'PS5 Pro Signposts a Disc-Less Future That Few Actually Want' (gamesindustry.biz) 60
From an opinion piece on GamesIndustry.biz about the recently launched PS5 Pro that went on sale this week: What I'd argue is actually more interesting about PS5 Pro in a wider perspective isn't what Sony has done to the chips in the system -- it's what they've chosen not to include, and what it tells us about the decision-making process that's likely occurring for the company's future hardware. PS5 Pro doesn't have a disc drive. Anyone who wants to play disc-based games on the system will need to buy one of the add-on drives Sony started selling when the PS5 Slim model was released, adding further to the cost of the already very expensive device.
To add insult to injury, Sony doesn't seem to have made any effort whatsoever to ensure that those drives are actually well-stocked for the launch of the Pro. I can only speak directly to the situation in Japan, where they've been out of stock at most major retailers for months and even second-hand units are being sold at three to four times SRP by scalpers. But asking around suggests that the situation isn't much better in other regions. That's a very rough welcome to PS5 Pro ownership for anyone upgrading who has a collection of games on disc.
It's possible, of course, that Sony excluded the drive simply because its cost would push the Pro's price tag even higher. However, the incongruity of Sony's "Pro" console lacking the basic ability to play the games Sony sells at retailers all around the world is striking, and it's difficult to see the decision to accept that incongruity -- and the inconvenience it would inevitably cause for customers -- as anything other than strategic.
Digital sales make up a bigger and bigger portion of the industry's revenues every year, but physical game sales are still a very big deal -- and physical games are products that fall outside the control of publishers and platform holders in a way that they have found increasingly irritating in recent years. People who buy physical games can sell them second-hand or lend them to their friends, retailers with physical games in stock can discount them or include them in bundles as they see fit.
To add insult to injury, Sony doesn't seem to have made any effort whatsoever to ensure that those drives are actually well-stocked for the launch of the Pro. I can only speak directly to the situation in Japan, where they've been out of stock at most major retailers for months and even second-hand units are being sold at three to four times SRP by scalpers. But asking around suggests that the situation isn't much better in other regions. That's a very rough welcome to PS5 Pro ownership for anyone upgrading who has a collection of games on disc.
It's possible, of course, that Sony excluded the drive simply because its cost would push the Pro's price tag even higher. However, the incongruity of Sony's "Pro" console lacking the basic ability to play the games Sony sells at retailers all around the world is striking, and it's difficult to see the decision to accept that incongruity -- and the inconvenience it would inevitably cause for customers -- as anything other than strategic.
Digital sales make up a bigger and bigger portion of the industry's revenues every year, but physical game sales are still a very big deal -- and physical games are products that fall outside the control of publishers and platform holders in a way that they have found increasingly irritating in recent years. People who buy physical games can sell them second-hand or lend them to their friends, retailers with physical games in stock can discount them or include them in bundles as they see fit.
"few" should be "almost everyone" (Score:1, Insightful)
No, we aren't all looking back at the DVD-era with nostalgia, thinking "damn, life was better back then". The only people thinking that are a very small number of unwilling-to-change old people, and an even smaller number of youngsters who tend to wear top hats and handlebar mustaches. For the rest of us, we don't give a rats ass about owing a physical disc.
Gee, downloading and playing games from a Steam-like interface is sooooOOOOooooo annoying. I'd much rather be making more trips to G
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I tend to agree with you, especially since shops nowadays sell you a plastic case with a download code inside anyway.
But then you look at Warcraft 3, for example, and the only available version officially is the one Blizzard wants you to play, and you have to go somewhere else to download a version of your liking.
Granted that most games are online only anyway, and they only let you connect to their servers if you have the "right" version. But there is a certain loss of ownership with the discs gone.
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This. Movies, and music, and most gaming platforms went away from physical media years ago. What's next, people asking for physical media for their phone game?
If you have a PS4 and a shelf full of disks..... you can continue to play them on your PS4.
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The optical drive also tends to be the first thing that dies on a console, resulting in either a bricked console or an expensive repair - or even having to mod the console to accept a new drive because the drives are paired to the console.
Having the drive be an external device at least makes it easier to replace when it fails.
But people complaining about a lack of optical media are thinking long term. I can dig out a PS1 with a selection of games and still play them today many years after Sony discontinued
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Whoa! Are you serious? The drive is uniquely locked to the console and vice versa?
Re: "few" should be "almost everyone" (Score:2)
In most consoles with internal drives, yes. I did a drive on... A 360 I think? And I swapped the logic board from one optical drive to the other in order to do the replacement.
The used market as well (Score:2)
But people complaining about a lack of optical media are thinking long term. I can dig out a PS1 with a selection of games and still play them today many years after Sony discontinued the console. But any console that needs an online service becomes a brick the day that service is turned off.
There's also the used market for current gen games. I have very fond memories of my parents taking me to used game shops from time to time with the very modest sum of money I managed to save up as a child and walking out with an awesome game I bought with my own money! If I was still a console gamer today (I switched to PC gaming in my teens) I'd still be doing the used market as well, I like to save money and the vast majority of the time there's no difference between a used or new game. I feel like losing
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This seems like a good idea in theory, until Sony or the game developer decides to shut down the update/DRM servers for the game and it no longer works properly.
Only at that point do you realize that having a physical copy of the complete game might have been a good idea after-all.
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You're assuming you can play the game. It's been a long time since I've heard of someone buying a disc based game, throwing it in their PS5 and being able to play it straight away. Typically what happens is the first thing you actually need to do is download an update making the entire disk exercise pointless.
Also you're assuming people play games for the need to own a game. Many people don't. Many people play games for entertainment, and entertainment is fungible. "Oh noes game X no longer works!", *procee
Re: "few" should be "almost everyone" (Score:1)
You've heard of skyrim, right? 13 years and still being played. So much for game Y.
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Congrats, you're that diehard I was talking about. And what happens if Skyrim stops working? Will you go into a state of depression? Will you leave the gaming industry and burn your PS5 / Computer? Will your life breakdown?
Or ... I'm guessing you'll play a different game. Entertainment is not a collectors item, it's a fleeting boost of endorphins releasable in any number of different ways.
Re: "few" should be "almost everyone" (Score:2)
I'm Cool With It (Score:1)
I'm totally fine with disc-less. I have a PS5 with the disc drive, and while I've used it for a couple games, I far prefer digital downloads. They can be acquired from my couch and with a 100Gig connection, they download quick and easily. No clutter around the house, nothing to throw in the landfill, no getting up and inserting a disc every time I want to play, no noise of the disc spinning. Totally down with disc-less.
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You have a 100Gig connection?!
Must be nice.
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Especially since the PS5 only has 1 gigabit ethernet, and the pro has wifi7 which *might* be a bit faster under ideal conditions, but in real world scenarios generally won't be, and won't be anywhere close to 100gbps in any case.
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how meany games does it take to hit your cap?
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Newsflash: Your net connection is in the top 5% if not 1% of the world.
Re:I'm Cool With It (Score:4, Insightful)
Newsflash: I'm well aware.
Newsflash: even when you buy the disc you still have to download tens, if not hundreds of gigs, of game data nearly the same as buying the digital copy.
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Yes most users will have a much worse experience downloading games...
I have 1gbps fibre here, but sony don't support IPv6 and legacy IPv4 traffic goes through CGNAT which slows things down massively at peak times. I can get 1gbps downloads over IPv6 day or night, but less than half that over IPv4.
A lot of users will also be using wireless, so things could be massively slower still due to congestion and interference. In the apartment building here i can get around 600mbps using wifi6 when in the same room as
Few people want it? (Score:1)
I was too lazy to deal with disks all the way back on the Wii (I almost always ended up playing the little download games rather than dealing with the disks).
I understand that there are people that like the permanence of disks, and it'll be a shame in 10 years when the games are lost forever, but I imagine the typical user prefers diskless.
Re:Few people want it? (Score:4, Insightful)
I understand that there are people that like the permanence of disks,
It's not about what you want anymore. The days of "the customer is always right" are long dead. You will be told what you will use.
You will own nothing and be happy.
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It's not so much the lack of ownership that bothers me.
I'm happy to rent things.
I'm more concerned about stuff becoming lost to time. There's too many movies and games not available to rent on any platform, and with the death of physical media they'll be lost forever going forward.
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Much like broadcast tapes of TV shows before the advent of VCRs, many things were lost to time and the consumer is the one who cares more about preserving it.
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When was the customer ever right in any industry?
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and be happy
That's all most gamers want, anyway. Good that they're including it in the programming.
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Certainly I was too lazy too. I ripped the games to an external USB and used a launcher. But my disc drive is still pristine and I still own a copy even if the original Wii dies and Nintendo no longer supports it.
I love replaying older games and I'm not going to constantly re-buy them to do it.
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I purchased the legendary of Zelda 4 times.
1) NES
2) pre order wind waker (the main reason i pre ordered it was it came with the legend of Zelda and orcana of time if you did)
3) on the Wii (the convenience was worth $7 to me)
4) the game and watch
I honestly don't mind paying a few bucks to rebuy old content. I'm sort of upset I can't really buy some Dreamcast games I want, even though I can hook up my old Dreamcast if I really want to
Even That Seems Somewhat Pointless (Score:5, Insightful)
To paraphrase Agent Smith: "What good is a disc drive, if games demand connectivity?"
The bigger issue is that very few games will allow a player to have a completely offline experience. Insert disc > copy to drive > play game. Not every game will work this way, of course, but this experience is becoming incredibly rare. Yes, there is incentive to have an internet connection; multiplayer gaming being one such reason, DLC and MMO/Live Service games being others...but the absence of the disc drive isn't the cause of the issues, it's a symptom of the trajectory of gaming.
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To paraphrase Agent Smith: "What good is a disc drive, if games demand connectivity?"
Playing old games from earlier machines -backward compatibility with the older device versions used to be built in as standard (either via emulation or as a system-on-a-chip).
Playing movies on BR/DVD. They may not be the new & popular thing anymore, but there are a ton of them floating around out there super cheap -including things that are not available streaming.
Is it disks or ability to sell games used? (Score:3)
How many folks actually prefer a disc when the disc is just an unlock key to access the game after you download it anyway?
Allow folks to re-sell their digital downloaded games (and even movies/TVs) and discs would disappear at even a faster pace.
Re:Is it disks or ability to sell games used? (Score:4, Insightful)
This.
These days discs are nothing more than a shiny dongle to prove you paid for a license, and having the license no longer associated with a tangible object that can be resold is the actual problem. Unfortunately, it will probably take a law to force online software marketplaces to allow you to re-assign your purchases to someone else, since they love the idea that they've found a loophole to first sale doctrine.
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Sure.
On the other hand, I have a shelf full of PS4 and PS5 games that I would like to continue to play.
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On the other hand, I have a shelf full of PS4 and PS5 games that I would like to continue to play.
It seems like anybody in this situation already has a machine that can play those disks, though.
So they can just keep it, and keep using their disks? Even if they buy the new machine.
I doubt "guy who lives in a closet with a ginormous collection of physical games and has to sleep in his gaming chair" makes it into their marketing profiles.
Re: Tomorrow's Hardware (Score:2)
Lay off the weed for a while mate.
Not that disks are better- (Score:1)
Doesn't affect me, but I get it (Score:2)
Some people - a lot of people if you're in the US - have really crappy internet connections, and probably a monthly data cap to make it even worse. For them, a physical copy is almost a must. But it also begs the question, why is an internet connection all but a must for consoles? Even with a physical copy, a lot of games need to download various assets (not talking patches h
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What if it turns out the US is actually the worlds biggest market for digitally-delivered games? Wouldn't that blow a hole in your thesis?
Then there's the game preservation aspect.
That's not a perspective that even exists for the company selling consoles, though, so it's only good for yelling at the clouds. Finding a reason for that is low-hanging fruit these days.
Exactly what they want you to stop doing. (Score:3)
Sharing, lending, exchanging. They l know what they're doing and they're doing it for money and money only. Any game shared is a lost sales opportunity.
No discs, no ownership. (Score:5, Insightful)
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you don't own anything anymore
I'm okay with this. Entertainment is fleeting. It's not something that needs to be owned, it's something to be consumed and is readily available. I literally an hour ago went to sit down at my computer to play a round of No Man's Sky, saw that an update was queued, and decided to play something else instead. I was still entertained which is the ultimate goal of gaming.
It's a completely fungible process for anything but the most diehard gaming fans - the kind who can only ever enjoy one game and whose life w
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Oh trust me, just because you have a disc, doesn't mean you own it.
Driving piracy (Score:2)
No such thing as physical media anymore (Score:3)
Even if you buy a disc, the code is what matters. ALL the data on the disc, one installed, gets replaced when you update. Discs are utterly pointless for games. The only nice thing a disc player does it let you play blurays, and who the fuck does that anymore? I haven't loaded a disc into my bluray players in literally years.
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No point buying the disk anymore...but if you own older games on disc, it's nice to still be able to play them. And personally, I don't own a Blu Ray player, and I like having the ability to play one using my console. Author overstates the importance, but all thing being equal, it's prefereable for physical disks to be an option, as it was for the standard PS5.
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So you'll need to keep your old console, so that you can play them, and having less used consoles on the market also benefits console makers.
Ps5 pro, 2 comments (Score:2)
1) I have an early ps5. Works great. The idea of dropping another $700 or so to get somewhat better graphics in a limited set of games does not appeal. Anyone who didn't buy a regular ps5 by now is not going to run out there for a pro version. They will sell some units but it won't be a huge rush.
2) I bought the disk version of ps5 because I figured I'd want to own physical media, etc, etc. The reality is I bought a single disk game very early on but that was it. Complete waste of money. YMMV, but t
i am the only one (Score:2)
i maybe the only one that uses the ps5 for uhd video as well. i guess i will hold on to it as long as possible
I think they DO want a diskless future... (Score:2)
I sure do. I hate buying disks. I'd much rather download the game digitally.
What I want is the ability to share or sell that game when I am done with it. That has zero to do with physical media. That's paradigm shift in digital goods sales that needs to be changed.
It's no the disks, it's the non-ownership (Score:1)
Granted, disks aren't "ownership of the IP" but at least with non-DRM'd disks (and DRM'd disks that aren't tied to an account or device) you can sell your copy like a book, or should I say, like a copy-protected Blu-Ray movie disc.
That, plus good disk packaging looks nice on the bookshelf/display case.
Downloads are more convenient, alas (Score:2)
The lack of second-sale support is unfortunate, but fumbling around for physical media when we want to play games, or even worrying whether the physical media might be scratched and how to get patches for it are good reasons to ditch physical media.
Is the PS5 Pro a set top box (Score:2)
If it has to be connected to the Internet and I can't install games outside of the "cloud". With many games basically unplayable while offline.
Then is this a game console or a rather expensive set top box? But with a rather unreliable ethernet jack compared to just about every other set top box.
There's no secondary market (Score:2)
Discs create a possibility for a secondary market. Completely online games assure that there's only one market, and that is the publisher's to gain from alone.
I like secondary markets. I think buying used junk for less than the retail price is fun. On the Switch I buy a game and play it, and there it is always. The shelf is infinitely wide. I don't run out of shelf space and my house doesn't get more cluttered, no additional plastic enters the system. Digital purchases are fine. There was a place called Gam