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Dell XPS 'Gaming' PC Review 449

Posted by Zonk from the hard-to dept.
cojsl writes "[H]ard|OCP has an entertaining review of a Dell XPS 400 'Gaming PC'." From the article: "If the Dimension XPS400 is any indication, Dell considers computer gamers a joke. Harsh, yes. But we think it's accurate. The system itself is a decent gaming platform and the hardware was well built. It was put together decently with parts that can pull the weight required to play today's graphically intensive games. But we couldn't even install one of the most popular games on the market, Sims 2, and trying to play other popular games would lock up the system and gaming sessions, when they would run, would get interrupted. The pre-installed programs that Dell chose to include on its computer were almost certainly the cause of all these problems, and unloading these programs from the boot-up routine fixed the problems."
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Dell XPS 'Gaming' PC Review More

Dell XPS 'Gaming' PC Review

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  • Sounds like all of the systems they make! (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 19, 2005 @04:47AM (#14289764)
    Why should their gaming PC's work any better than their business PC's?

    • Re:Sounds like all of the systems they make! (Score:5, Interesting)

      by zoney_ie ( 740061 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:41AM (#14289887)
      Any sensible business should be either re-installing the systems themselves after purchase, or paying someone else to do so - in both cases based on the company's actual requirements (software, network/profile setup, configuration, devices).

      One size fits all doesn't work, and it's the reason for many problems with Windows even after careful configuration.

      Careful configuration (switching off unneeded services for example) makes a huge difference to the resources used by Windows, and can help security also.
      • Heh - of course, with the XPS - it's specifically for gaming. So Dell could have set up the system to, for example, not have cruddy background processes starting in Windows.

        That said, I'm happy with my off-the-shelf Dimension for gaming (after the usual Windows re-install and endless tweaking - wish I'd made an image of my clean system with all customisation done). Of course, it's hard to be unhappy with a cheap but good quality 20" flat panel at 1600x1200!

    • Differences between Dell business and consumer (Score:5, Informative)

      by klubar ( 591384 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @09:15AM (#14290502) Homepage
      Dell sells both business and consumer models. In the desktop line the Optiplexes are the business versions and Dimensions are the consumer. They share almost all the internal parts but have different skins.

      The big difference is in the software. The consumer versions come preloaded with a bunch of crappy demos and spyware-lite. The business versions have no extra pre-loaded software--just what is ordered. In addition, the business versions usually come with Gold service--a 800 number answered in the US by an English-speaking rep. Typically, the calls are answered in less than 5 minutes.

      If you're looking at Dells, check out the small business store for the bloat-ware free versions.

      Typically, the business versions are $50 to $100 more (depending on the system) than the consumer.

      Desktop
      Dimension=consumer
      Optiplex=business
      Lapto
      Inspiron=consumer
      Latitude


      I also think the review was a bit harsh. They already didn't like Dell for the lack of complete choice in parts and the "big evil brand". They started out by complaining about paying taxes...if they buy their systems from any vendor in Texas they should be paying taxes...hardly Dell's fault.

  • Suprise Suprise (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Quintessant ( 935208 )
    What? Are you expecting anything different folks. It is a dell, after all.

    • Re:Suprise Suprise (Score:3, Informative)

      by EpsCylonB ( 307640 )
      And being dell it is all intel, I was amazed when i saw them advertising gaming pcs with no amd based model.

    • Re:Suprise Suprise (Score:5, Insightful)

      by sgant ( 178166 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @07:37AM (#14290133) Homepage Journal
      This is one of the reasons why I build my own machines.

      People here and there write that "oh, you're a dinosaur, building your own machines...who has time for that? It's 2005, buy a system from Dell or Gateway and it will be cheaper".

      WRONG. Everyone that writes and says their time is too valuable to build a machine (which let's face it, it takes only a couple of hours to assemble the parts) doesn't look at playing a game as wasting their valuable time. But how much time is lost trying to unload all the CRAP that Dell/Gateway/Compaq or whatever loads into the machine because they have special deals with all these companies? They even give you the system disk that is suppose to have Windows on it so you can reload it, yet even THAT loads on all the crap again and you're right back where you started.

      It's BS. I'd rather just spend the money to buy Windows and load it and that's it. Then I load what I want on it. My sister-in-law just bought a Dell laptop and I looked at her processes and she had 28 user processes running on her machine! And she was wondering why it was running slow even though it was brand new. Know how many user processes I have running on this machine? 4....just 4.

      I'll build my own computers thank you.

      • Re:Suprise Suprise (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Octorian ( 14086 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @08:25AM (#14290256) Homepage
        I wonder if this problem has gotten better or worse over the years... (as I remember the days of "Packard Bell Navigator" and *shudder*)

        I still remember back around late middle-school/early high-school (when I fixed people's computers as a side-job). I had my custom build and nicely configured 486DX2-66, and my upgrade cycle was offset by a year or two from many people in my area. So all these people I knew had just upgraded to new Pentium-based machines, which on-paper were probably better than mine by a long way. (of course they were also mostly store-bought crap) In any case, these machines were all so overloaded with gunk that in actual use, my measly 486 was *much* faster and thrashed *much* less often.

        (Yes, this was all in the early/middle Win9X days... Back then my only Linux tinkerings was a brief flirtation with SLS, and eventually some version of Slackware that came in a Linux book I bought.)

        Of course my 486 only had 8MB of RAM, which was pretty sweet when I first got it (most friends had machines with 4MB, and our previous family machine had 2MB). Heck, I even had a friend who had a 386DX-40 with 4MB who managed to tweak Win95 so well that he could usably run several programs on it at the same time. Ahh, those where the days, when tweaking and squeezing every last ounce out of one's desktop was a big factor that separated the geeks from the average luser. (and when the accelerated XFree86 x server actually had *faster* graphics than Windows)

  • The trouble with OEM discs and copy protection (Score:5, Insightful)

    by ReformedExCon ( 897248 ) <reformed.excon@gmail.com> on Monday December 19, 2005 @04:50AM (#14289772)
    I think Dell makes a good case here for why vendors should be forced to package clean OS discs and why Microsoft is helping these fools cause headaches by making it difficult to reinstall the OS. The first thing that should happen with these machines is that the existing installation ought to be wiped and replaced with an absolutely clean version of the OS, no software, just the OS. Critical updates ought to be packaged on discs as well.

    But instead you get "backup CDs" (not even provided in the case of this Dell!) which bring you back to the OEM's idea of a starting point. That's probably fine for most desktops, but on laptops you never know which uninstall is about to break the touchpad or cause the monitor to stop working.

    I keep Win2K around, with all its slow bootup times and lousy hardware support, just because I am able to reinstall when I need to. And, it's just so good that I hardly ever need to. XP? It may be technically better, but unless I have the ability to reinstall it on my own machines at my whim, it's useless.

    • Re:The trouble with OEM discs and copy protection (Score:5, Informative)

      by SlashdotOgre ( 739181 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @04:57AM (#14289785) Journal
      Although I agree with your post, it should be noted that Dell still provides OEM Windows XP install discs with their Small Business lines of machines (Latitudes, Optiplexes, Precisions). I'm not sure about consumer models bought from the Small Business section, but I know for sure on the lines mentioned above. These CD's are free of charge (or rather you don't pay less by asking them not send them), and they only include Windows (none of the preinstalled junk) -- I've used them myself. Also, up until this past summer, the consumer lines in the Home section were offered with OEM Windows install CD's as well. Unfortunately around June, Dell switched to restore partitions.

      • Re:The trouble with OEM discs and copy protection (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Heartz ( 562803 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:46AM (#14289900) Homepage
        I just bought a Dell Dimension 9150 that comes with the Dual Core processors. In Malaysia, they provide you with all the CDs. Everything down to the drivers comes with the pack that gets delivered. The OS provided is a clean OS. The "recovery" edition is kept on a partition on the HardDrive (takes about 3 gigs or so).

        Funny how you guys don't seem to get the CDs in the States.

        • I don't know what these guys are talking about. I'm in the US, and I've bought for myself and friends a number of Dells over the past two years, and they've all come with clean Windows XP SP2 CDs. The drivers are on a seperate disc, and the additional software is on yet more discs. The only difference between these systems' Windows XP CDs and retail Windows XP CDs is the label, and my XPS's XP CD has the SATA drivers slipstreamed so you don't need a floppy drive.

        • In Malaysia, they provide you with all the CDs.

          Maybe it's because you're using the superior Windows/XP Pirate Edition, not the inferior Windows/XP Home Edition? Crippleware sucks.

        • Funny how you guys don't seem to get the CDs in the States.

          I was just thinking that myself. I remember that a no cost option for most of the machines we buy at work is to have no CD Media included with the package. I just specced up the Australian "Gaming PC" from Dell (Dimension 9150) and Windows MCE was a $89 option. But all Windows OS options (Home, MCE, Pro) specifically stated CD Media in the little blue text.

          Also reading the review I noticed that some of the drivers they mentioned were specifical

      • My wife and I just ordered a Dell E510 for her home office, and one of the options when ordering was the default "System Restore" or "Windows XP Professional Backup CD".

        Now, we'll see what that CD is. Possibly just a "System Restore" disk, but if so I'll be calling Dell...(as if that will help, but still...)

        Jim

      • Re:The trouble with OEM discs and copy protection (Score:5, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 19, 2005 @07:46AM (#14290153)
        As a Dell onsite tech, I can tell you the very reason that they stopped sending out the Windows and Drivers Cd's. MOST OF THE IDIOTS LOST THEM. You don't know how many times I've replaced hard drives to find that the customer didn't have the cd's, but KNOWS that they received them. Dell got tired of sending out multiple copies to customers who just don't know how to keep track of their own software. You can receive a copy from tech support if ask. Also, drives that they replace do not ship with the restore partition and thus are sent with the cd's if the customer doesn't have them.
        • I'd mod my fellow tech up if I had the points. someone else do it for me.
        • MOST OF THE IDIOTS LOST THEM.

          What about the ones who aren't idiots? The ones who reinstalled from the disks without calling you?

          You can receive a copy from tech support if ask.

          The guys in TFA tried that. They spent a few hours on hold, didi it again after a few days when they didn't arrive as promised, finally got an OS disk without the necessary drivers, and were charged $10. Who wants to fuck around like that and not have the use of their computer for a week to save Dell 25c for a CDROM?

    • You hit an important point. The first thing I did when I got my IBM laptop a few years back was to backup the install files and wipe the system. IBM used a restore partition (stupid, stupid!) and only gave you the Windows (or whatever) install CDs if you requested them. Fortunately I have other CDs from which I could install Windows and Linux (anhilating the restore partition). I could easily see a case where a newbie was trying to install Linux on the same system anhilating Windows and having no way to

    • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @06:45AM (#14290014)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Too harsh (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Mattygfunk1 ( 596840 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @04:57AM (#14289786)
    .... Dell won't help troubleshoot trouble caused by viruses, the most likely reason a non-technical person would damage their MBR, instead telling you to call their pay-for-service phone line....

    I wouldn't help you either. Is it just me or does the reviewer seem to have a chip on his shoulder the whole way through?

    I like this kind of "whole experience" review, but I think things like taking "two clicks" to get to the relevant system on the website is being way too pedantic.

    __
    Updated Thrice Daily Adult Videos [laughdaily.com]
    • .... Dell won't help troubleshoot trouble caused by viruses, the most likely reason a non-technical person would damage their MBR, instead telling you to call their pay-for-service phone line....

      Dell pre-installs anti-virus software, but with all the new viruses they can hardly be held responsible for helping anybody out with this. They would go broke if they have to answer all the questions for free, plus that (l)users will never even have the inclination to learn to manage their PC (Does not matter if

    • Re:Too harsh (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Babbster ( 107076 ) <aaronbabb@NOspaM.gmail.com> on Monday December 19, 2005 @06:49AM (#14290025) Homepage
      I think that if you buy a gaming PC and can't install The Sims 2 - a ridiculously popular game - out of the box, then there's no such thing as a review that is "too harsh." The only possible excuse would be an actual hardware problem, and that obviously wasn't the case.

      You may have a point on the virus issue (though I think it would be far more reasonable to limit the virus calls on the regular service line instead of banning them altogether) but that PC earned the lousy review because it was filled with easily preventable problems from the get-go.

  • Gaming....... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by stunt_penguin ( 906223 )
    Gaming, it's as easy as.... oh wait no it's not. Who expected anything different from Dell?

    It's crap like this that tends to push gamers away from the PC and towards consoles (the occasion XB360 lockup being the exception that pees all over this post).

    Fortunately for me I've got my machine just about stable on most games I try on it, but it does take a lot of effort to keep a machine up to date, most problems being fixed by new drivers & directX updates.

    Dell should supply those gaming machines w

  • lmao: mousepad was broken. (Score:5, Funny)

    by leuk_he ( 194174 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:04AM (#14289803) Homepage Journal
    (for those too lazy to read the article:)


    "My mouse pad is broken."

    Without mincing words: We had significant quality of use issues with this computer.

    First and most obviously, we started having problems with our optical mouse. Sometimes it would wildly fly across the screen, other times we had trouble controlling it. Those of you who have ever tried to use an optical mouse on a shiny surface know what I'm talking about.

    The reason why (and I can't believe I'm typing this) was that the mouse pad that Dell provided was too shiny and reflective to be used with their own, branded, optical mouse.

    It's no longer a tech support urban legend. We have a documented case of a computer mouse pad being "broken."

    Basically the article says the hardware is OK, but the preinstalled stuff sucks.

    • actually, it's not so much the mousepad that's broken, it's the absolute crap mice that Dell ship, though the mousepad might have highlighted the problem.

      The Dell branded mouse I received with my Inspiron 9300 had exactly the same problems, no matter what surface I used it on.
      I threw it in the bin and used a cheap Microsoft optical mouse instead and haven't had a problem since.

    • Re:lmao: mousepad was broken. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by nzodd ( 836093 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:12AM (#14289825)
      Which is to say, all of the hardware which Dell purchased from OTHER VENDORS worked perfectly; but the very exact service that they're being payed to provide -- namely the proper configuration and testing of that hardware setup with the software they install by default, as well as technical support -- ended up being practically of no value. Sad.

  • Is it any suprise... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by heli0 ( 659560 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:04AM (#14289805)
    ...that so many people have turned to consoles, when you can't even install brand new games on a brand new Dell PC without lockups and crashes?

    Does anyone really want to be on the phone with India on Christmas morning trying to get a Sims game working for their kid? Do yourself a favor and just get them a Gamecube with Smash Bros and RE:4.

  • I may sound harsh and all, but I always said, those who prefer buying prebuilt, preinstalled boxes from big players all deserve what they get. Yes, the argument always comes that most people don't know crap about what they buy and that not every PC buyer has a friend who knows something about computers, but even considering that, I cannot say anything else. And the part where Dell emplyees can't put together a system that would work flawlessly when such an unknowing citizen buys such a box, well, that's no
    • And in the spirit of custom builts, Does anyone have a good link to a site that might select whole profiles of compatible computer parts for different kinds of systems with link to a pricewatch style website so you can pick and choose from compatible pieces? (mainly good recomendations as to motherboard/ram/processor combos)
    • Again, just eat up what you cooked.
      So I guess that if you buy some food and it turns out to be poisoned, it's your own fault?

  • Out of the box install.. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Chicane-UK ( 455253 ) <chicane-uk@ntlwor l d . c om> on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:07AM (#14289815) Homepage
    I don't know why it is that vendors insist on preloading so much crap on their machines when they ship them but it drives me crazy.

    We buy Toshiba laptops at my place of work and whenever we get a new one in, its preloaded with the Toshiba default build.. and its pretty awful! When you first fire it up you have to run the gauntlet of about 5-10 pop up windows from apps all letting you know that they are there and running. Cast a glance down to the system tray and there are about 11 or 12 memory resident apps all sitting there taking their cut of the memory and CPU time - one was a Toshiba app that basically takes over the Microsoft power management suite with a far more complex and convoluted piece of software!

    I don't understand it personally. Windows might grind the gears of plenty of people but these days its quite a sleek, easy to us OS - why must they insist on bundling all this crap on the machine which must surely confuse users, and give them so much more overhead in places that they don't even need it! Not to mention the quite obvious performance impact on the machine.

    I still prefer to make my own PC's - most recent build was for my girlfriend - a really nice Biostar IDEQ barebones box based on an AMD Sempron/NForce3 250 combo! It goes like a rocket, and there is no clutter and crapola on it! Other than Windows :P
    • I have the same issues with my Acer laptop: all sorts of crap preinstalled and some bizarre power management software installed that has an awful interface and frequently gets confused or forgets state. But then, given the bad hardware build quality, I wouldn't expect much more from Acer. I'm just hanging on for a Mactel here.
    • Here's what I think their reasoning is behind preinstalled crap - yes, its confusing. And they know that. They WANT it to be confusing so that when Soccer Mom Jane goes online to buy Little Johnny the gaming computer he asked for from Santa, she doesn't know that it's all worthless and assumes Dell is really giving her all this GREAT software for free!!! The same goes with all their other systems - all the crap is meant to make you think it comes with all this great stuff.

      Then theres also the fact that so

    • So that in 8-12 months when it's painfully slow to boot/run/etc... they decide they need a new computer.

      "This one's slow, it must be wearing out..."

      Don't think it hasn't been said...
      • Well, duh! I mean, when you consider all the junk that can get loaded onto a hard disk, is it any surprise that it spins slower and slower over time? Not to mention that the monitor can get tired of having to open up all those popup so quickly. Common sense, man!

    • I don't understand it personally.

      Blame the marketing 'droids. It's all about production differentiation. There's also a dose of "How do we justify how existence?" by the software engineering department at Dell.

      ---

      Paid marketers are the worst zealots.

    • Re:Out of the box install.. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by zerocool^ ( 112121 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @08:21AM (#14290243) Homepage Journal

      One of the worst offenders is freaking OEM's who feel the need to bundle their own wireless / 802.11x detection and attachment application. I mean, really. I love Linksys, but even they are guilty of providing this crap with their wireless add-in cards. But OEM laptops are the WORST. Whether it's intel's centrino or whoever, those apps are universally stupid. The Wireless zero configuration utility that's included with WinXPSP2 is excellent, stable, and integrated.

      Just brings me to another problem - Provide me with a goddamn driver. I want a DLL file which interfaces the API given to the OS and applications with the commands make the hardware function. That's IT. I'm looking at you, HP. I don't want a freaking systray app for NVidia, my onboard audio's "control deck", my printer (for ink management?), my wireless card, and every other goddamn thing in the computer - I don't want to know about it, I just want it to work!

      There are HP Drivers which are no joking 300MB downloads. What?!? 300MB? That's an OS, that's not a driver!

      ~Will

      • Re:Out of the box install.. (Score:4, Interesting)

        by Chicane-UK ( 455253 ) <chicane-uk@ntlwor l d . c om> on Monday December 19, 2005 @08:51AM (#14290384) Homepage
        I had to download the full software suite from HP recently for one of our Laserjet 1200 printers because of some HP Toolbox utility that would actually enable me to run a 'clean' command on the printer - evidently the regular drivers don't allow you to do that.

        The full download was not only a different, out of date set of drivers, but was also a full blown java based WEB SERVER install that bound itself to a local port and then fired up a web browser to access it. I'm at a loss to explain why this has to be done in such a way, and why that functionality can't just be built into the driver suite for Windows. The Java app was a huge download and it made the machine run like crap!

        Another award winning piece of software design there!

      • Re:Out of the box install.. (Score:4, Informative)

        by Slack3r78 ( 596506 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @11:16AM (#14291302) Homepage
        I'll agree with you whole-heartedly on HP drivers and general annoyance at unwanted extra apps.

        However the Wireless Connection Managers are a totally different story. XP's Wireless ZeroConf service is horrifically unstable. It'll drop connections at random, and everyone once in a while, will claim it's connected but not actually *do* anything. While I'm saavy enough to fire up services.msc and restart the service on machines that don't come with a third party connection manager, most users are not.

        For people like that, having a third party connection manager that actually works and doesn't mysteriously refuse to connect is far better for the average user than just having to resort to rebooting at random intervals to maintain connectivity.
    • I don't know why it is that vendors insist on preloading so much crap on their machines when they ship them....

      Because they're paid to ship the shovelware.

  • Dell Setup and no problems! (Score:5, Informative)

    by ami-in-hamburg ( 917802 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:10AM (#14289819)
    Step 1) Make your backup installation CD
    Step 2) Format your hard drive and install from scratch

    The backup CD, at least for me, is a full XP Pro installation CD without all the bundled software that comes on the pre-installed hard drive or the system recovery CD.

    And by the way, if you email support, they will send you an XP disc and a drivers disc (for your model) in the mail for free. It took about 3 days.

    Personally, I just wiped out the hard drive and installed Suse 10.

  • I bought someone one of these ... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by TallMatthew ( 919136 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:13AM (#14289830)
    ... and spent about a month answering the question: "What is this popping up on my screen all the time? Do I need to do something?"

    It's a nice machine but it took forever to clean up. These guys weren't exaggerating when they said it's bogged down with bloatware. No, I really don't want to sign up for AOL, use your personal firewall, browse the MusicMatch online store, purchase Quickbooks for a low low price, participate in your survey, buy a year's subscription of virus definitions, mow Michael Dell's lawn, tell Peter Norton my life story, yadda yadda yadda, ad nauseam. Really, I don't. No, I mean really. Really, goddamn it!

    It's pretty amazing that other software was prevented from installing correctly and performance was degraded to a considerable extent. The story implied that about 80MB of RAM was consumed by the bloatware, but the computer has 1GB RAM. Assumedly it's not chewing all the CPU, so what exactly is it doing that breaks The Sims, for example?

  • Buy a Playstation (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:21AM (#14289853)
    I never did understand this.
    Why do people spend $3k on a computer to play the Sims ?
    Can't you just by a $100 playstation to do this ?

    This is not sarcasm or any other kind of flamebait, but why is gaming on PC's so important ?
    Can't you get a $500 PC for random computer work and then a $100 playstation (or random game system) for games ?

    Just a question.
    • This is not sarcasm or any other kind of flamebait, but why is gaming on PC's so important ?
      Can't you get a $500 PC for random computer work and then a $100 playstation (or random game system) for games ?

      The kind of games I like are mostly not available for consoles. Non-linear RPGs, strategy games (real time and "classic"), adventure games (though these are almost gone unfortunately)...

    • Why do people spend $3k on a computer to play the Sims ?
      Can't you just by a $100 playstation to do this ?

      Hello, is it 1960's? Resolution 640x480 is calling!

    • an 100$ playstation can provide bucketloads of fun, but it would not be able to play Doom III in 1600x1200 in 60 FPS with x8 AA or Far Cry. These jaw-dropping gamea are PC exclusives only. And there are lots of other PC games with so much depth that Playstation owners can only dream about.

    • Re:Buy a Playstation (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Zathrus ( 232140 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @09:59AM (#14290765) Homepage
      Why do people spend $3k on a computer to play the Sims ?

      Because they're idiots.

      Can't you get a $500 PC for random computer work and then a $100 playstation (or random game system) for games ?

      Yeah, and I can also build a $600 PC that will blow the PS2 out of the water when it comes to graphics and seriously compete against (and sometimes surpass) the Xbox360.

      The real question is what games do you want to play, and that's what should influence your decision. If you like RTSs, MMORPGs, or FPSs then the PC is the only real option. For platformers, "RPGs" (e.g. -- Final Fantasy), and "party games" then consoles are where it's at. If you want to game online, then the PC is better, while gaming with a bunch of people in the same room is clearly the consoles' forte. There will always be platform-specific games (ala Civ4 for the PC, or Katamari Damarcy for the PS2), so that's also a consideration.

      BTW, the Sims on consoles is nowhere even close to the PC version. It's simply too stripped down, both in UI and graphics.

      The next generation consoles (Xbox360 and PS3) are going to really shrink the gap graphics-wise between the consoles and the PC, but they're still quite a bit less powerful. And unless they get serious about allowing keyboard/mouse input (as an option, obviously) then they'll still be deficient for a lot of game genres (MMO being the biggest).

  • What's the Bang for the Buck? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Quirk ( 36086 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:22AM (#14289854) Homepage Journal
    I assemble my own boxes because it's relaxing and I get to pick and choose my components. I get to go with Seagate drives that have never failed me and Viewsonic G or P series Crts, I've got the desktop realestate to go with crts and they give me the best results.

    So why buy a Dell? If you're going to wipe the drive and do an install from scratch you're losing any benefit from their install. If you're after a system for gaming wouldn't you want to build it yourself? Is it just the ~50 bucks saved?

    I've never owned or used a Dell so I don't know what the draw is other than the obvious of buying in bulk.

    • Re:What's the Bang for the Buck? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Sesticulus ( 544932 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @07:12AM (#14290078)
      Two reasons, price, support.

      Because last November I bought a dual Xeon 3 ghz with 3 year warranty for the same money it would cost to buy just the CPUs and OS from some place like newegg. So I got for free; memory, video, motherboard, optical drive, hard drive, + 3 year warranty, and didn't have to spend a few hours assembling it myself.

      If something goes wrong with it, I don't have to spend my time futzing with it, a guy shows up the next day with parts and fixes it. On one dell laptop when the power supply burned out, they shipped me a new one morning delivery, I had it before the batteries died. One coworker they sent a new laptop power supply when he just lost it, he had called to order a new one. You can't beat the support.

      Now the wife's game machine is a homegrown because it doesn't cost me money when it's down, but for my production machines I always buy Dell.

  • My XPS 400 (Score:2, Insightful)

    by EBFoxbat ( 897297 )
    I can't help it. I never bought a Dell, but with a new job I didn't have time to build a rig so I bought an XPS 400. Anyone with half a brain and some hardware knowledge knows you can't just remove Dell's included software. You just format the disk and install a new one from scratch. You are paying for an OS and hardwarem, but atleast in my case, I just wanted the hardware. Nuke the OS and start from scratch, it's a wonderful thing.

  • Any gamer that goes to Dell for a system IS a joke (Score:5, Funny)

    by brxndxn ( 461473 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:44AM (#14289894)
    If the Dimension XPS400 is any indication, Dell considers computer gamers a joke.

    Any gamer that goes to Dell for a computer IS a joke. It's like the audiophile that goes to Best Buy for all his HT needs. It's like grocery shopping at a 7-Eleven.. It's like calling Geek Squad for computer help. It's like going to McDonalds for a Caesar salad...

    It's like buying a TV at a grocery store. It's like wine in a box. It's like Bourbon made in California.. or Scotch made in Canada. It's like calling Will and Grace smart TV.

    It's like a house with wheels on it. It's like a hand-crank garage door opener. It's like glasses purchased at a book store. It's like going to Macy's for a PDA. It's like getting high on cigarettes.

    It's like rocking out to Madonna or being entertained by Bio Dome. It's like getting fashion advice from Paris Hilton. It's like getting religious advice from Tom Cruise.

    Well anyway.. I hope you get the point.

  • The reason for the software is money (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ytzombe ( 530215 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:51AM (#14289908) Homepage
    That bloatware crap on there is there for a very big reason, money. In the cut throat margin of the PC business, that bloatware crap gives money back to Dell to make some money off the system.

  • He makes good points, but he's wrong on "Autorun" (Score:5, Insightful)

    by tkrotchko ( 124118 ) * on Monday December 19, 2005 @05:53AM (#14289916) Homepage
    He says this to complain"

    "For example, our CD/DVD Autorun was disabled - or more accurately, "broken" - by Corel Photo Downloader. [...] After we clicked on "no thanks," the computer wouldn't go through the normal autorun process - we installed the games by clicking on My Computer"

    Yes, and Dell did you a favor, albeit by accident.

    You don't want Autorun enabled. If the Sony incident taught you nothing else, it should have taught you "AUTORUN==BAD".

  • I have an XPS Gen 2 (Score:4, Informative)

    by SB5 ( 165464 ) <freebirdpat@nOspAm.hotmail.com> on Monday December 19, 2005 @06:08AM (#14289953)
    I have an XPS Generation 2. Its 2 years old roughly. I'd place it Jan-Feb 04. Its a fairly good machine. The only problem I have had was my vid card fan, a 9800XT died on me, and was running idle at 77 degrees C, and the one time I caught it before it finally crapped out it was running 111 degrees C. I call Dell Support and got a woman with a very foreign accent, which made it difficult to understand and I had to repeat things, the other problem was I could not communicate my e-mail reliably, spelling it out to a computer would have been easier then the way the woman on the phone was interupting my letters. I tell the woman on the phone the problem with the card, how I tried to reseat it and check the power plug on the card. She reqs a new one(actually refurbished by my guess in the packaging but whatever it works). I get a few days ago, insert it works fine. All this time I got probably 2-3 calls above this to my cell phone which was definitely good communication, again the only problem was the lack of speaking English that wasn't in an American accent that I am used to. The only problem I had was they sent me an invoice, basically the price of the card in case I didn't send it back. The scary part is they aren't even charging the current market price, nor the price from 2 years ago, but some other weird price that comes to $600. So thats my Dell horror story with an XPS. The funny thing with 9800XT, is Dell put their oem bios on it, and it disabled the overdrive feature, pretty much the only reason to get an XT. Then you had to go to the support forums to find the flashrom for it.

    The only thing I think they could improve on is dust covers and easier access to the screens for the fans. removing all the drives to just clean the front grill is a pain. I did receive a few disks with plenty of software, and one definitely with windows on it. They have their own recovery software, its annoying, and I wish I had a WinXP Pro disk, or a WinXP Home disk for that matter. I blame Microsoft for that problem though, simply because they should be pushing it on people. When someone wants a computer fixed or whatever, I cant do it because if I have to reformat, or reinstall, it 10x easier instead of making another visit.

    I will say one thing, getting a Dell is a big waste of money, you can build one for much cheaper and it be better suited for you. The Reason I got mine though is the 4-5 year warranty
  • Don't get me wrong: I'm not an unabashed Linux fanboy. I wrestle with hardware compatability, video codec lameness, etc.

    But: once you get a Linux box up and running (for instance Debian or Ubuntu), you pretty much don't have any of the problems the author described.

    Perhaps more importantly: Free Linux distros can focus fully on what makes the user happy. They have no need for idiotic vendor lock-in tactics, buggy product tie-ins, or denying you access to the OS install disks, etc. It's simply a complete n
    • OK I use Linux and I accept your point, but looking ahead at if (*cough* when *cough*) Linux takes over from Windows in the OEM market or even has slightly equal footing do you think that things will be any different than they are now? Most probably, with the surpreme customisability of Linux things would be worse than the current situation buying a new computer with Windows on it. You'd still need a full reinstall to get things running again!
    • Blegh. Insightful?

      If they brought the system for gaming, why on earth would somebody go through the pain of installing linux? Not only has it proven to be inefficent/unusable as a desktop system, they're not going to be able to use the machine for its intended purpose of playing games.

      At the same time, I can play the role of zealot here and suggest buying a mac. Sure, you still won't be able to play any games, but you'll have all the advantages of linux without any of the pitfalls.

  • Channel partner hell (Score:3, Insightful)

    by HangingChad ( 677530 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @06:40AM (#14290007) Homepage
    The pre-installed programs that Dell chose to include on its computer were almost certainly the cause of all these problems, and unloading these programs from the boot-up routine fixed the problems.

    Dell does that to all their consumer level machines, one of the things that got me interested in building my own. I still remember the first time booting up a home built with an OEM OS disk, it was so clean. No AOL or other ISP's, no trialware and it booted so much faster.

    Guess I'm a little surprised some users would be willing to reinstall the OS to get rid of the junk Dell loads their machines with at the expense of your time.

    It costs a little more to build your own but you get such great components. And it doesn't come loaded with junkware.

    • Guess I'm a little surprised some users would be willing to reinstall the OS to get rid of the junk Dell loads their machines with at the expense of your time.

      At the expense of time? And building your own computer doesn't take longer?

  • hard disk backups are officially retarded (Score:4, Interesting)

    by akhomerun ( 893103 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @06:45AM (#14290015)
    forcing customers to use software preinstalled on their hard drive to burn their own backup discs is absolutely the worst policy ever. this is of course just one problem of this dell model, but so many companies are starting to do this, and they need to stop.

    most people who don't have a clue what they are doing won't even think to perform the important step of making a backup disc, and will only think about restore discs after their computer fails. then they are completely out of luck.

    i will never buy a PC from a manufacterer ever, except for apple. it's always a bad deal, anyone who takes the 1 hour of time to learn how to build their own computer will reap the benefits of overclocking, having a fresh, clean version of windows OEM edition for $80-$130, and having infinate customizability.

    as for notebooks, well, i just have to buy the least Dell-like brand availible. buying off-brands is actually strangely enough the best way to go in this age. and usually you end up getting the best deal and similar quality, since all the major manufacterers buy from the exact same Chinese suppliers that the smaller brands do.
  • We installed Windows XP Media Center Edition from the Windows Installation disc that we received from Dell. The computer would not let us delete the NTFS partition that contained our old Windows install, so we let the setup overwrite our Windows directory. The end result was a clean Windows install on a partition still cluttered with programs we neither wanted nor needed...

    We then tried to install Windows MCE by booting from the DVD-ROM instead of by rebooting from Windows. This time we were able to get Win

  • Most AV programs are annoying. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Shivetya ( 243324 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @07:08AM (#14290067) Homepage Journal
    and it is because of this very issue I know a few people who run without AV protection. Norton is the king of annoyances but some free solutions can be just as bad.

    The biggest annoyance is that these types of programs love to pop up windows and take focus from whatever application is in use regardless if that application was in full screen (usually games). Now if it was some notication of a hack/virus/etc it could be understood, but no, Norton and many AV programs will do this for simple updates! Hell even JAVA from Sun pops up a little floater above the task bar.

    Developers need to realize that many of us prefer to have the comfort of protection but without the annoyance factor. We do not need to know your updating. We do need to know if you cannot update. We don't need pop-ups that tell us updates are available, a simple tray icon is sufficient. Lastly never ever interrupt any full screen application unless the world is ending.

  • give me a break (Score:2, Informative)

    by Heembo ( 916647 )
    Damn, the first thing I do when I get a new dell is:
    start->control panel->add/remove programs and remove with wold abandon. I usually wipe "trial security package", all the dell quickset crap, any dell support crap, and any other software that I just don't want in there. Doesn't EVERYBODY? :)
  • The problems ranged from 'Delayed write failed' on one, to overheated hardware in another. The boxes are used for running Solidworks and UG mostly. We replaced them with some homegrown fx-55 boxes which are working so much better. Yes, they run linux also. Plan is to dual-boot to run Unigraphics and Novell desktop 9 on a trial basis. The boxes cost under $2k
  • I've never considered buying a Dell home/gaming PC, as there's plenty of competition in that area, and I usually find better and cheaper alternatives or simply build my own. However, for standard office workstations, the Dell kit is an absolute bargain. I've bought dozens of these machines over the years and have been very happy with them in terms of price, build & performance.

    I work as a consultant for many small to medium businesses, and I recommend Dell for workstations and small workgroup servers in

  • {H]ard OCP goes soft? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by DingerX ( 847589 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @08:05AM (#14290199) Journal
    You know, I appreciate [H]ard OCP's recent attempts at journalistic integrity, which has resulted in some curious editorializing. For example:

    Normally, we have arrangements with computer manufacturers marketing departments that allow us to purchase systems they offer anonymously, and then RMA the computers after the review is written and published. Currently, we do not have a similar agreement in place with Dell. Nevertheless, we felt it was important to take a look at what the largest manufacturer in North America offers during the holiday season when many people decide what gifts to get their family and friends, so we purchased this computer from Dell.

    Aside from the curiosity that they have someone listed as a "Grammatical (sic) and Spelling Editor -- whose duties evidently do not extend to punctuation (should be: manufacturers'), this passage translates as: "normally, we only review stuff we can get for free -- we paid for this one." I don't have a problem with the practice of reviewing Hardware from the retail perspective: indeed, for similar reasons and about the same time, Tom's Hardware has taken the same step. What's worrisome is the curious mix of the "Consumer Reports" style with an allusion to a failed negotiation with Dell's Marketing Department. Well, okay, maybe not an allusion: it is conceivable that nobody at [H]ard OCP tried to contact "the largest manufacturer in North America" for a "review copy" deal. It is conceivable, but not likely.

    So at the start of the review, the editors tell us that Dell "won't play ball", and they probably spent around $3000 in taxes and restocking fees. The review that follows, of course, will not reflect these facts.

    And the review that follows is a beauty: tearing into Dell for all those awful bundling practices they negotiate with third parties to bring the price down further, for not including a recovery diskette, then charging $11 for an OS CD, and having crappy customer support. Oh yeah, the system is unstable as Hell because, after running their "torture test" on the original setup -- with all the crap running., it crashed at the 24 hour mark. system restore.

    Then, at the end of the article, the editor steps in with the reason for all this:

    Another Point of View

    Editor's Note: The Dell XPS 400 stands in stark contrast to the other large, international OEM we have dealt with: Gateway.

    The Gateway FX400XL, like the XPS 400, is a system from a large and highly publicized OEM of personal computers, and it is aimed squarely at gamers and enthusiasts. However, unlike the Gateway FX400XL, our Dell XPS 400 was crippled with debilitating bloatware that severely impacted our enjoyment of the system. The Gateway FX400XL had some value added software that treaded near or in the realm of bloatware, but it certainly didn't stop us from installing games or enjoy playing them.

    For those of you that missed it, the Review [hardocp.com] in question evaluates a system a couple notches up in the performance category (but, one assumes, since Gateway's marketing dept. played ball, the journalistic budget didn't factor in). But even hardware differences aside, methodologically the two cases aren't comparable. As far as bloatware goes, the Gateway shipped not only with McAfee's antivirus (which the Dell review repeatedly cites as a nuisance and a cause of instability), but also Norton and BigFix. The drivers were not 3 months out of date like at Dell, but 8 months (to which the reviewer says: "Big deal? Not really" and proudly states he installed the latest driver immediately -- instead of, like the Dell review, going to try out games he knew wouldn't work). The Gateway had tons of toolbars and installed bloat. What did the reviewer do?:

    First Boot: First Shutdown I took the liberty of going into msconfig and looked at the startup list. Obviously, there's a lot of programs

    • Well, to give {H]ard OCP credit it was a different reviewer reviewing the Gateway and the Dell.

  • Dell's Legendary Admitted Lack of Engineers... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by sirwired ( 27582 ) on Monday December 19, 2005 @09:32AM (#14290605)
    Dell is Legendary in the PC/Low-end server industry for their almost complete lack of a product development staff. Indeed, they even pride themselves on not doing much actual design work themselves, and even boast about it in articles and press releases.

    Dell is a company of Marketing folks that somehow managed to hire some of the finest Manufacturing Engineeers and procurement managers on Earth. However, since they seem to make a $hit-load of dough doing exactly what they have been doing, the prospect of actually doing system development and testing, which would have caught most of those bugs in about five minutes, is completely anathema to their corporate culture.

    At Dell, OEM's do virtually all the product development. I suspect that with this system, they relied on the Motherboard OEM to certify that the hardware worked together, but they neglected to tell their (tiny) software staff to run additional testing on this software image. Dell likely just loaded the standard "Home" image on this system, which is likely identical to every other consumer desktop that Dell ships out the door.

    Bloatware is a regrettable reality for many Consumer PC's. However, to charge extra for a system market towards gamers and then not perform even the most perfunctory testing is pretty damn stupid.

    SirWired

  • just re-install (Score:3, Insightful)

    by tomstdenis ( 446163 ) <tomstdenis.gmail@com> on Monday December 19, 2005 @10:07AM (#14290806) Homepage
    I don't know what the problem is.

    My new dell laptop had like 15 programs in the taskbar on startup. Including McAfee which "really" wanted me to set it up [you can't just close the program]. I'd have a program popping up to tell me every 3 seconds.

    I first grabbed cpuid to make sure the system was what I ordered. Then I grabbed my windows cd and reinstalled. I hate windows but I really hate windows with two dozen startup programs to make my "experience better".

    All the players do this though, not just dell. It just seems Dell is the champ.

    Tom

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