince of Persia, Ninja Gaiden, PGR, Fable, Soul Calibur II, Panzer Dragoon Orta and Madden 2K5. Wait, there's more...
    • I don't think Microsoft expects to make a decent profit on Xbox until Xbox 3. The reason they're going early is that they don't want to be in the same position as they were the last time around, where the launched when the PS2 was already firmly embedded. Of course, they also want to avoid the curse of the Dreamcast where everybody waits for the more-powerful Playstation that is coming along.

      So - I don't think they'll be expecting to make a profit, especially at the beginning. They need to make the Xbox 2

  • Revolution and DS (Score:2, Interesting)

    by mrgreen4242 ( 759594 )
    Fils-Aime also confirmed that the forthcoming Nintendo DS handheld could potentially be used to link up with the GameCube console, and will almost certainly boast link features with the Revolution platform.

    That's what I was most interested to see in this article. This leads me to believe that the DS will have built in wireless networking capabilities, and given the low cost of ethernet hardware, I would bet that it will also have a port for wired broadband. I suspect that the NRevolution will likely functi

    • Re:Revolution and DS (Score:2, Interesting)

      by satoshi1 ( 794000 )
      It's been known that the Revolution will be backwards compatible. This will help Nintendo, especially with MS's move to ditch it, as you said. I really feel as if MS isn't going to have much of a presence in the next-gen of consoles. Nintendo will hopefully have a bigger presence, and Sony will still be up there...

  • This has always been Nintendo's Pattern of Attack (Score:5, Insightful)

    by rubberbando ( 784342 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:40PM (#10496319)
    Think about it. In the 8-Bit days, the NES came out after the Sega Master System and Atari systems.

    The 16-bit days, the SNES waited until after both the Sega Genesis and NEC's Turbografix-16 came out.

    The 32/64-bit days, they waited to bring out the N64 long after the PSX and Sega Saturn. The same thing occurred with the Gamecube arriving just after the PS2 and XBox.

    Nintendo likes to sit back and see what the competion comes out with and then trumps it shortly after.

    Later to market isn't always a bad thing.
    • IIRC, the reason Nintendo was behind Sony in the 32 bit days was because the Playstation was actually orginally developed as a Sega-CD type add-on for the SNES. I can't remember the details of this turn of events very well though. Anyone have any further insight into this?

    • Trumps? (Score:1, Troll)

      by superultra ( 670002 )
      I'm not sure I'd call the N64 and Gamecube "trumps" persay. You'd think, as well, that with a year's delay they'd come up with more and better launch titles than Pilotwings 64 and Luigi's Mansion. Maybe they're just slow?

      I think you're confusing "Not caring" with "sitting back and see what the competition comes out with."

      • I guess he means harware wise. There's little question that power wise, the N64 and Gamecube beat their Sony counterparts when it comes down to hardware capabilites. Besides, isn't Mario 64 the quintessential launch title?. The GC launch titles were clearly weaker, but it's still not any worse than, let's say, PS2s.

    • I'm not sure you could say that the Nintendo 64 and Gamecube have trumped the Playstation and XBox respectively.

      Well, XBox might be arguable, but there's no way you can realistically consider the Nintendo 64 more successful than the Playstation. And the XBox just does so much *more* than the Gamecube does, you know?
    • You are wrong about the NES. The NES came out a full year before the Master System [christmas of '85 instead of '86], and even though the Atari 7800 had be completed in '84, it had been shelved because of the crash. Atari brought it back in '86 when they saw how well Nintendo was doing.

    • Nintendo likes to sit back and see what the competion comes out with and then trumps it shortly after.

      Later to market isn't always a bad thing.

      <sarcasm>
      Exactly. That's how Nintendo has managed to stay #1!
      </sarcasm>

  • It's true. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by incom ( 570967 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:41PM (#10496323)
    MS releasing the xbox2 so early is a slap in the face to thier customers. With the PS2, and DS, they commited to a long product lifecycle, giving thier customers more years of value and game development, while with the xboxii it's imho too early. I think nintendo tested the waters earlier with leaked reports of an early gamecube successor, but backed off because it wasn't well received EOLing the GC so early, but MS just doesn't seem to care about thier loyal customers of the current console.
    • If is has backwards compatibility and games are still developed for both platforms what's the harm!

      Also OUR systems shipped with a harddrive so I can download games off the net, there will never be a lack of content as long as people want to make it for free or pay for it.

      And if worst comes to worst it works just fine for streaming movies from my computer or DVD.

      Don't be bitter baby, you too can buy one.
    • typo in first line.
    • Now, wait a minute. Ok, let's assume the XBox 2 has no backwards compatibility, a likely scenario.

      The XBox 1 has a network port and a HD, good display hardware, good sound hardware, and a decently powerful CPU. Just because the XBox 2 is released does not mean the XBox 1 has reached it's end of life! Heck, look at the new services that Microsoft is adding to XBox Live... they're adding MSN/PopCap games like Bejeweled you can play online with others, they've added voicemail and chat (without requiring a
      • MS could definately go for a two tiered attack with the Xbox... first do a PSone style redesign of the current Xbox, dropping manufacturing costs, and in the proccess reduicng size, one of the big XBox compaints. Sell it SUPER cheap. Under $99. Make it the default choice for budget gaming. Include as many freebies as possible to still be profitable (or at least lose no more money than need be). Things like the PopCap games and voicemail you mentioned are good starts. I would add some sort of online demo sys
    • I'm an Xbox customer-

      I would be happy as shit if Microsoft came out with a new Xbox tomorrow.

      If they had a 3 year product cycle, that would be fantastic.

      I would guess that a lot of other 'loyal customers of the current console' feel the same way. Bring on the new stuff!
    • How is a four-year cycle a "slap in the face", yet a four and a half or five year cycle perfectly acceptable? Honestly, does 6-12 months really make that much difference? What about Nintendo's "slap in the face" to those who purchased GBAs barely three years ago (and had to make things right a year later with the SP), and they're already obsoleting it with the DS?

  • My vision (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Apreche ( 239272 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @02:41PM (#10496324) Homepage Journal
    Nintendo is setting up some of the most original hardware I have ever seen. Me and my friends are making a hobby of thinking up things that were never before possible before the Nintendo DS. The possibilites are truly endless and amazing. I predict, and hope, that the Revolution will act as a hub for Nintendo DSes.

    Here is my vision:

    16 DSes can linke wirelessly. If the revolution can link to all those DSes then you can do this. Have a game with four teams, four players per team. The big screen attached to the revolution has the readout for the entire game, each player has two screens on their DS to do their personal bit.

    Even better. If the revolution has a net connection. Then you can have two revolutions connect over the net or via lan cable. Two teams of 16 can fight each other. One team in one room in one country, the other team on the other side of the world. The teams can communicate with microphone that plugs into the ds. The idea of a game like this is the best thing ever. Imagine, online teamplay gaming without even a possibility of cheating!

    Nintendo is making the hardware which makes this possible. But I am worried they will not make the software that takes full advantage of the possibilities. At least Warp Pipe looks like they are moving in that direction.
    • Imagine, online teamplay gaming without even a possibility of cheating!

      To be technical, this is never 100% possible. Given a high-powered enough box running custom software to filter, replace, or alter the packets that come and go through the network, one could even cheat in multiplayer console games. But the cost in time, effort, and equipment is quite prohibitive for such a scheme, so we're very unlikely to see any cheating in Nintendo's console games.

      I'm not trying to come down on your post, I ju

    • Re:My vision (Score:4, Insightful)

      by CashCarSTAR ( 548853 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @04:18PM (#10497192)
      Err..take that a step back, but a step further at the same time.

      Considering how much they're charging for the hardware at this poing, they have to have the costs of screens at a low level at this point. So basically, why make people spend all the money for a DS? If the hardware can handle it, theoretically one system could pump out the screens for 8? systems, at least to a quality that would be good enough for an LCD screen. Then put on top of that having that screen be touch sensitve, as well, you can bring output to the TV.

      Think about this. Goldeneye/random FPS. Each person with their own view of the screen. On the TV, you can have a cinimatic view of the going ons, security cameras, kill cams score list, etc.

      That would be a revolution.
      • Yeah, a really freaking expensive revolution, that almost nobody would bother trying. I have to buy a 'Revolution', a DS', then get multiple friends to buy one too, then come over, all to make this possible? Wow.
      • That's basically what Nintendo already tried with GBA-GC connectivity. It bombed pretty badly, and not just for cost reasons - most games are primarily played single-player style, and this kind of control mechanism just doesn't do that very well. Why is it suddenly going to work now?
    • Here's another interesting idea - what if Revolution controllers have screens built in? Not only would this allow the co-op gaming you described (without investing in multiple DSs), but you might be able to walk away with your wireless controller and keep playing (while in wireless range of the console).

      Finally, a solution for all of that time wasted during bathroom breaks.

    • Me and my friends are making a hobby of thinking up things that were never before possible before the Nintendo DS.

      Then please publish as many details about these "things", these inventions of new modes of gameplay, so that nobody can snap up the patents and monopolize the next generation of game systems.

  • About the timetable for release, it makes perfect sense. Every generation, you get one console out that's much earlier than the others (genesis, ps2, etc.), and usually by the end of the generation it's looking pretty long in the tooth hardware-wise. On the other hand, if you're the last one to release, the competitors get a huge established customer base that's hard to compete with. Now, admittedly Sony was successful in releasing the ps2 earlier than the gamecube or xbox (but look at the dreamcast), bu
  • I could have sworn that earlier Nintendo was claiming they were going to be first to market. Personally i thought trying to get out before Sony would probably be a mistake, given Sony's past successes with underhanded "why buy that piece of crap now when our system will be coming out in six months and it will be ten times as powerfull as their stuff and it will grant you the magic ability to fly as well" marketing schemes.

    So i'm glad that they're going to match step with Sony now, but that wasn't what i r

    • >given Sony's past successes with underhanded
      >"why buy that piece of crap now when our
      >system will be coming out in six months and it
      >will be ten times as powerfull as their stuff
      >and it will grant you the magic ability to fly
      >as well" marketing schemes

      IIRC the Xbox PR guy said the same kind of propaganda about Xbox that it can pump out so much more polygons than PS2 before its release, but miserably failed to deliver in the actual sales figures. Yes, the guy cited "Toy Story" hype as if
  • Do we have any idea(rumors) on what sort os specs, hardware power and features the GC2/Revolution will boast? Will it have full-sized disks? More memory, better graphics card, multiprocessor, wireless ad-hoc connectivity with the DS for LAN gaming, Ethernet port and internet system(X-box live) by default? Anyone?
    • Well, here's what's been implied. It will be more powerful than the Gamecube. It will probably not quite match up to the PS2 and XBox2, because innovation is far more important, especially now that graphics have reached such an incredible level. (Worded the way they might word it, though I do agree.)

      There have been reports of backwards compatibility, but assuming those are true then it may simply be able to use either mini or full-size discs in one drive, or even simply have more than one place to stick t

  • Sony isn't their main competitor (Score:3, Insightful)

    by DaveCBio ( 659840 ) on Monday October 11, 2004 @09:23PM (#10499736)
    Microsoft is. If they are aiming at Sony, they are going to miss.
    • Yeah, openly competing for a distant second is a good plan for success.

      Since PS3 is the deafault purchase for most of the people, they want PS3 purchasers to consider them, not Xbox ones.
      Especially if Sony buries MS with marketing lies.
    • The point of competiton in business is not to 'win.' It's not a match with a score. Nintendo did in fact 'win' with the Gamecube, in business terms -- they made money. Anyway, the point is to do as well as you can.

      You cannot pick your competitors. Apple can't just say, "Well, we don't want to compete with Microsoft anymore, because it's too hard." (Unless they completely change their product line, of course!) Nintendo is competing with Sony. They are competing with Microsoft. I assure you, they would rathe

  • That's no Revolution (Score:3, Funny)

    by tepples ( 727027 ) <.tepples. .at. .gmail.com.> on Monday October 11, 2004 @11:04PM (#10500376) Homepage Journal

    Nintendo may call its new console a "Revolution", but it's not a real Revolution until Konami ports its flagship Bemani title [konami.com].

  • I find it particularly intersting because about this time a year ago, Nintendo was talking about how they wanted to be first to hit the market for the next generation. Basically, at the time they felt poor sales of the GCN were related to PS2 hitting the market ahead of the GCN and having a much larger base of games to compete with.

    Now the question is, did they change their opinion because of better GCN sales following the $99 price drop, or are they just falling behind in production and the shot at micro
    • I think its more cause they decided to focus more on getting the DS out before the PSP, to try an take the wind out of Sony's portable systems sails. I think MS would do better to have better control over the games released to their console. Most of them are poorly implemented pieces of garbage; though, there are those rare gems like Halo2 & Ninja Gaiden.

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