Chess Federation Changes Rules To Allow Jeans Amid Spat; Magnus Carlsen Returns (sky.com) 101
World chess champion Magnus Carlsen has returned to the International Chess Federation (FIDE) World Rapid and Blitz Championships after new rules allowed players to wear "elegant" jeans with jackets.
Carlsen had withdrawn from the New York tournament when officials demanded he change out of jeans he wore after a lunch meeting, threatening him with fines and disqualification. FIDE revised its dress code following the incident, permitting "appropriate jeans matching the jacket" as an "elegant minor deviation" from standard attire.
Carlsen had withdrawn from the New York tournament when officials demanded he change out of jeans he wore after a lunch meeting, threatening him with fines and disqualification. FIDE revised its dress code following the incident, permitting "appropriate jeans matching the jacket" as an "elegant minor deviation" from standard attire.
Plenty of childishness to go around (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Plenty of childishness to go around (Score:5, Interesting)
no (Score:4, Informative)
Magnus is a multifaceted genius. He's also world-class at fantasy sports. Not to mention, there are multiple kinds of chess and he dominates them all. It's like calling track and field just running around in a circle not recognizing that the people who win the 100 yard dash don't win marathons.
He explained himself well, that on the day it was not practical for him to change his pants (he was doing interviews beforehand) and bullying players with a fine AND requiring them to change their clothes would disrupt their concentration. Imagine you have a big presentation at work, you're all ready to go, and at the last minute your dickhead coworker demands 30 minutes of your time and yells at you about some dumb bullshit, do you think you'd do as well at the presentation afterwards? Keep in mind that the difference between Magnus and his competitors in any tournament is not that large. He knew that this bullshit would disrupt his concentration and he wouldn't play as well, so what's the point of even playing at that point. He offered to change the next day and that wasn't good enough.
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In addition, he was going to have to sit out the next round, leaving him with no chance of remaining World Champion.
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Oh, no! Someone who doesn't follow the rules might not win?!
Choices have consequences. You'd think he'd know that.
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Ahh. Another asshole who would defend slavery because it was "a rule".
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Love is blind.
Ray Charles is blind.
Ray Charles is God.
Q.E.D.
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Nice!
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Lots more logical fallacies. It's nice to know you would defend slavery, probably why you are an anonymous coward, bud.
Also, kudos on playing the victim for past slaveholders. The bedsheets stay on the bed, my friend.
I'm an AC due to having already left a mod in this topic and I made excuses for no one. I simply call out the people who pretend to give a shit about something that happened a couple of hundred years before they were born just to look good on social media. Particularly when those same phony ass hats have a username that makes jokes about having sex with animals, bud.
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Particularly when those same phony ass hats have a username that makes jokes about having sex with animals, bud.
At least I'm not an internet nazi and racist. At no point have I ever typed on the internet I would have sex with animals. You scream about how racism is ok and slaveholders are the victims. You're a pathetic clown with brain damage.
Quit, dipshit.
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Particularly when those same phony ass hats have a username that makes jokes about having sex with animals, bud.
At least I'm not an internet nazi and racist. At no point have I ever typed on the internet I would have sex with animals. You scream about how racism is ok and slaveholders are the victims. You're a pathetic clown with brain damage. Quit, dipshit.
Geeez, I'm sorry, I didn't realize that you're insane. My bad.
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Geeez, I'm sorry, I didn't realize that you're insane. My bad.
He/she has sex with collies.
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But extremely few societies practiced chattel slavery like the US did. Slavery was often temporary, or by those captured in war, but it was rare for the condition to pass down to children. That's why American slavery was called the "peculiar institution."
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But extremely few societies practiced chattel slavery like the US did. Slavery was often temporary, or by those captured in war, but it was rare for the condition to pass down to children. That's why American slavery was called the "peculiar institution."
You are correct most culture did not make it an industry either. However you leave out the Brits, the Dutch, the Caribbeans, and the Africans who sold the slaves to the Dutch and British. It was not only "American slavery", it was more of European slavery, as almost everyone had a cut. I was simply pointing out that judging historical norms against modern beliefs is beating a dead horse and that the crazy person I was replying to was only being an ass. What was normal in the past and found to be incorrec
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Ahh. Another moron who thinks a dress code is the same as slavery.
Seek help.
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It's pretty obvious that he does know that choices have consequences, but nobody really knew what the consequence would really be.
For example, you thought violating the dress code would cause a loss. But in real life, violating a rule and then saying "because that's a stupid fucking rule" sometimes works, as the case here.
The only really interesting thing about all this, is that this group has a dress code at all. Nobody ever respects an org which has a dress code, so we all learned a little about FIDE, to
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Police and Militaries are special, because they actually have a Uniform not a dress code. And that Uniform serves a very justifiable purpose as it is actually a method of rapid Identification that helps quickly distinguishes their personnel in the field and tactical situations from enemies or civillians which helps units carry out their job more efficiently.
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It should be noted this is par for the course for Chess as a whole where some rules are very tournament dependent, and change from one to the other, With the format of how each round is conducted (do you play twice with white and black or just once), the scoring of a draw 0 pts or
Re:no (Score:5, Interesting)
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Honestly.. This sounds like a throw back to 3rd grade where the head nun would randomly pop into classes and start measuring the boys' hair with a ruler and kick people out of class sending them home, since their hair was deemed half an inch too long; Or the girls, if the hem on their skirt was found to be a quarter of an inch shorter than spec.
Apparently the clothing police never left, but who would have thought they would be in charge of an international chess tournament. Sure it make sense an event w
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Sounds like he lost the meta game.
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Yeah, as soon as I posted I was like "I guess technically he won the meta game".
He wasn't even a dick about it. If they just let him slide and wear jeans that day they could a kept their dress code.
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Funny, other people [thesportsgrail.com] have been fined [indianexpress.com] for not wearing appropriate attire, and yet they didn't storm off like some petulant child. Sure, they grumbled, but they continued to compete.
If he knew he was going to play there was no reason he couldn't have worn appropriate slacks to the interview then gone straight to the venue. He's been around long enough, he knows the rules.
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and yet they didn't storm off like some petulant child
Just wait for the 24/7 pr blitz accusing them of cheating.
Re:Plenty of childishness to go around (Score:5, Interesting)
Chess at a high level is full of petty politics. Academics and the corporate world are much the same way. Human beings are the common factor here, once you add the into the mix things always seem to go this way.
Other examples - Morality Clause in job contracts (Score:2)
The NBA, corporations, etc. have what's called a "Morality Clause" in their employment agreements for high-profile public figures. The "Morality Clause" is also found in product endorsements to avoid negative publicity.
Violating the Morality Clause would cause the person under contract to lose their job or face other sanctions from the employer.
NBA player contract: https://atlhawksfanatic.github... [github.io]
The Team may terminate this Contract upon written notice to the Player if the Player shall:
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I wouldn't sign something so vague unless I didn't have a choice or the money was good. ;-)
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Why? Because there's a tournament dress code? Man you must hate all professional sports and games.
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And nothing else.
The rules were not always taken that seriously (Score:3)
Here is a more in depth look at the original incident [chessbase.com]. Magnus Carlsen needs FIDE, but it's just as true that FIDE also needs the strongest player on the planet. Schoolmaster-type arbiters have to accept that the game needs Carlsen and that this level of antagonism on a silly detail is self-defeating.
Re:The rules were not always taken that seriously (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't think Carlsen really needs FIDE. At this point I don't think he cares if he has 47 or 48 titles. But FIDE need high profile players for sponsorship, etc., and Carlsen is still the biggest name at the moment.
There are enough 30+ age players looking at the end of their careers that a few might take up the Freestyle thing with Carlsen, and never player FIDE competitions again. Nakamura has suggested he's been close to retiring and a couple of breakaway competitions with sponsorship and decent prize money might be enough for him to play out. There are a few others that might think their chances of getting to play a FIDE world championship match in classical time control might be dwindling too.
Carlsen isn't playing championship matches because he wants the format to evolve and FIDE is resistant. How this progresses through 2025 could be interesting.
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Need? No. But he did actively seek out a meeting with the chief to discuss this. He openly said right after spitting the dummy that he actually wants to play Blitz and will try and be back the day after. And he did.
He's swinging his weight and reputation around (good for him, what's the point of fame and glory without power), but let's not pretend he was ready to blindly walk away.
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but let's not pretend he was ready to blindly walk away.
He has before.
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There are enough 30+ age players looking at the end of their careers that a few might take up the Freestyle thing with Carlsen, and never player FIDE competitions again
He's gotten almost all the top chess players to join [freestyle-...s-club.com], including the young guys.
What do they have against jeans? (Score:1)
Do they think he's going to hide an extra chess piece in that small front pocket?
I can see why they wouldn't want clothes with logos or something that could conceal a cheating device, but they're already inspecting ansuses before each match so I think they can handle jeans.
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Dress codes are stupid... (Score:3, Insightful)
...and have no impact on the quality of play.
Most "suit lovers" are basically cosplayers trying to mask their ineptitude.
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The people that sign your paychecks wear suits.
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Eh. Not mine. At least not normally, only if the money people want to discuss funding shit.
But we're an ag-tech company, our customers , farmers, rarely trust people who wear suits. Turn up in jeans and a neat shirt, an you'll get their respect.
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We're a hardware store. We're not allowed to wear suits. People won't buy toilet parts from some kind wearing a coat an tie.
(And our owner doesn't like feeling underdressed in his own office, when he comes in during the summer wearing shorts and flip-flops.)
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Most people that sign paychecks are mindless morons.
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So are more people who get paychecks.
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So are more people
Almost got it right.
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These days those checks are direct-deposited electronically. The people who wear the suits have no time to sign each check.
Of course the ranking executives in companies and managers tend to wear sites -- this is part of their disguise it help makes them appear to be more educated and to have a much more difficult more important job than they do.
Dress codes are needed (Score:4, Insightful)
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Your comment on logos and advertising is especially on-point. FIDE has no desire to give free advertising to third-party companies. Enforcing dress codes is part of that.
Other sports leagues have very clear agreements with their players and teams on sponsorships and displays. Why shouldn't FIDE be able to do the same?
Heck, I run a non-sporting event every couple of years that attracts a little over 100 people each time, and even we have guidelines for sponsorship displays.
All that said, Magnus has a long
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Other sports leagues have very clear agreements with their players and teams on sponsorships and displays. Why shouldn't FIDE be able to do the same?
Because Chess players don't generally sign contracts determining what they wear, where they play, and how often. They generally pay to play in the tournament.
even we have guidelines for sponsorship displays
Guidelines. Not dress code. Things like no brands, no offensive words, or specifying a minimum amount of coverage are all normal things. Especially if videos or pictures are to be published somewhere. But eliminating entire categories of otherwise completely valid clothing is just asinine.
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even we have guidelines for sponsorship displays
Guidelines. Not dress code. Things like no brands, no offensive words, or specifying a minimum amount of coverage are all normal things. Especially if videos or pictures are to be published somewhere. But eliminating entire categories of otherwise completely valid clothing is just asinine.
How can you possibly know whether or not our guidelines include a dress code that precludes advertising, or ensures decorum? Please stop putting words in my mouth.
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I didn't. I said those are all normal guidelines to have.
What I actually said boils down into: dress guidelines are not the same as dress code. Where to place your sponsorship logo on your shirt (or whatever) is a guideline. "Red, plain t-shirts only" is a dress code. They are not synonymous or interchangeable. The example you gave was a guideline not a dress code, regardless of whether or not your events actually had a dress code.
You can have dress guidelines without a dress code.
You can have a dress code
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Do players need to wear shirts or can they be topless?
Viewership for women's chess might go up a bit in the latter case!
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well the NASCAR look should only be in NASCAR (Score:2)
well the NASCAR look should only be in NASCAR and not in other events.
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Standards have been in decline for decades now. Just go back and look at how people dressed in the 1950s and compare it to how they dress now.
Today, you have people dressing like slobs no matter where they go (just see peopleofwalmart.com for examples). That wasn't the case in the past, when people took more pride in how they looked when in public. Heck, even U.S. Senators (John Fetterman) are appearing on the floor of the Senate dressed like they just got back from the gym.
I travel internationally frequent
Checkmate! (Score:5, Funny)
Mate in one for Carlsen. Bravo.
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Well put, but let's not underplay his negotiation skills here.
He came in with a strategy to create change, went *all in* and won.
Good game. Maybe he knows something about strategy?
Contrast with Kasparov who went loopy and lost his bids.
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Would that be the Great McGonigle?
Are Albert & Cleopatra Pepperday near?
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I pointed this out on the last story: FIDE is the national chess federation of France. The only reason it crowns the world chess champion is because the players have agreed that they do. The current and previous world champions are jokes and should bring shame to the organization, that has done nothing to improve things.
Previously, it was Gary Kasparov feuding with FIDE, and he really did break away from FIDE and started his own tournament that crowned
Elegant Jeans (Score:3)
Like those kind with the bedazzled back pockets?
Re: Elegant Jeans (Score:5, Funny)
It's like that meme: "If your boyfriend's jeans look like this, you have a girlfriend."
I don't like this ruling (Score:2)
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This solves nothing. In fact if anything, it makes the situation worse.
True. They should have abolished dress codes except for stating how much of the body has to be covered and perhaps that the garments can't be visibly worn out. But instead they are clinging to an absurd concept of "elegance" which exists in the mind, not in your garments.
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From an article I linked to above:
It would have been amusing if Carlsen had done that, but I accept that the jobsworth's intervention left him in the wrong frame of mind to play top level chess.
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left him in the wrong frame of mind to play top level chess
If he's that rattled by being asked to follow simple rules, can you really call him a "top level" player?
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If he's that rattled by being asked to follow simple rules, can you really call him a "top level" player?
I would call him a top level asshole. Sorry, Magnus don't defame and slander me. I didn't cheat making this comment.
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It's an EGO clash. bunch of primitives acting on their emotions and misusing their brains to rationalize moronic behavior.
The MINDLESS application of rules which do not need to exist other than to please the ego of petty people craving power to please their egos... When their game is lost; they can't correct, they have to save face with more of the same moronic behavior that created the problem in the first place!
The irony is that all of this is around a game of absolute thinking; not ego BS.
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Hint: If they are flared like you're going to a 70s nightclub, or have more holes in them than a brothel then it's not elegant. There's a lot of fucked up jeans out there so it's a pretty clear and simple ruling. It's not ambiguous if you look like you shopped in a dumpster or not.
I declare jeans legal (Score:1)
"The Magnus" (Score:2)
Wearing elegant jeans and a jacket when it may or may not be dressy enough. Black dress shoes for the cautious grandmaster, Vans or sneakers for the adventurous gentleman.
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Pinheads with A Little Power... (Score:2)
...are hurting the sport when they make rules that affect the outcome but are no indication of the competitive prowess of those involved.
Its been done before. Indianapolis 500 style racing. You have a guy that clearly is in the lead, makes a pit stop, and accidentally runs over his air wrench hose. Penalty - stop and go in the pits, or a lap, or something that damages his performance for the day. Don't quote me, because this was in excess of 20 years ago, when I became much less interested in the spor
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Yeah. My perception is that F1 racing is even worse for rules than Indy 500.
The FIA does not like their drivers swearing. Their drivers think it is a fucking stupid rule.
https://driving.ca/auto-news/e... [driving.ca]
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I can see having a dress code but... (Score:2)
Levi's 501s (Score:2)
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Two sides of the coin (Score:3)
On one hand, disallowing jeans seems like a nit-picky rule that has nothing to do with the sport of chess, or with its reputation. On the other hand, changing it just because a star throws a fit, is akin to the organization saying, "We don't actually believe in principle." If you think a rule is important, you should stand behind it, eve if a star objects. If you suddenly don't think it's important, it's like admitting you were an idiot in the first place.
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On one hand, disallowing jeans seems like a nit-picky rule that has nothing to do with the sport of chess, or with its reputation. On the other hand, changing it just because a star throws a fit, is akin to the organization saying, "We don't actually believe in principle." If you think a rule is important, you should stand behind it, eve if a star objects. If you suddenly don't think it's important, it's like admitting you were an idiot in the first place.
I think the issue is that the rule was inconsistently used and arbitrarily enforced. Just look at the article:
After playing a few rounds of the tournament, he was told he would face a fine because of his jeans, and then was told he wouldn't be able to play at all if he didn't change.
So what was the punishment on the book? A fine or a DQ?
Though I'm not sure they really fixed the issue:
The chess federation has warned players against taking liberties with their outfits.
"I sincerely hope that nobody would try t
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There is a third choice here: FIDE realizing that the dress code was more strict that it needed to be. In other words, perhaps their principals were still served with a slightly different dress code.
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Maybe, but the new policy makes me doubt it.
The chess federation has warned players against taking liberties with their outfits.
"Special assistants" will be on hand to help judges decide whether players' outfits are acceptable, according to Mr Dvorkovich.
It seems that now, the dress code is less clear, and subject to the whims of "special assistants."
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If you think a rule is important, you should stand behind it, eve if a star objects. If you suddenly don't think it's important, it's like admitting you were an idiot in the first place.
That's what they admitted. They decided it's less important than Magnus. And that is true.
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Perhaps. And yet, they made the "new" dress code even more complicated and subjective, delegating the rules to "special assistants" who will decide what is appropriate and what is not. That sounds even more stupid than the original rule.
He knows the rules and breaks them because he can (Score:1)
He uses his fame like a free pass to treat people and organizations however he pleases. This does not make him a good person or a better chess player. It certainly makes him a horrible ambassador.
Yes, chess organizations are fairly status quo. He and every other participant KNOWS the rules regarding the dress code. If they let him break the rules on manner of dress, it appears as if they are not treating everyone equally by the rules.
It would be similar to Elon Musk going to a black-tie restaurant in a t-sh
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