User Created Content is Key for New Games 167
An anonymous reader writes to tell us that recently Valve Software's Doug Lombardi has stated his strong belief that user created content is a very important part of games in the near future. "'I would argue that it's the biggest component those guys have to get over if they want online to matter.' 'Half-Life 1 was okay as a multiplayer game and Team Fortress Classic was really good, but Counter-Strike kicked both their asses no question. And that came from a kid going to college in Canada and another kid going to high school in New Jersey, who had our code and thought it would be cool to play our game.'"
Just... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Just... (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't make a map of your school. Apparently that makes you a threat.
Or let's all make maps of schools, until officials realize they have better shit to do with taxpayers money than arrest map makers.
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Oh, even better! Let's make a 3D FPS that takes place only in faithfully reproduced official buildings and schools and encourage users to create maps of their own school and such. And host the project in Russia or something.
Re:Just... (Score:5, Funny)
Or is that taking it too far?
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http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/05/03/student_c
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Sword ownership rights have been under heavy fire since they were determined to be the leading cause of death during the Siege of Acre in the third crusade.
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I guess it's a good thing I never did.
One idea... (Score:5, Funny)
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I think ease of modding should definitely be high on any games priorities.
Re:One idea... (Score:4, Interesting)
Lugormod, a serverside mod for Jedi Academy allows admins to put any ingame content in "real time", without even a need for reloading the map. And that doesn't mean just adding bots or spawning npcs, but placing all kinds of models, triggers, tricky entities, spawners, vehicles, designing whole new worlds using good old Q3 enigne. Practically it turns server op into game dev.
Lugormod is IMO one of the best mods for any game ever made. And it's 99% serverside (a clientside plugin adds a few weapon models and cvars). Shame on LucasArts they discontinued the JK series.
User Created Weapon (Score:2)
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I created a jump that shot sparkles and aoe damage. Ok, so it was not a fair weapon, but the concept was interesting.
Too bad it relied on horrid peering to play.
User created content (Score:5, Funny)
Little Big Planet (Score:3, Interesting)
Absolutely amazing graphics, still remember the shock other people had when Sony unveiled this game at GDC. There were a hell of a lot of developers who went back home after GDC and realized how far behind their level editing tools and rendering engines were.
Can't wait for this to be released later this year.
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I didn't think developers would so easily and this early tap into the incredible parallel number crunching power of the PS3.
Ah, Sony shill. Right. Glad to see you're back after the Wii pounding.
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I've been to many GDCs over the years and I've seen many demos of new games or tech. There has never been a reaction to a game from developers like there was at GDC in all the years I have attended. Feel free to share with us what you think the structure of LBP's engine and specifically lighting model is in broad terms on the system. You clearly know more than most of the gaming world's best developers. Right?
Feel free to share with us some links that support your claim about how astonished the developers at GDC were when they saw LBP's graphics.
(Please note that LBP was the game that finally convinced me to buy a PS3. I think it's one of the most awesome games I've ever seen. I just don't think the graphics are what makes the game good. The graphics are neat, but nothing we haven't seen in other games)
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Dude, you need to work on your reading comprehension. Try reading this thread from the beginning. Anonymous Sony Fanboy says:
FU! (Score:2)
What the hell is your problem? I said "I think it's one of the most awesome games I've ever seen" and that it convinced me to shell out 900 CHF for a damn console without games. What more praise could I possibly heap on the game? Now put the fuck up and tell me what developers thought the graphics of the game was so awesome! Links. Thank you.
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Duh (Score:4, Insightful)
I am glad that companies are starting to think about this stuff though. It would be nice if more games had good mod kits when they are released.
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Screw Quake (Score:2)
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Slow News Day Indeed (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm pretty sure we've all known that without a massive potential for replayability in the original title, the only thing that keeps a game alive long term is the user created interactions and content (barring companies that keep ongoing updates and patch, like Cavedog did with TA back in the day [although that also had user created content]).
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The gameplay is second to none.
Plus with a Dual Core processor we can finally hit the 5,000 unit mark and just swarm our enemies with Peewees.
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It's not an "objects" kind of content it is however an "intelligent entity" kind of content.
My point here is that there are alreayd plenty of games out there relying on users to provide entertainment and replayability for other users. If you can get some users to also contribute with new or improved game objects, that's just icing on the cake.
Several Types of Mods (Score:2, Informative)
Just now? (Score:5, Insightful)
Point being, user-generated content has always been a big part of all the best PC games; FPS's, Strategy games, you name it. When users can mod the game, they become attached to it and it develops a much more cohesive and less fickle user-base and expands the longevity of the product.
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Seriously, doesn't anyone remember Quake and QuakeC? CTF (original and thunderwalker), the real Team Fortress, tons of other crap. Anyone playing FPS games 11 years ago knew all of this already.
Speaking of CS (Score:3, Interesting)
If Valve wants user input so badly, when why didn't they listen to their users of CS 1.6 then? Valve was retarded and decided to put in-game ads into CS 1.6, and they don't fully support it any longer.
It sounds like they want the users to give them the good ideas to build the game off of so they can sell more copies. I don't think that most users want to give their work away to Valve for nothing. They'd rather give it to the gaming community as a whole for use. Maybe Valve should truly accecpt input from users and have a set price they pay out to those who submit ideas that are actually used. Wait, nevermind... they could change the ideas just enough to claim originality and then not pay.
Sounds like the user-created aftermarket is still the best alternative.
Re:Speaking of CS (Score:5, Insightful)
If you want to be pissed at Valve about something, please at least pick a topic where Valve isn't one of the leaders of the pack on. I don't know of any other game companies that you can speak of that have sheparded their mod community as much as Valve has.
Re:Speaking of CS (Score:5, Interesting)
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P.
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And I've heard they've basically done the same thing with the Narbacular Drop group - they liked what they saw, they hired them, and said "instead of silly quake-1 era graphics, do that with our engine, and we'll call it Portal and release it with Episode Two".
God, I can't wait. Seriously, I'm buying Episode Two just for Portal. It's the first FPS I've looked forward to in ages.
~W
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Going Out On a Limb Here... (Score:5, Insightful)
If that content comes from users, great. If it comes from paid professionals, great.
What a great idea (Score:1)
experience the content first, perhaps gaining "levels" or "experience" (stay with me
here, I know it's crazy) and when just for instance the users gain the topmost
level they could extend the game for others. I'd call it the Multiple User Dimension.
It would be awesome.
If you really want to go crazy, you could let people have a graphical interface and exchange
in-game goods for user created content on standard templates.
How SWEET would it be... (Score:1)
Consoles vs PC's (Score:3, Interesting)
As the cost of computers came down more and more people have bought computers and we constantly see quotes concerning the increase of households that have 1+ computers I have no idea if the original Nintendo had more market penetration than lets say Play Station 2. Has the console market grown or shrunk over the last 20 years? I assume it has grown but is its rate exponentially larger than the PC market, about the same or far smaller? Are the amount of game titles being released increasing or decreasing? Basically there has really been nothing in the console market to hold my interest in its welfare with the exception of "God of War" but I am not going to pay hundreds of dollars to play just one title.
The customization available in PC games IMHO makes them a much better and barely more expensive platform. In addition you can actually use your computer for other important stuff "Like surfing Porn".
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The PSP and PS3 have bult in web browsers. The Wii has one available for download via the Nintendo store built into the machine.
Linux can be installed on the PS2 and PS3, and it's an officially supported function.
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SOCOM?
Final Fantasy XI?
Everquest Online Adventures Frontiers?
Star Wars Battlefront?
Only the shortest of console game can be beat in a few days. I take it you don't play RPG's?
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I could have thrown in some of the longer non-online RPG's, especially those with tons of optional quests/items/characters that take tons of time to complete if you're a completist.
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Animal Crossing? (Score:2)
Well, Sherlock... (Score:1)
Of course it's good (Score:1)
And then there's games like the in-development Pirates of the Burning Sea [burningsea.com] which actually has an entire system set up for the creation of user created content, run mostly by the users themselves. There's a whole bunch of ships that the users have made that have been put in the official game. The whole idea of the playerbase being connected
Reminds me of a Pakistani joke (Score:2, Interesting)
If each player modifies a multiplayer game so much who
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I said the same thing 10 years ago (Score:3, Interesting)
The industry focused on the graphics (which were remarkable for the day), and the format (FPS) thinking that those were the keys to popularity, and neglected customizability.
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Creating boards for Lode Runner was easy. Creating boards for Arkanoid II: Revenge of Doh was easy. Creating and texturing BSP trees for Doom was...something other than easy.
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That is of course, assuming you still care for level editing.
Multiplayer (Score:2)
MIDI(\)Maze (Score:2)
I perfer TFC (Score:2)
Maybe I just perfer capture the flag than 3 minutes of creeping around. But I don't think CS and TFC are ccomparable on equal terms as they are like chalk and cheese.
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Starcraft (Score:2, Insightful)
Console games. Console! (Score:5, Insightful)
The submitter left out a very important word in his summary. This article is about console games. The first sentence in the article is:
He's saying that consoles are way behind general purpose computers in online play. One of the big advantages that computers have always had is customizability and user-generated maps and mods. The online experience of consoles will remain a poor shadow of the computer game ecosystem until they enable and allow the players to share in the extension of their games.
This is a big reason why I haven't bought a full-size console since the Atari 2600. Two years after I got the Atari I also got a Texas Instruments 99/4A. I loved the ability to do wild things like save games, download levels from online bulletin boards, and even program simple games myself. Nowadays I enjoy playing Use Map Settings games in Starcraft and have created several maps of my own. That game is ten years old but still megafun due to the user-generated maps.
AlpineR
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That game is ten years old but still megafun due to the user-generated maps.
And why would they want to encourage continued use of ten-year-old product?
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All joking aside, I am more apt to buy games that I know traditionally have tons of user-created content. Neverwinter nights 2, Half-life 2, Counter-strike:Source and Unreal Tournament 2k4 are all games I bought knowing that I will have no shortage of game to play should I ever tire of their high quality primary content.
Repurchases (Score:2)
There are certainly ways to make money off of a ten-year-old game. For one thing, I've bought Starcraft three times in those ten years: once when it was first released for the PC, again when I got a Mac and realized that my first copy was too old to be a hybrid disc, and a third time to run it on a second computer for testing my multiplayer maps.
Also, online Starcraft is played through Battle.net which has banner ads on the chat and game-forming screens. As long as players keep playing they can keep sel
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Because in the mentality of Microsoft execs (and of course many others), not charging $10 for a map is like losing $10. Even if they don't need to because they already made significant profit off your original purchase. It's not just about making money, it's about making maximal money, and a the lack of a hypothetical gain equals a loss.
Neverwinter Nights (Score:2, Interesting)
The ability of users to create custom content (in addition to the three-platform releases) was a huge key to Neverwinter Nights's success.
While the official campaigns were great, all the longtime NWN players I know have spent countless hours playing on user-created and -hosted persistent worlds and user-created campaigns from places like The Vault [ign.com]. I can't think of many other games that are still being bought and played this long after their releases, and the ones that are probably fall into this categ
Whirled (Score:3, Interesting)
Canada+NewJersey (Score:5, Funny)
Haha. He says that as if being from Canada or New Jersey is akin to being in the special olympics or something.
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I take it you've never been to New Jersey.
No kidding. (Score:2)
"Unpaid labor making product for you to sell can help your bottom line."
I don't think that's entirely revolutionary.
Nor is it a criticism, either of the sentiment or the fact of it. User-generated content is a fantastic way to give a game legs. I've played lots of it, dabbled in making it (not very well), and am all for games including the tools necessary to foster it. Especially on consoles, which are so far behind PCs in this regard they're n
SWG (Score:4, Insightful)
Designing maps for a FPS, that is good.
Designing mods to extend a game, that is good.
Not providing anything to do except have 'users create their own content' is bad.
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SWG had many other issues that have kept it from really becoming a hit. The number of locations you could travel was much less than you were promised. It wasnt until like 2 paid for add-ons before you could get a space ship. Duh, shouldnt that have been something in the base game? And then they nerfed everything and at the one year mark suddenly made it easy as hell to get a force character, just make one... That was a major FU to the people that paid and played the first
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The difference in SWG (when I played, before the first expansion and expansion beta) and Second Life is scale. Second Life is limitless in what you can do (from the reports, I haven't tried it). SWG was very limited. In SWG your content was limited to building a city, business/economics and PVP. There wasn't much else to do.
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I think that either you need a relatively unstructured game with an equally unstructured skill system, or you need a more structured game with a more structured skill system. Putting an unstructured game together with a structured skill system is a reci
Immersive storylines from player content (Score:2)
The problem is that stories are a *re-telling* of p
Never happen (Score:3, Informative)
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I foresee a battle in the future between those companies who take the, charge extra for everything' approach and the 'give customers loads of goodies to create their own content' approach. Likely there will be no winner, but a
Game companies need to share the wealth (Score:5, Insightful)
We asked (Score:5, Funny)
XBOX360: Well, hot detailed graphics are definitely a key.
PS3 [looks in question list]: Hey! That's my line, you jerk! Anyway.. Blue Ray's a key too. You can make bigger games on Blue Ray to fit all the hot graphics, so I can have hotter graphics than any of you guys.
Wii and XBOX360: Yea.. Sure.. [chuckling].
XBOX360: Micro-transactions are a key as well. We sell gamers crippled games, and make them pay to buy assets. It's kinda like Scientology: by the time you understand it's all a bunch of bull, you've already paid, so you gotta keep playing and paying. Aaa.. and... and.. it also makes gaming more engaging, and bitter, just like real life is.
PS3: User content is also key. You allow the gamers to create anything they want in a game, guns, cars, roads... Wait.. this kinda doesn't fly with transactions...
XBOX360: Shhhh... damn it! Another key is online gameplay. I integrate all games with consistent online experience, which builds a great community of gamers.
PS3: Me too!
XBOX360: You too what?
PS3: I build a clone of your service by integrating a clone of Second Life in my clone exp.. I mean core experience.
XBOX360: Oh.. right...
Wii: A key in new games, and old games, is fun an inventive gameplay, you guys. You shouldn't forget that.
XBOX360 and PS3: Hahahaha. Idiot...
Wii: And new fun ways to interface with game with innovative sensor controller!
XBOX360: Hahahaha, you're making our day, Wii.
PS3: [hides the 6-axis controller behind his back] Hu-hu-hu
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Near future? (Score:2)
In the near future? User created content has been important for quite some time. Maybe before big-name games first started linking to mod sites from their homepages, and bundling some of the best user-created content in expansion packs, this could qualify as a bold prediction. But now? Come on.
Mods vs. Second Life (Score:2)
But the phrase "user-created content" for some reason doesn't make me picture in my mind mods. It makes me think of "games" like Sec
I think Valve is a little confused... (Score:2)
On one hand you had things like the SDK, all this great code laying right there for you to learn with and make your mod happen. On the other-hand you have all this code in C++ and on the mod forums you'd find 'conceptual' and artistic types begging for a programmer. A lot of modders are much more hobbyist then programmer and things like C++ scare the hell out of them. A lot of mods can be scripted, and while you can undoubtedly do a lot more with raw code
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I worked on a HL1 mod (Uncrossable Parallel, the code is still out there) and stuck in a load of changes, one of the more subtle-but-effective ones was moving the footstep sound code client side, expanding the scope but slimlining the overhead of the materials detection that went with that and syncing it to the model animations. Plus i added a 3rd person death
Ah Garrys Mod... (Score:2)
The core team for HL2CTF had a good deal of experience, they didn't pull the long wait and I can explain to you *why* so many
The lead programmer for the HL2CTF mod was experienced, in fact last time we spoke he was working for SOE programming for console based game
Ensure polished player-made content. (Score:2)
As much as I think mods are a great thing for games I tend to have a problem with developers relying on player-created content. I'd much rather
What about game companies after the Matrix? (Score:2)
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It's already happened. To my knowledge, Blizzard has released exactly 2 maps for Warcraft III ("Blizzard TD" and "Bomber Command").
Meanwhile, 3rd party mapmakers have released hundreds of maps. "Battleships" has dozens of spin-offs. "Tank Wars," dozens of spin-offs. And so on.
Ever heard of a "TD" (tower defense)? These
Carmageddon... (Score:2)
By the time SCi began development on Carmageddon: The Death Race, those who had worked on mods to the
Nobody has mentioned Bohemia Interactive yet? (Score:2)
Operation Flashpoint's true successor, Armed Assault, was released in Europe in November or December.
But wait! (Score:2)
But... What happens if the game companies start trying to profit off of it? Perhaps forcing modders to turn in their ideas for 'approval' and resell them. Personally, I am only responsible for making a few Warcraft II and CivIV/III maps that all pretty much suck.