EA Starts Gamedev Program 272
mrseigen writes "CNN is reporting that EA has opened a game program at USC. It is the first official game development education. Yeah, right."
The trouble with being punctual is that nobody's there to appreciate it. -- Franklin P. Jones
What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:4, Interesting)
Here's the real question (ready?):
Should universities be designed for vocational training?
Discuss.
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2, Insightful)
A university designed for vocational training would a vocational school. USC still offers Classics and Mathematics degrees all the way up to the doctoral level, right?
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:4, Interesting)
(NOTE: This is an honest true story)
Me and a friend of mine in college made money doing the "practical" assignments for friends from university. They understood the principles of software engineering, but however, could not write a line of code.
Oddly enough, they're the ones that would run the a software project, but wouldn't know how the developers actually made it work.
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
I think computer science departments should be run like music departments:
Every semester, we have juries. You appear in front of a panel of 3-5 professors for 10-15 minutes and demonstrate what you've done this semester. For most, it means playing a piece (composition majors bring what they've written). If you fail, you are placed on probation and have to pay for your own lessons the next semester. If you fail again the next semester, you are dropped from the department.
Oh, and senior project
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:3, Interesting)
Mastery of programming languages shouldn't be a prequisite for studying computer science. Granted, those skills are pretty useful, but rather than testing them directly the curriculum should just encourage their development to give you a leg up when studying computer theory, just as a music comp. major would become pretty handy with a piano while putting together
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
Absolutely correct. Otherwise, where would we get our PHBs?
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
No, I think that composition majors should have to be able to play at least ONE instrument, with moderate skills. Without such skill, they wouldn't have a clue as to limitations of any instruments.
And this, I believe, is what those "but programming is monkey job" architect-wannabes are missing. As much as I agree that the most important things is understanding
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:3, Interesting)
Believe me, it made a huge difference to me in my recent j
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
I kinda like the way we got it setup here in Canada. If you want an education based in theory, understanding of key concepts and the like then go to University. If you want to learn how to do things, get a basic understanding of the "whys" then go to college. Generally the University people understand more, but can do less.
(NOTE: This is an honest true story)
Me and a friend of mine in college made money doing the "practical" assignments for friends from university. They understood the principles of softwa
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
Not always.
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2, Insightful)
Why not? That's why most people go to college. I think it should at least be an option for people not looking for expertise, just a 9-5.
Re:What? Is my Digipen degree chopped liver? (Score:2)
No.
But.....
No.
(Disclaimer: While I've done some game development, and am looking into the GBA homebrew scene at the moment, I actually have an English degree. So take my comments with a grain of whatever flavor salt you think appropriate.)
(Mmmm... cherry salt....)
When I got my degree from the 'Pen. (Score:2)
But, I agree, it is just words.
Oh, and as far as universities being designed for vocational training. I think universities should focus on the betterment of human knowledge in the arts & sciences. I went to university to gain knowledge, I went to Digipen to get a job.
Yeah Right (Score:2, Funny)
How much homework? (Score:5, Funny)
I mean, it already IS pretty realistic... (Score:5, Funny)
Come to think of it... (Score:2)
Actually, who is to say EA will need any employees when they have fleets of grad students? After all, how is anyone else going to produce a competitive football game with the licence...
EA is literally taking the ball away and running all the way home with it.
Re:How much homework? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:How much homework? (Score:2)
Re:How much homework? (Score:2)
Actually, a while back I heard that the three worst majors for homework were as follows:
This may have changed, but from my experience in school (I had roommates in Architecture and Physics and I was in CS), it certainly seemed likely. Of course, we didn't have Java or C# at that point, and Visual Basic was brand new. Programming has been getting increasingly easier with higher level languages and improved debugging t
Re:How much homework? (Score:2)
Why performance arts? Required projects and projects for grade. Rehearsal time adds up. Fast. At my school(which didn't have Architecture), Computer Science was towards the top, but theatre was probably the most time in
It depends (Score:2)
The students training to make RPGs get 80 hours, the students training to make action games or platformers get about 20 hours, and the online FPS students seem to never do anything else
"Thank you, Mary, you can let in the next one" (Score:5, Funny)
Don't forget, it needs to be done in three more days to be ready for the holiday season, and you can't afford to fail your first submission.
Stop that. Stop crying. Here, have a tissue. That will be five cents."
Re:How much homework? (Score:2)
Well, for starters, they don't teach you to spell with numbers.
(Why do I have the feeling I'm going to have to explain this joke?)
Re:How much homework? (Score:2)
I only survived because of the DigiPen Dumbell (64 oz bladder buster sized cup of Mountain Dew from the 7eleven on the corner). Although I will contest that my sanity has never been quite the same.
Game School? (Score:2)
Re:Game School? (Score:2)
Really, next think you know Ben and Jerry will be start a program in Ice Cream development.
Imagine this conversation in the dorms.
Pete:"Hey Stan, what's wrong?"
Stan:"Chunky Monkey, man. Chunky Mother-Fucking Monkey! After this semester, I'm never touching that bullshit again."
LK
And in today's class... (Score:1, Redundant)
doh (Score:2, Insightful)
First-year subjects include... (Score:4, Funny)
Managing Programmers from a Marketing Perspective
Caffeinated Beverages
Time Management
Effective and Ethical Project Management
Why a Job is More Important than a Life
That's clearly not the EA school... (Score:2)
Effective and Ethical Project Management
Ethical? EA? Riiight.
Well.. (Score:5, Funny)
Freshman 15 (Score:2)
High School Senior transforms into College Freshman.
Re:Well.. (Score:2)
Tough gig (Score:5, Funny)
It's a 4-year degree, but you're required to finish the classwork in 6 months. BUT, you can pass with an "F" as long as you filled in every blank on the tests.
First? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:First? (Score:2)
Guildhall at SMU (Score:5, Informative)
Apparently they only offer a 'certificate' rather than a university degree, but the Guildhall [smu.edu] at SMU has been running for two and a half years now.
There may be earlier programs; this is just one that I happen to know of.
chair endowed by himself (Score:5, Interesting)
I love it. The guy endows himself as a faculty chair. Forever putting to rest the notion that University curriculum can't be bought.
Academic integrity @ USC => zero.
Re:chair endowed by himself (Score:5, Insightful)
Academic integrity @ USC => zero.
What an outrage! They should get someone qualified like someone who has been in an important creative position in the industry for over a decade...
Re:chair endowed by himself (Score:2)
So, USC's academic integrity is either equal to, or greater than, zero?
Okay, I choose a million!
Re:chair endowed by himself (Score:2)
Re:chair endowed by himself (Score:2)
Re:chair endowed by himself (Score:2)
Remember, you can't spell "exploitation" without "EA"....
Game degree (Score:2, Interesting)
And from the student's point of view isnt a 'game degree' a bit to specialized and restrictive. I mean I was really really sue that I wanted to be game developer when I was in hight school but 4 years later I realized that there are many other interesting jobs I could do. Any way thats My
Re:Game degree (Score:2, Insightful)
That's not to say that there are no good CS courses about though.
That view is based a lot on my my uni and what I know of other uni's courses. I'm studying Games Tech at Abertay where that course is generally noted as one of the most demanding in the whole uni, a magnitude above the CS course. Although that might just suggest that our
Re:Game degree (Score:3, Insightful)
You can train a new hire to do the game stuff, but other interests often make for more well-rounded people who are easier to get along with and communicate better. No
Re:Game degree (Score:2)
Re:Game degree (Score:2, Funny)
Background in literature and drama/theater (they kept trying to recruit me again for productions when I got to college, but I had no time), I grock music theory though I never got into the advanced stuff (even used to play. I miss that and want to get into it again at some point), studied German (I'm a polyglot though I've lost a lot of it because of disuse. However, aparently I am truly amusing after a few drinks. Ta
Re:Game degree (Score:2)
This English-grad-student geek blesses you, my son!
That said, I also have to say I think I'm something of a special case. It's a fact that software development requires some specialized knowledge, and while I don't think it's as difficult to pick up as many think, learning
Re:Game degree (Score:2)
Even the submitters don't read the articles anymor (Score:5, Insightful)
Also, before people start sneering, this degree is in the USC School of Cinema-Television, not the Engineering dept. It has about as much to do with the programming side of gaming as a degree in cinema has to do with the details of the electronics in a movie camera. USC does have some cool Computer Graphics classes in the Engineering dept, however.
Brian
Re:Even the submitters don't read the articles any (Score:2)
Re:Even the submitters don't read the articles any (Score:2)
Are you sure it's "-ae" rather than "-a"?
First official? (Score:2)
er, wasnt digipen first? (Score:2)
they've been around for years. no idea if theyre accredited or not, but i know game companies take digipen graduates seriously.
Not the first at USC (Score:3, Informative)
USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:5, Interesting)
Gateway computers
Pentium IV - Intel 3.0 GHz RAM
1 GB Video
Gforce4 5900
256MB of onboard RAM
USB 2.0, firewire support, sound blaster compatible
DVD drive
Is any self-respecting geek going to go to a place that can't talk about hardware correctly?
But then again, if you had self respect, the EA attachment would probably stop you cold.
Re:USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:3, Informative)
http://uat.edu/subPages/learningEnvironment/subPa
Re:USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:2)
Re:USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:3, Funny)
Dude! 3 GHz RAM! Talk about blowing the memory latency gap out of the water! I'm at the wrong school.
Re:USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:2)
Depends on if you've ever sat in on a Marketing meeting before.
Re:USC job posting: Tech writer wanted... (Score:2)
I think i may have misunderstood the reason for them posting that link in the article.
They should have linked the sarcastic "yeah right" not the first program text.
Could this be the start of something ugly? (Score:2, Interesting)
Maybe SCO will designate some law school as the only "official" corporate lawsuit education providers?
I love how, because they are a huge heartless titan in the game world, they have the gall to claim that they're the only ones who can name "official" game dev educational programs.
I just hope this doesn't start a trend. Furthermor
Re:Could this be the start of something ugly? (Score:2)
For that matter, Doctors programs in AI and graphics programming are also rather mundane too. The liberal arts and fine arts colleges probably aren't slacking off either...
WPI too (Score:4, Informative)
Re:WPI too (Score:2)
________________________________________
Fight, fly, and create in Inago Rage. [dejobaan.com]
Quite an old news (Score:3, Informative)
SJ Mercury News reported about this few months back. But you should have seen this paper. The business section had two major stories side by side. One was about new game development education program and corresponding degree at USC. And another story about increasing outourcing of game development jobs abroad.
Oh the irony.
Re:Quite an old news (Score:2)
Why it is that a "game development" course most often focuses on DirectX is beyond me. You can learn DirectX from a book if the need arises.
Digipen (Score:2, Funny)
Required Chemistry course (Score:2)
Course outline (Score:2)
AP story same day
EA announces layoffs of the entire Madden division. No word yet as to what team will continue devevlopment of the popular series.
Always the last to hear (Score:2)
Damn you USC. Damn you!
Re:Always the last to hear (Score:2)
bad editting (Score:2)
WPI (Score:2)
http://www.wpi.edu/Academics/Majors/IMGD/
it is not the only game development degree (Score:2)
proxy
Massive Irony Playhouse (Score:2)
I'm thinking, these days, that the modern game development system is antithetical to new game designs, and not just because of management meddling with developers (note that in the CNNmoney article EA's management guy is actually TOUTED as having a hand in almost every game they release).
I think, however, that the thing most designers need to do these days is experiment.
That's right, experiment. Miyamoto is well-known for havi
Re:Yay (Score:2)
Yeah, it already exists in many forms. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:First School??? (Score:2)
If an institution with some clout AND quasi-objective say in the matter made such a quote, I'd give it more weight. However, anything you read on an institution's OWN webpage should be taken with a grain of salt.
Re:First School??? (Score:2)
Re:First School??? (Score:2)
Re:First School??? (Score:2)
Re:First School??? (Score:2)
Long story short, I give them a polite 'thanks but no thanks' when the resume comes across my desk now.
To those considering a stint at Digipen (or any other 'gaming university' or even a degree that focuses on game problems): Do yourself a favor. Get a real CS educati
Re:DigiPen grads "lack the fundamentals?" (Score:3, Interesting)
Big-O isn't something you just 'have a course on' and then move on, nor is it something that you needs to explain to anyone who has a more traditional programming degree. Big-O is actually one of the most important aspects of computer programming (in video games) because it comes up on a daily basis.
Optimizatio
What a shame... (Score:3, Interesting)
Or am I the only person who abhors graphics code, and the industry's latest obsession on pretty-realism?
Re:Some more news (Score:2)
Re:uh... Digipen?? (Score:2)
4 year BS in some art thingie
2 year AS in Real-time Interactive Simulation (Being phased out)
4 year BS in Real-time Interactive Simulation
6 year Masters in programming
2 year Computer Engineering degree (involing making some handheld of some sort)
They have a couple plans.
Re:uh... Digipen?? (Score:2)
want me to scan them for you?
Re:Graduate Program? (Score:3, Informative)
Far from the first, too... (Score:2)
Re:There are real programs (Score:2)
Are you a... master code monkey?
Interesting
(to be fair, the ellipses include: "superb 3D modeler? master code monkey? stagemanager extraordinaire? talented screenwriter? mesmerizing mechanical engineer? theatrical lighting expert?" )
Re:Class (Score:2)