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The Almighty Buck Games News

Ouya Android Console Blows Past Kickstarter Goal 270

Posted by Unknown Lamer
from the smells-like-2001 dept.
mikejuk writes with a winner for quickest follow-up in a while as the Ouya console managed to raise over $2 million in a mere eight hours. From the article: "On the surface it all sounds like a really good idea. The OUYA games console is planned to be an open competitor to the likes of Xbox and PS3. It seems so good that it has been crowd funded to the tune of $1 million — but why exactly is it needed? There must be a good reason — after all the wisdom of crowds is never wrong. The simple answer seems to be freedom. The company claims that you can do what you want to the machine. A CyanogenMod port would allow you to do what you like to the OS and it wouldn't void your warranty. You can hack the hardware or software. However, it is important to note that this isn't open hardware. ... In the same way the software seems to be open and yet controlled. ... The Kickstarter page says 'When we say, "open" we mean it. We've made many decisions based on this philosophy:..' But it isn't Open Source. And yet it is so much better than the alternative. Perhaps this is a sign of just how desperate we all are to get away from the control of the big console manufacturers, that we will fund anything that sounds even slightly reasonable. The walled gardens of Apple, Sony and Microsoft no longer seem the warm and welcoming places they once did (if they ever did)" Issues not raised on yesterday's post; the console will require a significant number of binary blobs just to function, and it's really unclear whether or not it will actually be DRM free. Anyone remember Indrema?
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Ouya Android Console Blows Past Kickstarter Goal

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  • by raydobbs (99133) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:40AM (#40615325) Homepage Journal

    That's got to be a serious contender for the record of fastest funded project on Kickstarter in the category of nearly a million dollars... But anyway, I hope this means we'll get to see what they come up with - a 99 dollar console is just about in the range of 'sure, I'll bite - see what it's like' in terms of risk to the consumer.

    • by MrSome (2587847) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:50AM (#40615451)

      Agreed 100%.

      At $99 it's cheaper than... well, any gaming platform, right? (Android Phone, iPhone, Nintendo DS, Wii, PS3, Xbox360)

      So if it can offer the same type of entertainment options... (Netflix, HBOGo... etc), why not give it a try?

      All they need is some developers who know to focus on the FUN factor of games. I'm tired of the industry rating games on graphics and realism. I want games that are fun, with a high replayability factor. I have enough realism from 8-5. I don't need to see individual hairs on the back of my character's neck stand up when he gets shot in the face.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Loughla (2531696)

        All they need is some developers who know to focus on the FUN factor of games. I'm tired of the industry rating games on graphics and realism. I want games that are fun, with a high replayability factor. I have enough realism from 8-5. I don't need to see individual hairs on the back of my character's neck stand up when he gets shot in the face.

        Why shouldn't we try for both?

        • by AuMatar (183847) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @11:26AM (#40615943)

          Because graphics cost a lot of money, and effort there would be better off on gameplay or the next title. or on a cheaper game-I'd rather have it coat half as much and have snes era graphics.

          Add for realism- for some games, it's good. For most, out actively detracts from fun gameplay. Concentrate on it only if it's a key concept, otherwise ignore it

          • by DemonGenius (2247652) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @11:40AM (#40616115)

            Add for realism- for some games, it's good. For most, out actively detracts from fun gameplay. Concentrate on it only if it's a key concept, otherwise ignore it

            As a long time gamer I wholeheartedly agree. While we've seen an increase in graphics quality over time, we've seen very little movement in terms of innovative gameplay/controls/storylines/etc. Lately, it's only the indie games that I've seen that have implemented really original ideas. I love the idea of a console like this coming to market, it will give the big guys a run for their money.

        • by Mike Buddha (10734) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @12:56PM (#40617307)

          Because we'd like to be able to play the games without waiting 10 years for the development to finish. If there are engineering trade-offs to be made in game dev, please opt for "fun" over "realistic", Devs.

      • by s73v3r (963317)

        Isn't there a $99 Xbox 360 version?

    • 99 bucks is so little money nowadays. I would gladly shell out 200 for a way better version of the same concept.

      I think this will be for casual gamers. Nothing about this idea sounds like immersive graphics and physics. Sounds more like an android Wii.... meh.

      More power, please. Gamers that use their systems and hang around like blockbusters far more than popping bubbles.

      • by raydobbs (99133) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @11:43AM (#40616159) Homepage Journal

        The problem with your argument is that the Wii is actually a pretty good console - it's just saddled with crappy games because that's all that makes it past Nintendo's vetting process. Cheap and sleezy ports and titles that are just 'phoned in' make up a large bulk of the console's 'shovelware'. If Nintendo didn't require you to be an A tier developer with blockbuster games already in your stable - then they'd have some room for innovative products on the platform. As it is - they have geared their developer's licensing to poach developers from other consoles.

        Given the Android platform, this could really open the world of console game development to the independents - those who could never convince Nintendo or Sony to even sell them a development kit - or pay for Microsoft XBOX's QA for deployment on XBOX Live. I've seen some really impressive indie games out there - and this could be their shot at getting in on a console that hasn't already 'cherry-picked' their developer base.

        Of course, there is also a lot of $hit indie games as well - but that's kind of to be expected with no vetting process of any kind. Perhaps as the market matures, places like Metacritic and game magazines will review and rate indie titles on such systems as this more frequently - and it will not be such a crap-shoot.

        • If Nintendo didn't require you to be an A tier developer with blockbuster games already in your stable

          Think of it from Nintendo's point of view. In 1983, shelves were filled with low-budget me-too games that clearly fulfilled Theodore Sturgeon's 1958 revelation about 90 percent of works in a genre or medium [wikipedia.org]. This almost killed the living room video game industry in 1983. If you haven't proven that you can finish a commercial game above the 50th percentile of quality, why should Nintendo let you see its trade secrets?

          they have geared their developer's licensing to poach developers from other consoles.

          Why do you think only games for other consoles count as "relevant video game industry experi

          • by Patch86 (1465427)

            And yet the Wii's game line up still sports such classic blockbusters as "Now: That's What I call Music Dance & Sing", "Tamagotchi: Party On!" and "My Aquarium".

            Honestly, if the Wii's games catalogue is a result of "careful vetting", I dread to think what their vetting rejects.

        • by s73v3r (963317)

          The problem with your argument is that the Wii is actually a pretty good console - it's just saddled with crappy games because that's all that makes it past Nintendo's vetting process.

          What are you talking about? Lots of good games made it past Nintendo's vetting process. It's just that the console itself was so different than the other two, most companies wouldn't put their flagship titles on it.

          • by raydobbs (99133) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @02:04PM (#40618249) Homepage Journal

            ...and the fact that working with Nintendo's console development group is such a nightmare that even seasoned development houses don't put the manpower into creating stuff for them BECAUSE they are so difficult to work with. They lost a ton of franchises because of it - Resident Evil, Final Fantasy, and a ton more won't even -ever- consider it because of the tales they've heard about it.

            That works against you getting premium titles for your console when you cull your developers before they even get out of the starting gate. The ones that are left don't sink the manpower into flagship games that could get killed at any point by Nintendo to favor their own titles, release schedules, or even if they just don't like your game concept as it's evolving. Petty shit kills good products, and Nintendo has been stabbing a lot of people in the industry in the back over the years - it's just taken a while to catch up with them.

  • 55" tablet (Score:3, Informative)

    by Jurramonga (1922438) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:41AM (#40615333)
    This is the equivalent of hooking a tablet to your television. You'll have access to the same Android games that every smartphone and tablet has, assuming that the app even supports a controller.
    • by Tx (96709)

      Yes, that was my first thought, you can of course already hook up a tablet/phone/Rikomagic to your TV and play Android games on the big screen. But I guess this console can stay permanently hooked up to the TV, which has some advantages, and if they can get enough units shipped, maybe developers will do some optimization with their controllers, as games developed for a touchscreen may not translate well to traditional sofa gaming.

      • by tepples (727027)

        But I guess this console can stay permanently hooked up to the TV, which has some advantages

        And it'll also come with a gamepad, which brings other advantages.

        games developed for a touchscreen may not translate well to traditional sofa gaming.

        Nor vice versa. Sofa gaming has traditionally been reserved for established companies, with indies limited to PC (mouse and keyboard, one player per machine, few players think to plug in a gamepad) or mobile (flat touch screen) platforms.

      • My Transformer Prime can hook up to a TV via HDMI, and can use PS3 controllers via Bluetooth with no extra software. (You just hook the controller up via USB, turn on Bluetooth on the tablet, and hit the "PS" button. Boom, paired.)

        Not all games support controllers, but 'higher end' ones do. I have three in particular - Max Payne, Shadowgun, and Dead Trigger. The graphics are pretty good - not much below current-gen consoles, actually. So long as more and more games support gamepads like that, I can see a n

    • I have a HP Touchpad (got it during the fire sale) running CM9. I've installed an application (Sixaxis Controller) that allows my PS3 controller to connect via Bluetooth. I tested it out on a jetski racing game (Riptide GP) that I bought from the Google PLAY market. It works really well. It turns my touchpad into a portable gaming platform. I am not sure how many other games support a game controller as I've been busy playing Skyrim instead of tablet games...

  • Scanning the title I thought they got a Kickstarter project for creating an Android command terminal app that would allow you to run standard GNU/BSD tools like grep, find and sort without rooting the phone. Would be really nice to have if you can use an external keyboard with it.
    • by h4rr4r (612664)

      KBOX terminal.
      http://kevinboone.net/kbox.html [kevinboone.net]

      External keyboard support would be included if you have an android device that takes external keyboard. My understanding is anything past 2.2 should be able to use a bluetooth keyboard.

  • I read a big blog post the other day going on about why this was a scam, is it still a scam or has our thinking changed?
    • by flitty (981864) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:59AM (#40615591)
      There's two flip-out reactions about this console 1) It's a Kickstarter scam to steal money and always be vaporware or 2) It's an underpowered box that will be laughed out of the market because It's so underpowered and stupid that any Phone will be better than this box by the time it's released and AAA developers won't make any games for it.

      Gamers are notorious armchair analysts who usually have no idea what they're talking about. (See: Xbox360 vs PS3 hardware power arguments when they were launched) Gamers should be cautious, mostly due to Kickstarter's sketchyness, but I don't see why this Kickstarter is any more suspect than other Kickstarters.
      • It's an underpowered box that will be laughed out of the market because It's so underpowered and stupid that any Phone will be better than this box by the time it's released

        Any phone, even the bargain-basement $100 phones that Virgin Mobile and other prepaid carriers sell? And would such a phone include a Bluetooth gamepad, or would games still rely on thumb swipe gestures?

      • by Guspaz (556486)

        A Tegra 3 isn't all that underpowered; it would fit inside the spectrum of current-gen consoles. Faster than a Wii, slower than a 360, but closer to the 360 than the Wii. With that much RAM, porting a 360 or PS3 game shouldn't be terribly difficult, except for the obvious differences in APIs.

        I'd be curious about the relative performance of the CPUs of the two. The 360 has, for game use (one core is reserved for OS) a dual-core in-order-execution 3.2GHz PowerPC. The Tegra 3 is a quad-core out-of-order execut

      • by s73v3r (963317)

        The biggest reason why I didn't pledge anything is because they said units wouldn't be out til next March. That's a long time. When they get closer to actually releasing, I'll look into it again.

    • by oGMo (379) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @11:15AM (#40615799)

      At a glance it seems legit, but on rereading, I had to wonder this myself:

      • Promise of "killer" opening price-point of $99.
      • Promise of "every game free-to-play".
      • Use of Android and other buzzwords.
      • Multitude of unrelated screenshots of unrelated, unsupported, non-Android games.
      • Promise of "easy rooting" (why would you need to root something if root was manufacturer-supported?)
      • Lots of pseudo-appeal to the "non-mainstream".
      • Release in 10 months with <$1mil budget.
      • >10,000+ consoles already promised at or below price-point.

      This has a lot of "too-good-to-be-true" tempered by some things to make it seem reasonable. But with the promises made, I'm not sure. "Estimated Delivery: March 2013" is awfully soon to manufacture a console with presumably no prior hardware development experience. Do they have all their contracts already lined up? Is their software already developed? Just look how long it took to get the OpenPandora [wikipedia.org] out.

      All of this starts making you wonder "wait, is this really legit?" I certainly can't say it's not, but it seems either naive or too good to be true.

      • by Fulminata (999320)
        Can't speak to all of the points you made, but they do go into more detail about "free to play" in the FAQ. They mean that every game must include some free content. In practice that means you might get a completely free game, but it's far more likely you'll get a demo with unlockable content, or a "freemium" model game.
        • by oGMo (379)

          Right, this is one of the things I mean by "tempered". "Free-to-play" and "microtransactions" are buzzwords; they've proven to be successful business models in some cases, so this seems reasonable. The question is, do they already have titles lined up for launch? Contracts for their f2p store? With a 10-month launch window, they should have devkits out now. Most existing android games assume a touchscreen. You can't just drop those on a device with controller and screen.

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by scot4875 (542869)

        Promise of "killer" opening price-point of $99.

        This one I don't see as being as big of a warning sign.

        No screen; there goes a huge chunk of the cost of a typical Android device. No battery, no cell radios. No cameras. I think it's actually completely feasible to get a decently-spec'd piece of hardware running Android out for at most somewhere in the $150-$200 range, and quite possibly even sub-$100. This is going to be basically a CPU/GPU wired up to bluetooth, wifi, storage, and AV out. You can already get things like that for really cheap.

        I mean

        • by oGMo (379)

          I mean think about it -- the Wii shipped for $200ish in Japan and had far more custom hardware than this will have. That was 6 years ago.

          The Wii shipped with essentially souped-up 5-year-old hardware and still cost $212 (JP) to $249 (US). The custom stuff should have been taken out of the equation by manufacturing volume. Just because the hardware exists doesn't obviate development and testing time. And they still have custom cases, controllers, etc. Nintendo shipped millions at launch. They have tens

      • by Solandri (704621)
        Welcome to venture capital investing 101. Don't kid yourself, that's what kickstarter is. It's not some fundamentally different way to fund projects. It's the same venture capital of old, just with the investors having less (no) power over how their money is used, and a new interface (website) which allows one to raise small funds from a lot of investors rather than large funds from a few investors. It's not a storefront like Amazon where you pay your money and you're guaranteed to get the advertised pr
      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        by Patch86 (1465427)

        All of your points are completely sensible and on the money. But if we're being kind to them, you can justify some of them:
        - Every game must have free-to-play content: they're basically demanding that all games must come with a demo, or follow the old Shareware model. Not that unreasonable.
        - Android- it's only a buzzword if they're not using it. Android is a fairly sensible choice for what they're setting out to do, so it's not that weird that they've picked it.
        - "Rooting"- they're just using the lingo. It

      • by s73v3r (963317)

        Promise of "every game free-to-play".

        It's not every game free-to-play, its that every game has to have some kind of free component. Like a demo.

    • Can't speak for others, but it definitely has a "too good to be true" smell to it as far as I'm concerned.

      Basically, it looks like a non-portable version of the GP32/GP2X of a few years back. The hardware turned out to suck, the "professional" games never materialized, leaving it as a sub-standard media player and a halfway decent 8-bit emulator system (16 bit was iffy. MegaDrive/Genesis was good, SNES was not).

      Combined with a price point that seems to be made out of unicorn farts and pixie dust, I find mys

      • by Patch86 (1465427)

        The points in their favour is that they're using off-the-shelf software (Android) which already has a huge base of compatible hardware (via the existing Android devices). There's also already a lot of professional (albeit "causal") games for the platform, and a lot of game companies with established Android development teams.

        On the price-point front- there are Android phones at or near $100 (not necessarily good ones). When you bear in mind that with a smartphone you're paying for a screen, touchscreen inte

  • by mystikkman (1487801) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:46AM (#40615401)

    >after all the wisdom of crowds is never wrong

    Really? Or was that sarcasm?

    Here are the problems I foresee:

    1) They're either selling the hardware at cost or taking a loss at $99. Big console manufacturers make it back on $60 games. It will be really tough to make it off 30% of 99c games.

    2) Storage, 8 GB(minus OS space) is really low, and you don't want to be downloading from the cloud all the time. XBox gets away with a 4GB model because it has a DVD drive. Throw in a SD card slot atleast or a cheap SSD.

    3) Hardware: The hardware seems woefully inadequate. Tegra 3 is okay for now but in 2013 when they actually launch? Also, it's not a good thing to upgrade hardware even every year because that will fragment the games, so that hardware at launch is a very important baseline.

    4) And the last big thing: PATENTS. The big players and patent trolls will be all over this company by the time it even sees minimal success. With the controller looking very similar to the existing ones, expect a huge patent attack.

    Anyway, nice to see an underdog coming up in the console games, but it's hard to understand why Google can't make something like this. They already have Google TV and they release something like the Nexus Q at $299?

    • by h4rr4r (612664)

      1). Why would they be taking a loss? Tegra 3 SoCs run I think $15, can be more than $50 worth of parts total. I bet chinese assembly gets it done cheap enough for a small profit on each. There is no need to make the kind of profit the big boys do, most businesses don't have those kinds of margins and still survive.
      2). 8GB seems fine, they are not going for blockbuster games. sure an SD card would help

      3). I disagree a Tegra 3 today will not get worse with age, it will still be "good enough". It could be bett

      • by Talderas (1212466)

        2). 8GB seems fine, they are not going for blockbuster games. sure an SD card would help

        Exactly. This article is about twenty ways wrong and misunderstands the gaming environment.

        This won't increase competition because the developers who want DRM or other restrictions will continue to flock to Sony/Nintento/MS. It just so happens that most of the blockbuster developers go this route. This is probably going to end up as nothing more than perhaps a slightly more powerful smartphone for the purposes of gaming. At best it will compete with PCs for indie developers.

        • by h4rr4r (612664)

          I think this would be huge for OnLive, Netflix and a whole host of others that want to provide service to a cheap dumb endpoint.

          It would also be big for indie devs and smaller game houses. I bet it could run all the Tell Tale games for instance. Not a huge dev, but their franchises are pretty historic. Sam and Max, Monkey Island, etc.

          In short I am old and I think I would like to use this to play old games and new versions of said old games.

          • by tlhIngan (30335)

            It would also be big for indie devs and smaller game houses. I bet it could run all the Tell Tale games for instance. Not a huge dev, but their franchises are pretty historic. Sam and Max, Monkey Island, etc.

            The problem is the Ouya store will be just as bad as the Apple App Store, Google Play Store and Xbox Live Indie Arcade. Everyone and their dog will want to try to cash in on the action (and with a kickstarter like that... cha-ching) and release tons of crap ass games.

            They'll have the numbers but if it's

            • by h4rr4r (612664)

              I run the telltale games on wine and don't have those issues. At least not so far, what platform are you using?

            • They'll have the numbers but if it's practically impossible to find the good ones in the pile among the junk

              Hence the requirement of a free demo, so that players can download a game and rate it without having to spend anything. It's almost like the old days of cartridge based systems, where one would often rent games to see if they were any good before buying them.

      • 8GB seems fine, they are not going for blockbuster games. sure an SD card would help

        Games that actually use that Tegra3 have to have textures and other art assets that take up space. I have 4 of the big 'Yay Tegra3' games for Android - Max Payne Mobile, Shadowgun THD, Dead Trigger, and Dark Meadow. Every one of them had a lengthy post-'install' download of around 1 GB each. That'd fill up over half that 8GB space.

        I'd figure an SD card slot, or even an external USB drive connection, would be necessary in

    • by euxneks (516538)
      Your other points are valid, but I take a bit of exception to this one:

      3) Hardware: The hardware seems woefully inadequate. Tegra 3 is okay for now but in 2013 when they actually launch? Also, it's not a good thing to upgrade hardware even every year because that will fragment the games, so that hardware at launch is a very important baseline.

      I wouldn't say it's woefully inadequate. I think it would be similar to the way the Wii is underpowered compared to the PS3 and Xbox 360 right now. It's a cheap system, I wouldn't expect game-changing graphics... I would, however, expect there to be interesting games coming from the indie game crowd. Canabalt is a very simple game that is super fun to play. Super meat boy doesn't require a heck of a lot of computing power.

  • A vote against (Score:4, Interesting)

    by argStyopa (232550) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:48AM (#40615437) Journal

    I think people like the convenience of consoles, mainly. Turn them on, and bang, you're playing in a moment. The locked-in hardware means that everything you run on it will be compatible, or updates will be auto-installed.

    However, we've gotten sick of the console-makers' sense that somehow they OWN us as customers, and can reach further and further into our lives to control the console experience downstream.

    If I mod my console, that's MY BUSINESS, not the hardware-sellers. I don't think anyone would object to the developers saying "ok then that voids your warranty" - that's fair. But when they push updates that then (pretty obviously deliberately) break modding, brick systems, and contrive to rope us back into their definition of what we should be doing with their systems, we resist and look for alternatives.

    Which is why I hope this works, but its main impact will be in policy, not product. It's a vote against the proprietary walled-garden mentality of the big hardware makers. PERHAPS they'll see that a console player just wants to play the damned games, not become part of the dev's 'family'.

    • However, we've gotten sick of the console-makers' sense that somehow they OWN us as customers, and can reach further and further into our lives to control the console experience downstream.

      We have; most gamers and people in general have not. Note the immense popularity of consoles and console games, and other locked down vendor-controlled devices (cell phones, iPads, etc.).

    • by wierd_w (1375923)

      This is why in the last thread I suggested implementing alternative game marketplaces to PSN store and Xbox Live! Store.

      What is really needed is something like "son of BNetD" for consoles, accessed by telling the console to connect through the service's special proxy portal. It tries to call the mothership, but gets the replacement service instead.

      As far as I know, the container format and cryptographic mechanisms used on the 360 to sign packages has been known for awhile, and the ps3's loss of cryptographi

  • by ackthpt (218170) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:51AM (#40615473) Homepage Journal

    Is for C64 and Apple ][ emulators.

    • by h4rr4r (612664)

      Both already exist on android.
      I bet if that is all you want you could right now get a cheap android tablet, bluetooth keyboard and mouse. hook that up to your TV and away you go.

  • Next up: An Android Powered DVR with CableCard support.

    Hey I can dream, right?

  • Suckers. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:52AM (#40615497)

    $2 million all for the price of a flashy presentation. Let me say this again, they just made $2 million in DONATIONS with 0 requirements to actually bring this device to market. Show of hands, how many people remember the Phantom console?

    And people wonder where their money goes and why they are in so much debt...

    I agree that the console market needs to have more open source contenders, but guess what, they HAVE contenders! There are plenty of open source / open hardware solutions that you can even build yourself! These solutions come with a variety of software options including Ubuntu and Android. Heck there are even a few portable handheld open consoles available. The difference is that these are actual devices for sale and not a list of shiny specs with no solid strategy for being profitable, especially at the $99 price point they mention.

    One of these days I need to make a flashy shiny kickstarter presentation with a lot of loaded promises just so that I can cash out and retire early...

  • by na1led (1030470) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @10:59AM (#40615597)
    Sounds like a Win-Win situation to me. Once you have the hardware, people can Kickstart projects to make software and games for it.
  • by Cereal Box (4286) on Wednesday July 11, 2012 @11:03AM (#40615631)

    This is sort of a recurring theme in a lot of Kickstarter projects -- why did this particular project need to go to Kickstarter?

    If you look at their pitch video, clearly no expense was spared getting the Ouya to its current point. Fancy office space, dozens of designers/developers, Macs for everyone, etc. Somebody has pumped serious cash into this venture. So why do they have to beg common people for a mere million bucks to get this thing off the ground? Were they just going to give up if they didn't get the money? Somehow I doubt that.

    I've never seen anyone raise that particular question about this project. They obviously have some deep-pocketed investors, so why do they have to beg for money from a bunch of regular Joes who will certainly feel the financial impact if this thing never comes to fruition?

  • As a backer, I'm not really sure if i'm interested in purchasing a product like this. Yet I'm very eager to see what happens with it. Despite fragmentation, android as a platform is somewhat of a standard, and I'm sure that, after seeing this, other manufacturers will attempt to launch similar and compatible devices. So, at the end of the day, if just an interesting enough library of console-style games is created for Android, this could as well be a revolution.
  • One of these days someone is going to post a project that generates millions and then not offer a product to market, I have a feeling this might be one of them.

    Sure, someone might be able to slap together an android powered prototype and ship it to project contributors to appease them that "something" was accomplished. Of course the box probably won't work well or as proposed.

    But at what point does a kickstarter project be declared fraud? What are the ramifications of taking millions from contributors and

  • Once the once potentially great console starts to gather momentum , gathering the interests of investors, larger game studios and so forth. Once money is on the cards the ideals of a completely open and hackable console will slowly start to become less important.

    Somebody has to make money from this and to stand a real chance of success it has to have the backing of major game studios. The console will need some killer apps , maybe even exclusive titles. Without it this will end up just a hackers dream. I im

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