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PlayStation (Games)

'PS5 Pro Signposts a Disc-Less Future That Few Actually Want' (gamesindustry.biz) 91

From an opinion piece on GamesIndustry.biz about the recently launched PS5 Pro that went on sale this week: What I'd argue is actually more interesting about PS5 Pro in a wider perspective isn't what Sony has done to the chips in the system -- it's what they've chosen not to include, and what it tells us about the decision-making process that's likely occurring for the company's future hardware. PS5 Pro doesn't have a disc drive. Anyone who wants to play disc-based games on the system will need to buy one of the add-on drives Sony started selling when the PS5 Slim model was released, adding further to the cost of the already very expensive device.

To add insult to injury, Sony doesn't seem to have made any effort whatsoever to ensure that those drives are actually well-stocked for the launch of the Pro. I can only speak directly to the situation in Japan, where they've been out of stock at most major retailers for months and even second-hand units are being sold at three to four times SRP by scalpers. But asking around suggests that the situation isn't much better in other regions. That's a very rough welcome to PS5 Pro ownership for anyone upgrading who has a collection of games on disc.

It's possible, of course, that Sony excluded the drive simply because its cost would push the Pro's price tag even higher. However, the incongruity of Sony's "Pro" console lacking the basic ability to play the games Sony sells at retailers all around the world is striking, and it's difficult to see the decision to accept that incongruity -- and the inconvenience it would inevitably cause for customers -- as anything other than strategic.

Digital sales make up a bigger and bigger portion of the industry's revenues every year, but physical game sales are still a very big deal -- and physical games are products that fall outside the control of publishers and platform holders in a way that they have found increasingly irritating in recent years. People who buy physical games can sell them second-hand or lend them to their friends, retailers with physical games in stock can discount them or include them in bundles as they see fit.

'PS5 Pro Signposts a Disc-Less Future That Few Actually Want'

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  • I'm totally fine with disc-less. I have a PS5 with the disc drive, and while I've used it for a couple games, I far prefer digital downloads. They can be acquired from my couch and with a 100Gig connection, they download quick and easily. No clutter around the house, nothing to throw in the landfill, no getting up and inserting a disc every time I want to play, no noise of the disc spinning. Totally down with disc-less.

    • by kriston ( 7886 )

      You have a 100Gig connection?!

      Must be nice.

      • by Bert64 ( 520050 )

        Especially since the PS5 only has 1 gigabit ethernet, and the pro has wifi7 which *might* be a bit faster under ideal conditions, but in real world scenarios generally won't be, and won't be anywhere close to 100gbps in any case.

    • by Calydor ( 739835 )

      Newsflash: Your net connection is in the top 5% if not 1% of the world.

      • by WankerWeasel ( 875277 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:32PM (#64930947)

        Newsflash: I'm well aware.

        Newsflash: even when you buy the disc you still have to download tens, if not hundreds of gigs, of game data nearly the same as buying the digital copy.

      • by Bert64 ( 520050 )

        Yes most users will have a much worse experience downloading games...
        I have 1gbps fibre here, but sony don't support IPv6 and legacy IPv4 traffic goes through CGNAT which slows things down massively at peak times. I can get 1gbps downloads over IPv6 day or night, but less than half that over IPv4.

        A lot of users will also be using wireless, so things could be massively slower still due to congestion and interference. In the apartment building here i can get around 600mbps using wifi6 when in the same room as

  • I was too lazy to deal with disks all the way back on the Wii (I almost always ended up playing the little download games rather than dealing with the disks).

    I understand that there are people that like the permanence of disks, and it'll be a shame in 10 years when the games are lost forever, but I imagine the typical user prefers diskless.

    • by PPH ( 736903 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:25PM (#64930929)

      I understand that there are people that like the permanence of disks,

      It's not about what you want anymore. The days of "the customer is always right" are long dead. You will be told what you will use.

      You will own nothing and be happy.

      • by AvitarX ( 172628 )

        It's not so much the lack of ownership that bothers me.

        I'm happy to rent things.

        I'm more concerned about stuff becoming lost to time. There's too many movies and games not available to rent on any platform, and with the death of physical media they'll be lost forever going forward.

        • Much like broadcast tapes of TV shows before the advent of VCRs, many things were lost to time and the consumer is the one who cares more about preserving it.

      • When was the customer ever right in any industry?

      • and be happy

        That's all most gamers want, anyway. Good that they're including it in the programming.

      • The customer was never always right. There are always different people with different needs or desires. You can't cater to everyone. I know that upsets some Karens but the reality is outside of the service industry you have always had the exclusive option of receiving what was on offer or taking your business elsewhere. That's how products work.

      • I may be in the minority, but my philosophy is, "I will own nothing, because I don't care anymore and don't bother."

        I'd be nice if more people had enough spine to boycott all this bullshit, but apparently, people really are happy to own nothing. Sad.

    • Certainly I was too lazy too. I ripped the games to an external USB and used a launcher. But my disc drive is still pristine and I still own a copy even if the original Wii dies and Nintendo no longer supports it.

      I love replaying older games and I'm not going to constantly re-buy them to do it.

      • by AvitarX ( 172628 )

        I purchased the legendary of Zelda 4 times.

        1) NES
        2) pre order wind waker (the main reason i pre ordered it was it came with the legend of Zelda and orcana of time if you did)
        3) on the Wii (the convenience was worth $7 to me)
        4) the game and watch

        I honestly don't mind paying a few bucks to rebuy old content. I'm sort of upset I can't really buy some Dreamcast games I want, even though I can hook up my old Dreamcast if I really want to

  • by Voyager529 ( 1363959 ) <voyager529@yahoo. c o m> on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:13PM (#64930895)

    To paraphrase Agent Smith: "What good is a disc drive, if games demand connectivity?"

    The bigger issue is that very few games will allow a player to have a completely offline experience. Insert disc > copy to drive > play game. Not every game will work this way, of course, but this experience is becoming incredibly rare. Yes, there is incentive to have an internet connection; multiplayer gaming being one such reason, DLC and MMO/Live Service games being others...but the absence of the disc drive isn't the cause of the issues, it's a symptom of the trajectory of gaming.

    • To paraphrase Agent Smith: "What good is a disc drive, if games demand connectivity?"

      Playing old games from earlier machines -backward compatibility with the older device versions used to be built in as standard (either via emulation or as a system-on-a-chip).

      Playing movies on BR/DVD. They may not be the new & popular thing anymore, but there are a ton of them floating around out there super cheap -including things that are not available streaming.

    • by e3m4n ( 947977 )

      UltraHD Bluray. Think you missed that point. Dont want or need yet another component taking up more wall space.

      • UltraHD Bluray. Think you missed that point. Dont want or need yet another component taking up more wall space.

        Yes this for me is a huge reason for getting a PS5 to begin with, and the lack of an internal drive (along with the price) means the PS5 Pro is an absolute non-starter for me.

        Yes you can get an external drive but like you said, I don't want another component I just want it all in one.

  • by blahbooboo2 ( 602610 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:22PM (#64930917)

    How many folks actually prefer a disc when the disc is just an unlock key to access the game after you download it anyway?

    Allow folks to re-sell their digital downloaded games (and even movies/TVs) and discs would disappear at even a faster pace.

    • by Powercntrl ( 458442 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:40PM (#64930971) Homepage

      This.

      These days discs are nothing more than a shiny dongle to prove you paid for a license, and having the license no longer associated with a tangible object that can be resold is the actual problem. Unfortunately, it will probably take a law to force online software marketplaces to allow you to re-assign your purchases to someone else, since they love the idea that they've found a loophole to first sale doctrine.

    • Sure.

      On the other hand, I have a shelf full of PS4 and PS5 games that I would like to continue to play.

      • On the other hand, I have a shelf full of PS4 and PS5 games that I would like to continue to play.

        It seems like anybody in this situation already has a machine that can play those disks, though.

        So they can just keep it, and keep using their disks? Even if they buy the new machine.

        I doubt "guy who lives in a closet with a ginormous collection of physical games and has to sleep in his gaming chair" makes it into their marketing profiles.

        • by tepples ( 727027 )

          It seems like anybody in this situation already has a machine that can play those disks, though.

          It's about ability to replace the machine that can play those discs, once it stops playing those discs, with a new compatible machine.

          • So a company that made cassette players shouldn't ever make CD players unless they include a cassette deck?

            Pretty weak argument.

            Did you really not read what I wrote? Do you realize that I addressed your point, and you replied to argue it anyway? Are you really living in a closet with a ginormous collection of physical games and sleeping in your gaming chair? No? Then keep your old device, and take care of it. And if it breaks, but a used one to replace it. There is no problem here.

    • by e3m4n ( 947977 )

      Guess you like to watch UltraHD movies at an inferior streaming bitrate than what is available on disc.

      • Like isn't the correct word, the vast majority are satisfied streaming quality is good enough. Convenience for a bit lower quality is acceptable (same reason CDs died even though music is re-listened too more than videos). Filling up your house with disks is not worth it to most, and the market has spoken.
        Cheer up, you can feel superior looking down on everyone else from your mountain of disks you sit on!

        • by e3m4n ( 947977 )

          Then why did you buy a 4k tv in the first place? The bitrate of 4k streaming is lower than the bitrate of Blu-ray 1080p straight off the disc. Shit I get better streams from makemkv on 1080p blu-ray and a very high bitrate H.265 using handbrake that look superior being upscaled by my 4k TV than most actual 4k streams online. And that quality is still lower than an actual UltraHD blu-ray disc. If youre going by the argument of “good enough” then stop buying 4k tvs and stop buying super high end v

  • but you can resell them or loan them out. You can't do that with digital only. That is important to a lot of people that resell their old games to help pay for new ones.
  • When it comes to games, I much prefer to the purely digital route. However, I totally understand why physical copies are necessary.

    Some people - a lot of people if you're in the US - have really crappy internet connections, and probably a monthly data cap to make it even worse. For them, a physical copy is almost a must. But it also begs the question, why is an internet connection all but a must for consoles? Even with a physical copy, a lot of games need to download various assets (not talking patches h
    • What if it turns out the US is actually the worlds biggest market for digitally-delivered games? Wouldn't that blow a hole in your thesis?

      Then there's the game preservation aspect.

      That's not a perspective that even exists for the company selling consoles, though, so it's only good for yelling at the clouds. Finding a reason for that is low-hanging fruit these days.

  • by devslash0 ( 4203435 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:44PM (#64930989)

    Sharing, lending, exchanging. They l know what they're doing and they're doing it for money and money only. Any game shared is a lost sales opportunity.

  • by Guyle ( 79593 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @12:46PM (#64930993)
    Take away physical media and now consoles join what's already standard in the PC gaming market: you don't own anything anymore, you just have a license to play the game. Of course console manufacturers want to do the same thing. More money for them if they go digital download only and make people buy games again if the console is sold or given to someone else without the PlayStation account used to purchase the games.
    • you don't own anything anymore

      I'm okay with this. Entertainment is fleeting. It's not something that needs to be owned, it's something to be consumed and is readily available. I literally an hour ago went to sit down at my computer to play a round of No Man's Sky, saw that an update was queued, and decided to play something else instead. I was still entertained which is the ultimate goal of gaming.

      It's a completely fungible process for anything but the most diehard gaming fans - the kind who can only ever enjoy one game and whose life w

      • by Anonymous Coward

        This may come as a surprise to you, but not everyone feels the same way. Most people, in fact, disagree with your whole "bend over and take it from our corporate masters, we must consume consume consume" philosophy.

        It's not just about entertaining people like you who constantly need keys dangled in front of them because they don't have enough to occupy their starving brains. It's about preserving our cultural and our history. These things matter, a fact your smooth brain can't possibly comprehend.

        • Why would that come as a surprise to me? I literally mentioned in my post that there are edge cases?

          Most people, in fact, disagree

          I'm sure you can provide a link to a study on the topic? I won't wait though because you're speaking out of your arse.

          bend over and take it from our corporate masters, we must consume consume consume

          Congrats, you didn't understand my post in the slightest.

    • Oh trust me, just because you have a disc, doesn't mean you own it.

  • I reckon it's this need to control everything for their own benefit regardless of the effects on their customers that drives customers to piracy. Why put up with all that shit when it's less hassle to get hold of a pirate copy?
  • by TheMiddleRoad ( 1153113 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @01:10PM (#64931065)

    Even if you buy a disc, the code is what matters. ALL the data on the disc, one installed, gets replaced when you update. Discs are utterly pointless for games. The only nice thing a disc player does it let you play blurays, and who the fuck does that anymore? I haven't loaded a disc into my bluray players in literally years.

    • No point buying the disk anymore...but if you own older games on disc, it's nice to still be able to play them. And personally, I don't own a Blu Ray player, and I like having the ability to play one using my console. Author overstates the importance, but all thing being equal, it's prefereable for physical disks to be an option, as it was for the standard PS5.

      • So you'll need to keep your old console, so that you can play them, and having less used consoles on the market also benefits console makers.

  • by iAmWaySmarterThanYou ( 10095012 ) on Friday November 08, 2024 @01:28PM (#64931155)

    1) I have an early ps5. Works great. The idea of dropping another $700 or so to get somewhat better graphics in a limited set of games does not appeal. Anyone who didn't buy a regular ps5 by now is not going to run out there for a pro version. They will sell some units but it won't be a huge rush.

    2) I bought the disk version of ps5 because I figured I'd want to own physical media, etc, etc. The reality is I bought a single disk game very early on but that was it. Complete waste of money. YMMV, but there's nothing wrong with all the no media cloud-only shit for most people. Yes, yes, I know I don't really own it and all that and can't resell it, yards yadda. I never would have resold disks if I bought them all, either. From th4 comfort of my couch, my lazy ass can switch games all day long without ever having to get up to fuck around with a disk library and swapping and blah blah blah. Did that with earlier systems. I'll pass, thanks. The other thing about digital purchase is it's a lot easier to do things like fast sales and free add-on packs and whatever that'll never happen on a disk sale. I've bought a ton of shit that's still full price in the stores near me but went on big sale on Sony's game store.

    Bought an extra ssd and the higher end controller which is actually pretty awesome compared to the regular one, and a stand to hold it vertical safely. That's it. Done with ps5 hardware purchases. Waiting to ps6.

  • i maybe the only one that uses the ps5 for uhd video as well. i guess i will hold on to it as long as possible

  • I sure do. I hate buying disks. I'd much rather download the game digitally.

    What I want is the ability to share or sell that game when I am done with it. That has zero to do with physical media. That's paradigm shift in digital goods sales that needs to be changed.

  • Granted, disks aren't "ownership of the IP" but at least with non-DRM'd disks (and DRM'd disks that aren't tied to an account or device) you can sell your copy like a book, or should I say, like a copy-protected Blu-Ray movie disc.

    That, plus good disk packaging looks nice on the bookshelf/display case.

  • The lack of second-sale support is unfortunate, but fumbling around for physical media when we want to play games, or even worrying whether the physical media might be scratched and how to get patches for it are good reasons to ditch physical media.

    • The reason I fell out with Steam was forced patching. Developers don't just fix bugs, they replace content to suit whatever agenda they've got going at at the time. Whether that's adding crappy launchers or new DRM or changing the engine to a "definitive edition" that offers no benefits and breaks all your mods, it's amazing how many times I wish I could just use the physical one instead of weighing up finding a pirate copy of the last known good edition.

      At the risk of speaking for you I'm guessing you don'

      • by Improv ( 2467 )

        Nah, I play a lot of videogames. Although "a lot" means that I have the option of just switching to another game; my steam and epic libraries combined are quite large and I have a lot of games I'm excited about and bought but haven't started on yet. So there's a bit of that.

        The idea that games on disc let you easily manage versions is unfortunately not that workable - unless you see it as enough choice to pick between either 1.0 or the current edition of the game, you're still probably not going to have a c

  • If it has to be connected to the Internet and I can't install games outside of the "cloud". With many games basically unplayable while offline.
    Then is this a game console or a rather expensive set top box? But with a rather unreliable ethernet jack compared to just about every other set top box.

  • Discs create a possibility for a secondary market. Completely online games assure that there's only one market, and that is the publisher's to gain from alone.
    I like secondary markets. I think buying used junk for less than the retail price is fun. On the Switch I buy a game and play it, and there it is always. The shelf is infinitely wide. I don't run out of shelf space and my house doesn't get more cluttered, no additional plastic enters the system. Digital purchases are fine. There was a place called Gam

  • Buying a AAA title on disc for PS5 does nothing for you if:

    1). The game needs a connection to the publisher's servers and/or Sony online services to run
    2). The game requires a Day 1 patch to not be a broken mess

    The publisher can kill the servers, making the client software useless. Or even if they don't, having an unpatched copy of the game on disc for archival purposes does you no good. You'll want the game installed on the console, fully patched and with all DLC/goodies installed that came with your cop

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